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Post by westonkevRS on May 22, 2015 14:34:41 GMT
I wanted to confirm a few things, because I know our lenders have a lot of concerns about institutional money. Questions were asked at our "Lenders Drinks" about how this could flood the entire P (or I)2P/B market. Our official position on how if done fairly, sustainable and on equal terms is that institutional money could be a force for good bringing scale and stability. This view can be found on our blogs: > www.ratesetter.com/blog/article/ratesetter_statement_on_the_arrival_of_institutional_money> www.ratesetter.com/blog/article/gaining_depth_and_breadthThe chart is a good indication of our current breakdown, which hasn't changed since the blog was written: But what is really interesting is this article that confirms this position: > www.altfi.com/data/analysis/1001The question " RateSetter is a more retail lender focussed platform?", is certainly yes. Personally I think RateSetter is now the only major P2P company with current lending that is in the majority people based. Having said that, I'm sure the percentages will change as long as this is done on equal terms. It has been announced that we might aim to have up to 30% of lending as " institutional", as this can be a very positive force. It shouldn't matter if someone has £10, £1million or £100billion - they should be in a position to choose their rate and lend as quickly as they so choose. Kevin.
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on May 22, 2015 15:02:49 GMT
It shouldn't matter if someone has £10, £1million or £100billion - they should be in a position to choose their rate and lend as quickly as they so choose.
Splendid!
If PLPFI (Phivenine Ltd Private Finance Institution) decide to lend their million pounds for 5 years at 5.9% we needn't waste time trying to lend at 6.0% or higher, but we are welcome to undercut and lend as quickly as we choose at rates lower than they would be without the institution.
Clarity indeed. I'll make a decision tomorrow what to do with my ninepence ha'penny (and more).
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on May 22, 2015 15:06:06 GMT
It would be nice, when the institutional blocks of money are pumped into the RS pots of cash available for loan, that these are labelled as such so that they can be seen and not be confused with our standard retail funds, or Kev's weekly bonus. For instance, in the situation illustrated below, will RS be (perhaps) holding £100K if institutional money to throw in at 6.5%, which never shows on the lenders side of the chart because the borrowers are already listed? Or even 6.1%, while the retail lender thinks, perhaps that offering his £100 at 6.5% will head the queue and be lent out first. It would be good to know exactly how and when the institutional funds are deployed, and what effect they will have on rates for all investors. We have terms and conditions to look at and can see how lending and borrowing is dealt with. Please can RS show us also the terms and conditions which will be applied to all institutional lenders? Attachments:
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iren
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Post by iren on May 23, 2015 0:11:12 GMT
That's something I hadn't thought of. The sheer volume of institutional money arriving on platform at any particular point, could render the market stats that we all rely on when placing our bids irrelevant.
The problem would be exacerbated if RS had any involvement themselves in deciding when to place the money on to the market, or if institutions were provided with any additional tools or facilities.
Can RS clarify that institutions will operate on the RS platform in the same way as the retail investors, using only the same information, or if not then what additional information/tools/services/facilities will be available to them.
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spiral
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Post by spiral on May 23, 2015 8:20:08 GMT
Well they must have all packed up early for the BH W/E as when I checked at 1745, I had 220K in front of my closest offer (at 6.8%) which was also 2 points behind the then front offer of 6.6% so plenty of scope for anyone to drop money in in front of me but between midnight and 3am, all of my money got matched in what appears to be about 6 different loans (using times of e-mails to differentiate orders going into same loans). I must admit, I find this a very bizarre time of day to be getting so many matches along with the fact that so much was either matched or withdrawn between 6pm and midnight before my money got to the front of the queue. Let's hope they all stick.
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on May 23, 2015 8:30:54 GMT
between midnight and 3am, all of my money got matched in what appears to be about 6 different loans When I looked at the 5 year market yesterday afternoon there were less than 300 matches in the previous 24hrs. This morning there are more than 3000. Somebody must have needed some extra cash for the bank holiday weekend.
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on May 23, 2015 8:41:21 GMT
between midnight and 3am, all of my money got matched in what appears to be about 6 different loans When I looked at the 5 year market yesterday afternoon there were less than 300 matches in the previous 24hrs. This morning there are more than 3000. Somebody must have needed some extra cash for the bank holiday weekend. I though only W*nga were that quick to agree a loan
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jonbvn
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Post by jonbvn on May 23, 2015 8:44:27 GMT
between midnight and 3am, all of my money got matched in what appears to be about 6 different loans When I looked at the 5 year market yesterday afternoon there were less than 300 matches in the previous 24hrs. This morning there are more than 3000. Somebody must have needed some extra cash for the bank holiday weekend. There is currently less than £300k in available in the 5-year market. My last bid at 6.8% was taken overnight.
