adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Jan 5, 2016 22:00:57 GMT
Also the ISA limit isn't currently 15k, it's larger. I've not put figures as I'm not 100% sure of this year or next off the top of my head  £15,240 for 15/16 and for 16/17.
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pikestaff
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Post by pikestaff on Jan 6, 2016 8:20:14 GMT
Link to guidance on ISA transfer rules, for anyone who's still unsure: www.gov.uk/individual-savings-accounts/transferring-your-isaI'm considering swapping around my investments so that my p2p is inside an ISA and my equities are outside. Even with the announced tax changes on dividends and on relief for p2p losses, it will be more tax-efficient this way round. However, there will be switching costs and risks to bear. As a minimum I will have to bear the bid-offer spread on selling my equities and buying them back outside the wrapper (I rather doubt that my broker will offer a special deal to bed-and-de-ISA, but I will ask), plus at least some of my money is going to be out of one or both markets for a period of time. However, I won't be rushing in at the start of the tax year. Partly because I want to wait for things to settle down, but also because rates are more likely to be depressed during the "ISA season". |
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bigfoot12
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Post by bigfoot12 on Jan 6, 2016 8:52:44 GMT
Even with the announced tax changes on dividends and on relief for p2p losses, it will be more tax-efficient this way round. However, there will be switching costs and risks to bear. As a minimum I will have to bear the bid-offer spread on selling my equities and buying them back outside the wrapper (I rather doubt that my broker will offer a special deal to bed-and-de-ISA, but I will ask), plus at least some of my money is going to be out of one or both markets for a period of time. However, I won't be rushing in at the start of the tax year. Partly because I want to wait for things to settle down, but also because rates are more likely to be depressed during the "ISA season". Interesting. I think that over the last 5 years I have earned more on P2P than equities, but over 10 years it would have probably have been the other way round.
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pikestaff
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Post by pikestaff on Jan 6, 2016 9:30:43 GMT
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shimself
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Post by shimself on Jan 6, 2016 12:30:30 GMT
@ ilmoro: Is PISA the P2P ISA (IFISA)? Remember that PISA have a leaning tower - probably not a very good idea to invest in. No sounds excellent to me - looks rocky but actually has been around for years (centuries). Undervalued I suggest.
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Jan 6, 2016 12:34:00 GMT
@ ilmoro: Is PISA the P2P ISA (IFISA)? Remember that PISA have a leaning tower - probably not a very good idea to invest in. No sounds excellent to me - looks rocky but actually has been around for years (centuries). Undervalued I suggest. I'm inclined to agree with you!
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james
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Post by james on Jan 6, 2016 17:44:36 GMT
This is what I understood: I currently have an ISA account with a bank. I was thinking of moving this to a single p2p platform as I thought I could not send it to more than one. Now I am understanding that I can actually create/start/or whatever is called more than one p2p managers, let us say 4 and split what I already have in my ISA bank account on these 4 platforms. On top of that I can add another £15k but only in one account. Is the above correct? Yes. Say you have £10,000 of past year money from say 2013/14 in a cash or S&S ISA today. You could move this to ten different cash or S&S providers if you wanted to. Or 100, picking any amount to go to each. The receiving ISAs may have minimum amounts and restrictions on transfers in if they want, they are not forced to accept transfers. Also with regard to the current year (2016-17) £15k ISA limit, I am understanding that I need to wait for the year (2016-17) to end before I can start moving this around. Can you please let me know if this is correct? You can transfer current year money at any time but if you transfer it, it must be all of the current year money of that type, not part of it. So it must be all of the cash ISA money to a new cash ISA or all of the S&S money to a new S&S ISA. Or cash to S&S or S&S to cash if you want. Just all of it of that type for the current year always being in just one place, not split. So I understood that come April I can open an ISA manager (let us say) with SS, MT and AC if they all offer this new service and then transfer parts of the ISA money which I currently have in an ISA bank account. Am I understanding correctly (at least as things stand at the moment)? Yes, assuming that the normal ISA rules are applied to the new type of ISA. So get your money into this tax year's ISA allowance before the new year starts, to maximise your possible future diversification flexibility.
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ablender
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Post by ablender on Jan 6, 2016 17:53:51 GMT
Thanks james. That was very clear. Now if I am going to put money in my cash ISA account for 2016-17, and I use the same account that I have my "old" money, will they mix up in a way that I will not be able to transfer part of the "old" money? Put in another way, should I open another cash ISA account for 2016-17 (for the 2016-17 money) in order to be able to partly transfer my old ISA money?
