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Post by bracknellboy on Nov 15, 2019 12:20:12 GMT
It could be worse ladies and gents. You could be like me and discover that one of your friends is actually standing for the Brexit Party. Don't worry - by the end of the week he will probably have stood down. Apparently its all the rage to put up candidates and then stand them down.
Oh, it can get worse. You can find out that one of your parents became a fully joined up member of the Conservative party a while back, with view no doubt to ensuring that they "Get Brexit done".
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Nov 15, 2019 15:06:49 GMT
If you were going to nationalise anything I don't know why you'd pick on broadband. IMO telecoms is one of the few Thaterite privatisation success stories. Trains would be high on my list. Might consider water and gas since impossible to have effective competition without multiple redundant pipes going into your house but on the other hand, they can and are regulated which makes them effictively semi-nationalised as it is.
No, I think I'd seriously consider the railways but that's all.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Nov 15, 2019 17:04:39 GMT
It could be worse ladies and gents. You could be like me and discover that one of your friends is actually standing for the Brexit Party. Don't worry - by the end of the week he will probably have stood down. Apparently its all the rage to put up candidates and then stand them down. Too late. Deadline for standing was yesterday - and once the paperwork's in, he's on that ballot paper on the 13th...
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Post by samford71 on Nov 15, 2019 17:56:12 GMT
Never would vote Labour but something has to be done about BTOpenReach. It's effectively a private monopoly in vast swaths of the country which has been receiving huge subsidies from the government. It's rollout of fibre has been way too slow and too expensive. It's decision to use FTTC and FTTP, rather than FTTDP has resulted in large parts of the country being left with FTTC or even ADSL which is simply not fit for purpose in the 21st century. It's crowded out competition from other non-fibre technologies in rural areas where it's clearly not economic to deliver fibre. Either BTOpenreach has to be nationalized or the market needs to be opened up. Allowing private monopolies to exist in an area which is vital to out future economy is not free market capitalism.
As for funding the nationalization, I see no issues at all. The government simply issues 50-year Gilts, current yield 1.17%. The government is being paid to borrow money from the market in real terms. So on the balance sheet it will have bought an asset, paying dividends, funding this purchase at a negative real rate of interest. Win-win.
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Nov 15, 2019 18:28:18 GMT
Never would vote Labour but something has to be done about BTOpenReach. It's effectively a private monopoly in vast swaths of the country which has been receiving huge subsidizes from the government. It's rollout of fibre has been way too slow and too expensive. It's decision to use FTTC and FTTP, rather than FTTDP has resulted in large parts of the country being left with FTTC or even ADSL which is simply not fit for purpose in the 21st century. It's crowded out competition from other non-fibre technologies in rural areas where it's clearly not economic to deliver fibre. Either BTOpenreach has to be nationalized or the market needs to be opened up. Allowing private monopolies to exist in an area which is vital to out future economy is not free market capitalism.
As for funding the nationalization, I see no issues at all. The government simply issues 50-year Gilts, current yield 1.17%. The government is being paid to borrow money from the market in real terms. So on the balance sheet it will have bought an asset, paying dividends, funding this purchase at a negative real rate of interest. Win-win.
stop being rational, as our PM says it's obviously a communist plot.
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Nov 15, 2019 18:32:21 GMT
If you think the tories are "extremists" ( if you describe hard Brexit bas extreme ) well I'd agree, but Lib Dems are extremist they would overturn the result of the referendum without consulting us. Labour badly anti semitic, but also I believe racist ( you could argue that it's the same thing ), but also in wales etc the public feel betrayed by labour who in 2017 said the would deliver Brexit, yet we have labour MPs who constantly voted against it, and a welsh assembly dominated by remainers despite 2/3 of the vote being leave.Personally I believe that we may get a more defined leave electoral pact yet, where tories stand aside to give Brexit party a free run in areas where people could not bring themselves to vote tory but would vote for BP. This could lead to a short term coalition to deliver Brexit and a public vote with 2 options "Bo Jo deal, No deal" I also wonder just how many candidates UKIP will field, because I forsee 20-30 seats where the now tiny UKIP vote could swing things. Now my totally unscientific Poll, I've walked round the village and counted placards in gardens and posters in windows. I've see 0 for Plaid / Lib Dems / Greens, 1 tory, 4 labour and 15 Brexit so on that basis 450 Brexit MP, 120 labour . 30 tory In Wales, of those who voted, 52% in 2016 voted Leave. Where does your 2/3 vote come from?
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Nov 15, 2019 18:52:38 GMT
Where does your 2/3 vote come from? Same place as £350m on a bus?
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daveb
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Post by daveb on Nov 16, 2019 21:14:26 GMT
If I were in the Labour party and anxious to nationalise something, I'd start with the NHS.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Nov 17, 2019 9:42:56 GMT
If I were in the Labour party and anxious to nationalise something, I'd start with the NHS. ...it already is...
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daveb
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Post by daveb on Nov 17, 2019 9:55:55 GMT
If I were in the Labour party and anxious to nationalise something, I'd start with the NHS. ...it already is... Perhaps I should have posted at more length. I meant the massive costs of PFI that are dragging many trusts down, and the costs involved in having private companies tendering for NHS services, with the potential for legal action from the unsuccessful ones. Think of a blend of the railway tendering process and American big pharma companies
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aju
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Post by aju on Nov 17, 2019 10:00:00 GMT
If I were in the Labour party and anxious to nationalise something, I'd start with the NHS. ...it already is... I think he might have been referring to many services that are not exactly free.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Nov 17, 2019 10:28:27 GMT
I meant the massive costs of PFI that are dragging many trusts down Perhaps some of the PFI contracts through the late 90s and early 00s were badly negotiated by the public-sector procurement bodies, yes. Tendering should ensure best value for the work - if that best value is provided by a private provider, then is that a bad thing? Again, of course, it's entirely possible that the public-sector procurement hasn't always been done properly. ...which could well follow from an incompetent procurement process, yes. What people conveniently tend to forget is that primary care - GPs, opticians, dentists - have always been under private-sector contracts, right from the very start of the NHS in 1949. Corbyn's NHS dentistry announcement - everything free! - is just a ludicrous misunderstanding of the real world. The problem isn't paying £22.70 for a check-up and scale every six months. The problem is finding an NHS dentist taking patients on in the first place. www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50448108
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mrk
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Post by mrk on Nov 17, 2019 11:32:25 GMT
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KoR_Wraith
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Post by KoR_Wraith on Nov 17, 2019 13:07:02 GMT
Corbyn's NHS dentistry announcement - everything free! - is just a ludicrous misunderstanding of the real world. The problem isn't paying £22.70 for a check-up and scale every six months. The problem is finding an NHS dentist taking patients on in the first place. www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50448108Scotland has had free dental checkups since 2006 and I can't say I've ever had any problem registering with an NHS dentist in any of the areas where I've lived. Not saying it's the same everywhere but it's certainly not a conversation topic that ever comes up in my experience. Perhaps the supply issue is due to the different way in which NHS England reimburses dentists, which encourages private procedures over NHS treatments: www.lovemoney.com/guides/553/how-to-get-cheaper-dental-treatment
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jonno
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nil satis nisi optimum
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Post by jonno on Nov 17, 2019 13:37:31 GMT
Well I have to say "disaster" wins it for me every time.
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