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Post by dan1 on Jan 20, 2020 20:36:37 GMT
Curious. It looks like I will get another bite at this, which is surprising. Seldom do we get a good solid asset which is actually worth more than the loan at the time of drawdown and presumably will increase in value. Not a pub valued in a few years time assuming it's been knocked down, rebuilt and trade built up for three years. Or stocks of overvalued cars which may not be there when you need the security, or IP which depends for its value as security on the success of the business (all imo). A great big boat in good condition, well insured and in dry dock? I supposed we have had fingers burnt by FS and their unsupervised boating projects. But this is ablrate, and they managed the fishy people ok. Perhaps it is just the 'measly' 13%? <my bold> I'm not so sure it is surprising. Impossible to say what others are reasoning but my guess is if it wasn't *this* borrower or associates that it would have filled/nearly filled prior to the second bite opportunity and that looks unlikely at this stage. After all the loan is tiny compared to the sum of loan amounts on the other assets you mention. Lenders have probably had enough of borrowers who've been around the P2P block a few times and have been burnt (and/or currently on fire) as a consequence.
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blender
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Post by blender on Jan 20, 2020 21:23:54 GMT
Could you give a more exact steer to the relevant part of DDC please? Whoever he is there is no way he can miss a payment for six months, because he is borrowing the interest and the fees. But I would not like to dump on fellow lenders.
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ptr120
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Post by ptr120 on Jan 20, 2020 21:24:17 GMT
I'd have expected some comment from the platform by now on the apparent other loans to other companies with a common director on that, or the lack of security over the properties supposed to provide a potential repayment mechanism.
I suppose the fact that there is 6 months interest on account will provide some short term comfort to some.
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Post by Badly Drawn Stickman on Jan 20, 2020 21:27:34 GMT
Curious. It looks like I will get another bite at this, which is surprising. Seldom do we get a good solid asset which is actually worth more than the loan at the time of drawdown and presumably will increase in value. Not a pub valued in a few years time assuming it's been knocked down, rebuilt and trade built up for three years. Or stocks of overvalued cars which may not be there when you need the security, or IP which depends for its value as security on the success of the business (all imo). A great big boat in good condition, well insured and in dry dock? I supposed we have had fingers burnt by FS and their unsupervised boating projects. But this is ablrate, and they managed the fishy people ok. Perhaps it is just the 'measly' 13%? <my bold> I'm not so sure it is surprising. Impossible to say what others are reasoning but my guess is if it wasn't *this* borrower or associates that it would have filled/nearly filled prior to the second bite opportunity and that looks unlikely at this stage. After all the loan is tiny compared to the sum of loan amounts on the other assets you mention. Lenders have probably had enough of borrowers who've been around the P2P block a few times and have been burnt (and/or currently on fire) as a consequence. I see it as a 'subjective' asset as it is worth what somebody will pay for it and probably has a fairly niche market. I believe it was Lendy that told us the borrower was irreverent and asset value was all that mattered? Not sure that worked out well. Knot one for me (to stick with the nautical pun theme)
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Nomad
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Post by Nomad on Jan 20, 2020 21:31:48 GMT
Curious. It looks like I will get another bite at this, which is surprising. Seldom do we get a good solid asset which is actually worth more than the loan at the time of drawdown and presumably will increase in value.It’s a boat. Personally I would assume the opposite.
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Post by dan1 on Jan 20, 2020 21:35:55 GMT
Could you give a more exact steer to the relevant part of DDC please? Whoever he is there is no way he can miss a payment for six months, because he is borrowing the interest and the fees. But I would not like to dump on fellow lenders. Hi blender, From recent (http://p2pindependentforum.com/posts/recent) stick the borrowers surname into the search box.
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blender
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Post by blender on Jan 20, 2020 21:41:42 GMT
Curious. It looks like I will get another bite at this, which is surprising. Seldom do we get a good solid asset which is actually worth more than the loan at the time of drawdown and presumably will increase in value.It’s a boat. Personally I would assume the opposite. It's in dry dock and some of the money is to be spent on fitting it out. That's why it should increase in value in six months (the expected duration of the loan), imo. (I did not say the valuation was correct and it would be worth more than the stated value - how would I know?)
