|
Post by brightspark on May 26, 2018 14:44:43 GMT
Good decision!!
|
|
blender
Member of DD Central
Posts: 5,719
Likes: 4,272
|
Post by blender on May 26, 2018 15:29:23 GMT
"As a general rule, so long as borrowers are engaged with us and that we believe what we are being told, we will avoid defaulting loans for the above reason. Once we become aware that a borrower is no longer engaged, or that start to doubt what we are being told, we will start default procedures."
On the office wall, perhaps:
"There can be miracles When you believe Though hope is frail Its hard to kill Who knows what miracles You can achieve When you believe, somehow you will You will when you believe"
So romantic. Best not to make this policy too well known to the wrong sort of borrower, who might exploit the gap between believing and knowing. Whitehaven lenders will note, and may ponder about a duty of care.
|
|
adrian77
Member of DD Central
Posts: 3,894
Likes: 4,121
|
Post by adrian77 on May 26, 2018 17:24:47 GMT
True - but there is also a seller's premium of about the same which I would have thought is more relevant!
|
|
mariner
Member of DD Central
Posts: 168
Likes: 338
|
Post by mariner on May 26, 2018 18:16:06 GMT
I said previously that I would report the result of my formal complaint regarding the Chagall painting. The response from FS is as follows: 'In terms of the lack of recovery procedures, so long as we believe we have a reasonable chance of a loan repaying in full, then we will not formally default a loan. Forcing the sale of an asset, and appointing receivers, is an expensive business and immediately puts capital recovery at risk. That is the case here where the buyer’s premium at auction is generally around 20%. As a general rule, so long as borrowers are engaged with us and that we believe what we are being told, we will avoid defaulting loans for the above reason. Once we become aware that a borrower is no longer engaged, or that start to doubt what we are being told, we will start default procedures. ' I have replied as follows: 'I do not intend to take this complaint further. I only have a small amount invested and I have now 'voted with my feet' and sold the majority of my loans on the secondary market. I do understand that forcing the sale of an asset may put capital recovery at risk however, how many times can you believe a borrower telling you that payment will be made in the next week. I think that the Chagall painting was due to be auctioned in early March but was withdrawn from the sale. Surely this is the sort of information that you should be passing on to lenders but there was no mention in the updates. I was intending to make major investments through your platform later in the year but you are so reluctant to provide timely and accurate information that I cannot now do so. Should your practices change I will reconsider, but in the meantime I will invest elsewhere,where lenders are kept updated and appear to be valued.' "Forcing the sale of an asset, and appointing receivers, is an expensive business and immediately puts capital recovery at risk."I am no expert, but surely receivers do not come into this?
Is this not a straightforward pawn loan? If so, I would have though FS could just put the asset into auction & that would be that
|
|
TheDriver
Member of DD Central
Slightly bonkers
Posts: 493
Likes: 190
|
Post by TheDriver on May 26, 2018 18:58:24 GMT
I'd have thought that as pawn lenders FS should be well aware of the intricacies - perhaps they have been traumatised by their property forays. Certainly some of their lenders have been!
My only realised loss as yet is the NI windmill, which I considered totally unacceptable for a secured loan.
|
|
adrian77
Member of DD Central
Posts: 3,894
Likes: 4,121
|
Post by adrian77 on May 26, 2018 19:00:56 GMT
I think the above is the key question which FS are constantly dancing around and not giving us a straight answer. Maybe this borrower has gone into voluntary bankruptcy or similar in order to avoid this being a straightforward situation - I have no evidence for this but just a theory as to what on earth is actually going on here. Funding Secure : err not exactly in my book!
|
|
muxton
New Member
Posts: 4
Likes: 8
|
Post by muxton on Jun 1, 2018 15:28:01 GMT
I have contacted FS repeatedly about the art loans (I am not in all of them) and they confirmed in online chat that Chagall, Lowry, Picasso and Auerbach were all the same borrower but there had been "a delay" in updating all of the overdue loans. I chased again today and was told that they were preparing a number of updates and would ask for the Picasso etching loans to be included.
However, I don't expect this to say anything other than the vague plan for partial repayments over the coming months.
|
|
rogerthat
Member of DD Central
Posts: 2,048
Likes: 1,994
|
Post by rogerthat on Jun 1, 2018 16:36:13 GMT
I have contacted FS repeatedly about the art loans (I am not in all of them) and they confirmed in online chat that Chagall, Lowry, Picasso and Auerbach were all the same borrower but there had been "a delay" in updating all of the overdue loans. I chased again today and was told that they were preparing a number of updates and would ask for the Picasso etching loans to be included. However, I don't expect this to say anything other than the vague plan for partial repayments over the coming months. Interesting to say the least that FS now acknowledge that C,L,P & A are all to the same borrower despite asking countless times myself over many months. It beggars belief (almost) that any responsible organisation can seemingly overlook basic credit risk assessment and compound their naivety by not monitoring the situation closely. Whoever sanctioned this at Stokenchurch needs to ask some serious questions with regard to their suitability for the job. What with the 4 loans above, Microsculptures teetering on the brink and Barnoldswick ending up where every lender predicted, except fundingsecure , this is potentially a very costly lesson for me and no doubt many others.
