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Post by Financial Thing on Nov 6, 2015 14:59:50 GMT
I was browsing PM documents / share certificates yesterday, thinking that in a worse case scenario PM ceased to exist, what would investor recourse be and do these share certificates really show legal ownership.
I had a chat with PM and they said the documents showing legal ownership are stored on the backend of their website and hard copies in their office. I then asked well what would happen if your company closed its doors, does anyone else have copies of these SPV documents showing who owns what? The rep. wasn't sure of the answer and said they would find out. In theory (my opinion), PM could say, yes you are on the owners documents, but there's no way to verify that being the case right?
It would make me feel less nervous to know a 3rd party of legal office had copies of all ownership docs should the worst happen. I would have thought this would be a given so it goes to show you can't assume anything.
How do others feel about this?
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webwiz
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Post by webwiz on Nov 7, 2015 12:17:57 GMT
Good point. Is it any different from an account with a stockbroker? Paper share certificates have largely been replaced by nominee accounts. If a stockbroker went bust how would shareholders prove that they owned any shares?
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adrianc
Member of DD Central
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Post by adrianc on Nov 7, 2015 13:11:24 GMT
THC email you a share certificate in the limited company (one per project), and the share ownerships can easily be checked on all the usual company check sites. Dead easy to find - "House Crowd Project 321 Limited". I haven't found anything anywhere near as obvious or simple for PM, more's the pity.
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Post by Financial Thing on Nov 7, 2015 13:11:34 GMT
Good point. Is it any different from an account with a stockbroker? Paper share certificates have largely been replaced by nominee accounts. If a stockbroker went bust how would shareholders prove that they owned any shares? Not sure but I imagine the company that you own shares in has some sort of record of who its shareholders are?
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Post by Financial Thing on Nov 7, 2015 13:13:47 GMT
THC email you a share certificate in the limited company (one per project), and the share ownerships can easily be checked on all the usual company check sites. Dead easy to find - "House Crowd Project 321 Limited". I haven't found anything anywhere near as obvious or simple for PM, more's the pity. PM does provide a share certificate in your account. What company check website can you verify through?
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webwiz
Posts: 1,133
Likes: 210
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Post by webwiz on Nov 7, 2015 13:16:36 GMT
Good point. Is it any different from an account with a stockbroker? Paper share certificates have largely been replaced by nominee accounts. If a stockbroker went bust how would shareholders prove that they owned any shares? Not sure but I imagine the company that you own shares in has some sort of record of who its shareholders are? I'm not sure either, but I doubt it. If I hold shares in a nominee account I receive no communications from the company I have shares in and cannot vote at AGMs. On the company's share register my holding will be invisibly bundled up with the other customers of the same broker. I suppose there are regulations covering this point but whether they would be the same for a stockbroker and a p2b platform I have no idea. Maybe PM would comment?
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Post by Financial Thing on Nov 7, 2015 13:22:49 GMT
Not sure but I imagine the company that you own shares in has some sort of record of who its shareholders are? I'm not sure either, but I doubt it. If I hold shares in a nominee account I receive no communications from the company I have shares in and cannot vote at AGMs. On the company's share register my holding will be invisibly bundled up with the other customers of the same broker. I suppose there are regulations covering this point but whether they would be the same for a stockbroker and a p2b platform I have no idea. Maybe PM would comment? Don't you receive shareholder proxy votes from the companies you own shares in? I do from time to time. Plus prospectuses.
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webwiz
Posts: 1,133
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Post by webwiz on Nov 7, 2015 13:28:34 GMT
I'm not sure either, but I doubt it. If I hold shares in a nominee account I receive no communications from the company I have shares in and cannot vote at AGMs. On the company's share register my holding will be invisibly bundled up with the other customers of the same broker. I suppose there are regulations covering this point but whether they would be the same for a stockbroker and a p2b platform I have no idea. Maybe PM would comment? Don't you receive shareholder proxy votes from the companies you own shares in? I do from time to time. Plus prospectuses. No. But maybe it depends on the broker and I use ultra low cost brokers so i don't expect much in the way of service and I would not want to vote anyway.
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webwiz
Posts: 1,133
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Post by webwiz on Nov 7, 2015 13:30:35 GMT
THC email you a share certificate in the limited company (one per project), and the share ownerships can easily be checked on all the usual company check sites. Dead easy to find - "House Crowd Project 321 Limited". I haven't found anything anywhere near as obvious or simple for PM, more's the pity. I looked on the Companies House beta website and found PM's companies immediately. I copied the company number from the share cert to search on. Maybe for safety we should download all the certs from the PM site and store them on our own computers? Edit: Just done that for my current holdings. Must remember to do it each time even if probably not necessary, better safe than sorry.
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adrianc
Member of DD Central
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Post by adrianc on Nov 7, 2015 13:45:27 GMT
PM does provide a share certificate in your account. They do? <wanders off to look> Oh, yeh - found 'em! My Profile -> My Documents. Any that'll show people with your account level shareholder info - f'rinstance CompanyCheck.co.uk then structure tab doesn't require a paid account, others might. Having said all that, shareholdings don't seem to be registered until the first accounts go up. though.
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webwiz
Posts: 1,133
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Post by webwiz on Nov 7, 2015 20:28:10 GMT
Any that'll show people with your account level shareholder info - f'rinstance CompanyCheck.co.uk then structure tab doesn't require a paid account, others might. Having said all that, shareholdings don't seem to be registered until the first accounts go up. though. On CompanyCheck.co.uk you can get a Return of Allotment of shares for £2. What will this show?
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adrianc
Member of DD Central
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Post by adrianc on Nov 8, 2015 9:12:06 GMT
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