SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Jun 20, 2018 14:17:31 GMT
"An update to Fees As we've grown we've brought bigger and more complex deals to the platform. To date we haven't charged any fees to cover the work necessary to bring these investments to the platform, as we've absorbed this as a marketing cost to establish and scale the business. Where applicable, from 1 July 2018 we'll charge a Sourcing Fee to cover these costs, which may be up to 2% + VAT of purchase price. This fee will be applied per property and clearly identified in the Purchase Costs section of the investment case, and amortised along with other purchase costs over five years."
Er, so what about the 2% transaction fee that we already pay on every investment? From an investor's perspective, this feels very much like a doubling of Property Partner fees on future new properties. I've a feeling my PP portfolio may just have reached its zenith ...
PS. Revaluation frequency is being halved too in parallel, now to be 6-monthly. And I wasn't greatly impressed at yesterday's email floating a move into mortgage bonds and development finance, both at so-so rates; I've enough exposure to established P2P platforms to meet my needs there.
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bigfoot12
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Post by bigfoot12 on Jun 20, 2018 14:27:03 GMT
... this feels very much like a doubling of Property Partner fees on future new properties ... Trebling if you consider that most have a 50% leverage and the new charge is on the purchase price, not just the investment. It will be interesting to see if it applies to all or just the "more complex" ones. I've a feeling my PP portfolio may just have reached its zenith ... Same here.
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Post by sayyestocress on Jun 20, 2018 15:31:15 GMT
It's disappointing, but if the investments still perform then I'll be sticking with it. Their most recent accounts only go up to Dec 2016, but based on them they could do with getting closer to breaking even (in my non expert opinion),I expect these changes will help with that. A sustainable platform with higher fees is better than one on the ropes (not that I am suggesting they're on the ropes) with lower fees for both new and existing investors, even if it can take over a year for the dividends to cover the initial fees...
They seem to be going down the PM route and offering debt based investments. I hope the potential similarities end there! I have two PP properties that may be looking to be sold off early on the opening market. The success (or lack of) will prove a good yardstick on whether to keep investing with PP.
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beh
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Post by beh on Jun 20, 2018 16:04:18 GMT
Er, so what about the 2% transaction fee that we already pay on every investment Indeed, I don't see anything specific as to what the transaction was meant for. Relatively laid back on the move to twice yearly revaluations, fair enough it probably saves them a bit of money. Rather that than charge a "revaluation fee". Similarly not that impressed by the potential new investment types, they should focus on what they do now. Also, minimum investment of £2k? Have they completely given up on small investors? I have two PP properties that may be looking to be sold off early on the opening market. The success (or lack of) will prove a good yardstick on whether to keep investing with PP. I spotted these, how good an offer have PP received for them?
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Jun 20, 2018 16:42:39 GMT
I have two PP properties that may be looking to be sold off early on the opening market. The success (or lack of) will prove a good yardstick on whether to keep investing with PP. I spotted these, how good an offer have PP received for them? Which 2 are they, out of interest? I don't think I can be in either.
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Post by longjohn on Jun 20, 2018 16:47:26 GMT
.... Also, minimum investment of £2k? Have they completely given up on small investors?
Where do they state this, please? The current minimum is £250 and I've not seen anything in the blog or recent emails to change it.
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Jun 20, 2018 16:51:36 GMT
.... Also, minimum investment of £2k? Have they completely given up on small investors?
Where do they state this, please? The current minimum is £250 and I've not seen anything in the blog or recent emails to change it. AIUI, a £2k minimum relates only to the new proposed debt products (in yesterday's email)
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beh
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Post by beh on Jun 20, 2018 16:53:17 GMT
Which 2 are they, out of interest? I don't think I can be in either. Appears to be 4 properties, I don't have them, only spotted by chance after the cladding thing (https://www.propertypartner.co/suspended-halted-property-events). Each just says - "Trading in this property is currently suspended while we consult with shareholders on an opportunity to sell this asset." Where do they state this, please? The current minimum is £250 and I've not seen anything in the blog or recent emails to change it. For the potential mortgage bonds and development finance products.
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Post by longjohn on Jun 20, 2018 16:59:30 GMT
Where do they state this, please? The current minimum is £250 and I've not seen anything in the blog or recent emails to change it. AIUI, a £2k minimum relates only to the new proposed debt products (in yesterday's email)
Ah, I have no email from yesterday. Maybe it was not sent to everyone.
I have today's email with subject - Important: New updates | We’re making some changes
Thanks.
Edit - Just logged in to webmail in case BT had dumped it into the spam folder but spam was empty.
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Jun 20, 2018 17:12:05 GMT
AIUI, a £2k minimum relates only to the new proposed debt products (in yesterday's email)
Ah, I have no email from yesterday. Maybe it was not sent to everyone.
I have today's email with subject - Important: New updates | We’re making some changes IIRC, the SurveyMonkey questionnaire that was attached to it invited respondents to tick how much they might like to invest in each proposed debt product, starting with "<£5000" and going up to some very large numbers indeed. As there was no zero, I had to tick "N/A" !
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beh
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Post by beh on Jun 20, 2018 18:13:48 GMT
Sort of makes sense to only send it to people they assume are capable of affording the minimum. However, I've probably only a couple £hundred in each property on average so £2k is a bit of a leap. As said, just feels like they're increasingly focused on bigger investors. I would be interested to know their current "investor split by current portfolio size", last seen April 2017 - www.propertypartner.co/blog/open-house-april-2017/
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Jun 20, 2018 18:15:25 GMT
Also didnt get yesterdays email on new types so clearly targetted at selected investors (checked spam)
Im in one of the properties being consulted/voted on for early sale. No offer but they are looking to sell for a net 19% return (9% annualised on purchase price) Current rental yield is about 3% which will be unpaid for 3-6 months but current tenacy is coming to an end which is why they are mooting an early exit.
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Post by sayyestocress on Jun 20, 2018 19:17:37 GMT
I spotted these, how good an offer have PP received for them? Which 2 are they, out of interest? I don't think I can be in either. One's a house in hounslow and the other's a flat in Hornchurch,they're at the older end of the PP spectrum. The tenancies are coming to an end and PP reckon they are more valuable than the SM values them so have given us to vote to market them for sale instead of find new tenants as they may be empty for a while anyway. 75% need to vote to sell to put them on the market. The vote ended a couple of days ago but the result hasn't been communicated as yet.
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hazellend
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Post by hazellend on Jun 20, 2018 20:17:33 GMT
I was surprised at the fee increase.
I have bought 3 properties when they offered 5% cashback to me and they are currently offering me another fee rebate.
I would only pay the new fee for a very attractive prospect
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ric
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Post by ric on Jun 21, 2018 12:51:40 GMT
Which 2 are they, out of interest? I don't think I can be in either. One's a house in hounslow and the other's a flat in Hornchurch,they're at the older end of the PP spectrum. The tenancies are coming to an end and PP reckon they are more valuable than the SM values them so have given us to vote to market them for sale instead of find new tenants as they may be empty for a while anyway. 75% need to vote to sell to put them on the market. The vote ended a couple of days ago but the result hasn't been communicated as yet. just received emails that on the 3 properties that I am invested the vote has been to sell the properties. I personally voted against since i believe that in an ideal world all the properties should remain on the platform forever and the secondary market should represent the most efficient and cost effective way to sell your investment. Also, i don't think the discount to valuation was so large to require an anticipated exit, the tenancies probably could have just been renewed and there wasn't a particular negative market view on the sector or region to force an early exit
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