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james
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Post by james on Jan 6, 2016 18:16:03 GMT
Thanks james. That was very clear. Now if I am going to put money in my cash ISA account for 2016-17, and I use the same account that I have my "old" money, will they mix up in a way that I will not be able to transfer part of the "old" money? Put in another way, should I open another cash ISA account for 2016-17 (for the 2016-17 money) in order to be able to partly transfer my old ISA money? The ISA provider needs to have some rational way of identifying current year money. It is entirely fine under current rules to put £10k of current year money added to £100k of past year money in the same account and expect to be able to transfer out £10k as current year money. the ISA provider gets to try to decide the value if there have been say portfolio losses or gains on the money, in that case it wouldn't be the amount paid in but the value after gains and losses. For cash ISAs it's relatively easy because it's just accrued interest at stake so the amounts won't vary much from the amount subscribed (new money paid in) in the year. No harm in opening another account since it can make the accounting easier to track, it's just that it isn't required, so no need if you don't want to. You do need to pay attention to whether a provider allows partial transfers out, not all do.
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ablender
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Post by ablender on Jan 6, 2016 18:35:28 GMT
Thanks james. I will check that.
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stevio
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Post by stevio on Jan 6, 2016 19:35:40 GMT
What P2P's have confirmed they will offer an ISA? I thought we would have heard something by now?
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ben
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Post by ben on Jan 6, 2016 20:53:41 GMT
What P2P's have confirmed they will offer an ISA? I thought we would have heard something by now? I think a few had said they are interested but none have confirmed as the rules and regulations or how it will work has still not been published. I would guess Wellesley and Co will do one as they had adverts up previously about it although never had a good look at it
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Post by ian101 on Jan 6, 2016 23:15:50 GMT
Thanks james. That was very clear. Now if I am going to put money in my cash ISA account for 2016-17, and I use the same account that I have my "old" money, will they mix up in a way that I will not be able to transfer part of the "old" money? Put in another way, should I open another cash ISA account for 2016-17 (for the 2016-17 money) in order to be able to partly transfer my old ISA money? The ISA provider needs to have some rational way of identifying current year money. It is entirely fine under current rules to put £10k of current year money added to £100k of past year money in the same account and expect to be able to transfer out £10k as current year money. the ISA provider gets to try to decide the value if there have been say portfolio losses or gains on the money, in that case it wouldn't be the amount paid in but the value after gains and losses. For cash ISAs it's relatively easy because it's just accrued interest at stake so the amounts won't vary much from the amount subscribed (new money paid in) in the year. No harm in opening another account since it can make the accounting easier to track, it's just that it isn't required, so no need if you don't want to. You do need to pay attention to whether a provider allows partial transfers out, not all do. Thanks for the advice here. So if I have, say, £15k in a Fidelity S&S ISA (which does not allow part-transfers out), and £5k each in three separate P2P platforms, and I want to move my P2P investments into IFISAs (but maintain the split across platforms), and maintain my £15k in Fidelity, I would: - transfer the £15k from Fidelity to another cash ISA that does allow part-transfers out - transfer 3 x £5k from the cash ISA into the three P2P platform ISAs (assuming they provide them) - sell my £5k x 3 from P2P and move £15k into a new Fidelity ISA for 2016/17 Would that work? Would I be able to do it all in 2016/17 or are there timing considerations? And any advice for a cash ISA that would allow me to do this? I'd be grateful if anyone can let me know if that makes sense!
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jonah
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Post by jonah on Jan 7, 2016 5:48:54 GMT
ian101 that looks plausible. Most cash ISAs let you have partial transfers. My most recent experience was nationwide and virgin money, but I would suggest a quick read of the relevant t&cs before moving anything. You probably also want to check on withdrawal costs from you S&S ISA as they tend to have them, although all in cash should be more of a token than an issue. you would need to do in the order you outlined so would be out of market for a while. Depending on you S&S providers fees structure you would have costs for the buying and selling.
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james
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Post by james on Jan 7, 2016 6:33:16 GMT
Those transfers would work.
It is possible that the P2P platforms might allow a more convenient way to move money but it does have to be via some sort of sale and buy inside mechanism to comply with current ISA rules, if those aren't modified in some way for P2P to reflect the nature of the investments.
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