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on May 23, 2015 8:47:24 GMT
Regarding 6.8% yesterday, I confess that I chickened out earlier in the evening when everything seemed to be grinding to a halt, and made sure of 6.6%, which eventually happened quite late. Next Thursday/Friday rates are going to be "interesting" (unless Kev's predicted publicity stunts cause £2M to crash in at c5.4% ).
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Post by closetotheedge on May 23, 2015 9:13:15 GMT
When I looked at the 5 year market yesterday afternoon there were less than 300 matches in the previous 24hrs. This morning there are more than 3000. Somebody must have needed some extra cash for the bank holiday weekend. There is currently less than £300k in available in the 5-year market. My last bid at 6.8% was taken overnight. aargh! I bottled it and took 6.5% yesterday afternoon. I had been holding out higher but saw the lemmings diving in lower and lower and on the assumption that HQ would put the market rate lump in at 6.5% thought I better abandon my position or risk it getting marooned. Ah well I only have 5 years to rue my foolishness.
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spiral
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Post by spiral on May 23, 2015 9:27:12 GMT
When I looked at the 5 year market yesterday afternoon there were less than 300 matches in the previous 24hrs. This morning there are more than 3000. I must admit, I find these figures pretty pointless as the seem to relate to the number of offers so 1 offer of £10K = 1000 of £10 so a matched loan of £10K could indicate anywhere between 1 or 1000 matches depending on the size of everyone's offers.
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bugs4me
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Post by bugs4me on May 23, 2015 9:43:15 GMT
I don't have a problem with institutions although I confess I used to as they are a demanding bunch of critters. It seems to be the natural evolution with P2P lenders that those institutions get involved.
If/when the rates drop below what I'm comfortable with, or it takes longer to loan funds, etc, etc then I move on.
Institutions (no doubt) promise the earth, moon and stars to the platforms they invest in. No doubt they make commitments they are in it for the long haul so understandably they may get preferential treatment over the platform's original lender base. The definition of 'long haul' in the world of institutions is about 24 hours. So whilst today P2P is the latest fad in their eyes, tomorrow it could be something else and they will move on. Then the platform will be scrambling around for funds as many of their retail lenders will have moved elsewhere.
The P2P platforms are not charities and neither are the institutions. Come to think of it I'm not one either.
Interesting times.
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Post by closetotheedge on May 23, 2015 11:15:32 GMT
I don't have a problem with institutions although I confess I used to as they are a demanding bunch of critters. It seems to be the natural evolution with P2P lenders that those institutions get involved. If/when the rates drop below what I'm comfortable with, or it takes longer to loan funds, etc, etc then I move on. Institutions (no doubt) promise the earth, moon and stars to the platforms they invest in. No doubt they make commitments they are in it for the long haul so understandably they may get preferential treatment over the platform's original lender base. The definition of 'long haul' in the world of institutions is about 24 hours. So whilst today P2P is the latest fad in their eyes, tomorrow it could be something else and they will move on. Then the platform will be scrambling around for funds as many of their retail lenders will have moved elsewhere. The P2P platforms are not charities and neither are the institutions. Come to think of it I'm not one either. Interesting times. Agree totally, institutional investors as long as they are getting what they want will be perfect partners, once demand is outstripped by supply and rates drop then P2P sites may see a different side to them and as 'small fry' we will be discarded. At this point it would be worth larger private investors say £100K+ to start talking collectively. Hmmm what we would need is some kind of forum..............
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on May 23, 2015 14:54:44 GMT
When I looked at the 5 year market yesterday afternoon there were less than 300 matches in the previous 24hrs. This morning there are more than 3000. I must admit, I find these figures pretty pointless as the seem to relate to the number of offers The site says it's the number of matches. Unfortunately my previous request for clarification of what constitutes a match brought less than helpful replies!
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hendragon
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Post by hendragon on May 23, 2015 17:17:32 GMT
At the very least platforms need to rename what they are. P2P is no longer applicable as institutions are neither peers or persons in relation to the borrowers. There is at best misrepresentation and at worst a downright lie in calling this p2p. I would suggest the sites start calling themselves brokers and stop trying to use the goodwill attached to the title p2p.
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