From the T&Cs:
'4.1 Only borrowers (or the management thereof) with a track record in their industry are permitted to post borrowing requests on Ablrate.' This has been recently changed to add the management. Since the company has been dormant it has no track record and so ablrate are saying that this chap has a track record - presumably a good track record and not one of disasters. Are we sure this person is the same as Mr Dubious? I cannot find much on CH website. The middle name is given in the contract - there are others by the same two names.
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macq
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Post by macq on Jan 20, 2020 22:22:53 GMT
ABL's note on page 15 of docs would tie in with newspaper reports of same name which suggest he has been in the "entertainment" business before
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greenslime
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Post by greenslime on Jan 20, 2020 22:41:29 GMT
Aware of similar operations on the west coast of Scotland that do well. But note that the west coast offers more opportunities for scenic/tailored cruising IMHO, and one of the operations I mention contributes (indirectly) to Greenslime's Retirement (Coke'n'Hookers) A/c No1. You could do it on the east coast, you would just have to try harder. Not exercised about clagging electronics to the boat's masthead IOT track it in the event of loan problems - by the time that becomes a factor your ship has sailed (see what I did there?).
So they can have my minnow contribution.
That said this is one I where, after instant returns are paid, I will be on a short fuse to sell at the first whiff of problems, unlike many ABL loans where I doze happily while collecting my returns.
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blender
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Post by blender on Jan 21, 2020 0:19:40 GMT
Could you give a more exact steer to the relevant part of DDC please? Whoever he is there is no way he can miss a payment for six months, because he is borrowing the interest and the fees. But I would not like to dump on fellow lenders. Hi blender , From recent (http://p2pindependentforum.com/posts/recent) stick the borrowers surname into the search box. Thanks dan1. Ok I see now an outstanding charge through another company to another platform, a platform recently in administration. ablrate can you reassure us firstly that you have been informed and secondly that we need not worry, considering the adverse comments above? It's not a platform I have used, though I might have made the odd adverse comment about their loan supervision from local examples.
'4.1 Only borrowers (or the management thereof) with a track record in their industry are permitted to post borrowing requests on Ablrate.' That is your commitment. What track record?
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Nomad
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Post by Nomad on Jan 21, 2020 1:38:58 GMT
Brokers currently list this model at prices between £330K and £385K.
To charter one in the Med costs from €2200 to €2600 per day, plus 21% VAT.
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nw99
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Post by nw99 on Jan 21, 2020 7:07:20 GMT
Ablrate any comment please likewise alarmed . Hi blender , From recent (http://p2pindependentforum.com/posts/recent) stick the borrowers surname into the search box. Thanks dan1. Ok I see now an outstanding charge through another company to another platform, a platform recently in administration. ablrate can you reassure us firstly that you have been informed and secondly that we need not worry, considering the adverse comments above? It's not a platform I have used, though I might have made the odd adverse comment about their loan supervision from local examples.
'4.1 Only borrowers (or the management thereof) with a track record in their industry are permitted to post borrowing requests on Ablrate.' That is your commitment. What track record?
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Jan 21, 2020 8:18:31 GMT
Brokers currently list this model at prices between £330K and £385K. To charter one in the Med costs from €2200 to €2600 per day, plus 21% VAT. ABL valuation is £415K - that's quite a difference - any reason (age, condition, engines etc) that our vessel would be worth more? At £330K the LTV would be 77% rather than the 61% at £415K.
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Post by ablrate on Jan 21, 2020 9:17:14 GMT
We contacted the borrower's lawyers (who we have dealt with previoulsy on other loans) for comment and we will report back on that and other questions when we have a formal response.
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KoR_Wraith
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Post by KoR_Wraith on Jan 21, 2020 9:29:07 GMT
Some second charges over the proposed properties would be hugely beneficial to this loan, even without formal valuations. Is the valuer able to provide comment as to the price differential between his figure and the £340k average of the vessels listed on www.yachtworld.co.uk/boats/category/type/Apreamare/Maestro+51My non-expert eye can't find any obvious reason, they seem to be comparable spec and comparable engine run time.
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