|
|
muxton
New Member
Posts: 4
Likes: 8
|
Post by muxton on Jun 1, 2018 18:15:02 GMT
Interesting to say the least that FS now acknowledge that C,L,P & A are all to the same borrower despite asking countless times myself over many months. It beggars belief (almost) that any responsible organisation can seemingly overlook basic credit risk assessment and compound their naivety by not monitoring the situation closely. They did explain that (unfortunately) their system cannot list loans by borrower id so this is not straightforward for customer services to check. For example they said they were unaware of any other loans with this borrower but judging by earlier comments above there are at least two more, with the identical "At the moment we expect all loans to be fully repaid within the next 3 months" update and a similar history of false promises to repay or renew: Collection of Vases - Renewal (1179005019) Fine Art - Renewal (3020915407) I make the total amount owed across all those outstanding loans just over £2 million (£2,067,950), and that's before interest. But nothing to worry about chaps, FS "expect all loans to be fully repaid"
|
|
rogerthat
Member of DD Central
Posts: 2,048
Likes: 1,994
|
Post by rogerthat on Jun 1, 2018 19:04:42 GMT
Interesting to say the least that FS now acknowledge that C,L,P & A are all to the same borrower despite asking countless times myself over many months. It beggars belief (almost) that any responsible organisation can seemingly overlook basic credit risk assessment and compound their naivety by not monitoring the situation closely. They did explain that (unfortunately) their system cannot list loans by borrower id so this is not straightforward for customer services to check. For example they said they were unaware of any other loans with this borrower but judging by earlier comments above there are at least two more, with the identical "At the moment we expect all loans to be fully repaid within the next 3 months" update and a similar history of false promises to repay or renew: Collection of Vases - Renewal (1179005019) Fine Art - Renewal (3020915407) I make the total amount owed across all those outstanding loans just over £2 million (£2,067,950), and that's before interest. But nothing to worry about chaps, FS "expect all loans to be fully repaid" Whilst I appreciate you are only relating what you were told..I wont comment further on the bold above because I'll get banned forever. Its nothing to do with customer services..they don't sanction the loans..its further up the food chain where the fault lies
|
|
adrian77
Member of DD Central
Posts: 3,894
Likes: 4,121
|
Post by adrian77 on Jun 1, 2018 19:08:25 GMT
what sort of system have they got in 2018 - Sinclair ZX or nothing so advanced! I find it very hard to believe they can't write a simple programme to do this or they they are even more amateurish than I thought...I worked for a major auction house and such data had to be readily retrieved to check for money laundering if nothing else.
I think the above quotation is a load of horlicks...
|
|
mariner
Member of DD Central
Posts: 168
Likes: 338
|
Post by mariner on Jun 1, 2018 19:29:26 GMT
what sort of system have the got in 2018 - Sinclair ZX or nothing so advanced! I find it very hard to believe they can't write a simple programme to do this or they they are even more amateurish than I thought...I worked for a major auction house and such data had to be readily retrieved to check for money laundering if nothing else. I think the above quotation is a load of horlicks... Totally agree A simple Excel spreadsheet would be enough to generate the information
|
|
r00lish67
Member of DD Central
Posts: 2,691
Likes: 4,048
|
Post by r00lish67 on Jun 1, 2018 19:31:28 GMT
what sort of system have the got in 2018 - Sinclair ZX or nothing so advanced! If only Dizzy had some sort of powerful boat to get that coin. Edit: You'll note that Dizzy is carrying zero coins. That is not a coincidence. However his score of 1000 does continue to accrue.
|
|
mariner
Member of DD Central
Posts: 168
Likes: 338
|
Post by mariner on Jun 1, 2018 19:32:38 GMT
They did explain that (unfortunately) their system cannot list loans by borrower id so this is not straightforward for customer services to check. For example they said they were unaware of any other loans with this borrower but judging by earlier comments above there are at least two more, with the identical "At the moment we expect all loans to be fully repaid within the next 3 months" update and a similar history of false promises to repay or renew: Collection of Vases - Renewal (1179005019) Fine Art - Renewal (3020915407) I make the total amount owed across all those outstanding loans just over £2 million (£2,067,950), and that's before interest. But nothing to worry about chaps, FS "expect all loans to be fully repaid" Whilst I appreciate you are only relating what you were told..I wont comment further on the bold above because I'll get banned forever. Its nothing to do with customer services..they don't sanction the loans..its further up the food chain where the fault lies The fault(s) in my opinion lies with the incompetent directorship of this Company Go back to glue & accountancy is my advice
|
|
dmc1601
New Member
Posts: 4
Likes: 5
|
Post by dmc1601 on Jun 3, 2018 17:21:01 GMT
i suspect the reason for not defaulting what should have been done many moons ago is that FS want to keep the actual default figures as low as possible. They seem to keep giving these loans and there are many so much leniency that this is the only reason i can see for this strategy, after all its not their skin in the game.
|
|