ben
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Post by ben on May 6, 2016 13:23:21 GMT
I use both PP and PM (although PM rental yield coud do with improving a bit). I was wondering who used THC and what they thought of it ?
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pom
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Post by pom on May 6, 2016 17:40:45 GMT
I haven't been as keen on them however will soon be getting my first dividend payments so it'll be interesting to compare the performance with PM - until then I know very little about how well my investments are actually doing. They were rented out (and as far as I know still are) tho it took about 3months, and don't know what other costs may have been incurred. Haven't been paying a huge amount of attention to them recently but get the impression they seem to be focussing more on loans than BTL properties at the moment
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ben
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Post by ben on May 6, 2016 23:00:07 GMT
many thanks it seems to be all loans on there at there moment
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pom
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Post by pom on May 10, 2016 9:46:17 GMT
There's a new BTL out now it seems. Thing to watch out for tho is that THC's headline figures are gross whereas PMs are net, and it can make a big difference (eg this new one is headlining as 9.5% gross, but when you download all the docs that's based on the property price not full costs, and by the time everything else is accounted for they're only predicting 5.7% net) which is one of the reasons I'm not so keen on them.
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ben
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Post by ben on May 11, 2016 16:02:59 GMT
There's a new BTL out now it seems. Thing to watch out for tho is that THC's headline figures are gross whereas PMs are net, and it can make a big difference (eg this new one is headlining as 9.5% gross, but when you download all the docs that's based on the property price not full costs, and by the time everything else is accounted for they're only predicting 5.7% net) which is one of the reasons I'm not so keen on them. I think I may skip that one two although might dangle my toe into one of the loans one and see how that goes
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pom
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Post by pom on May 11, 2016 16:07:35 GMT
Well I was talking about generally not being keen rather than this specific loan (tho am also not partaking) - you have to be very careful to read all the small print and not just the headlines, and although I haven't looked at any of the loans that probably goes for them also.
Am surprised no-one else has jumped in on this thread - there used to be quite a few folk with opinions on THC!
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Maestro
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Post by Maestro on May 11, 2016 17:47:56 GMT
Well I was talking about generally not being keen rather than this specific loan (tho am also not partaking) - you have to be very careful to read all the small print and not just the headlines, and although I haven't looked at any of the loans that probably goes for them also. Am surprised no-one else has jumped in on this thread - there used to be quite a few folk with opinions on THC! I invested into a few of their BTL last year, and couple of bridging loan offerings. I usually invest a small amount to keep a tab on the platform, and then decide after a few months whether I want to continue or not. In THC case I decided not to invest any more. As an example, their latest BTL offering shows a purchase price of 120K, total investment including fees of 135K. Same property was offered on the market as 2-bed terraced last year at 80K, and sold for 75K in Sept 2015. THC have added some value by converting one room to bedroom - so its a 3 bed terraced now. Estimated dividend yield after fees if 5.8%. You can do the maths but with these numbers I cant convince myself to invest because personally I dont see this making any money for me in the 3 year term unless house prices shot up in M44 area. 75K to 135K is a big mountain to climb before seeing any capital gain, despite the fact that todays 120K valuation is RICS verified.. But their previous offering with similar numbers sold in no time so what do i know!
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dan16
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Post by dan16 on May 12, 2016 12:02:36 GMT
Thank you for your post. I, too, have done some homework on several of THC's offers going back a while. A simple look on www.nethouseprices.com shows that they were previously sold only a few months before being offered on THC's platform And the offer price is massively inflated over the previous sale price. Even allowing for some refurbishment it seems to be a lot! I have 1 share in an HCP and am waiting to see what happens with it. I also have some bridging loans with them. Also waiting to see what happens with them. If you are thinking of investing with The House crowd I would warn you to do your homework thoroughly and ask the right questions before plunging in.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on May 12, 2016 13:24:16 GMT
I've not tried PP - but am in both THC and PM. I've got more in THC, but that's largely because I found 'em first.
My first few projects are starting to pay their first dividends now, and I'm happy with the returns, although the bare numbers don't look great.
If I look at the XIRR for the projects that've paid a dividend so far, I'm sitting at just over 3.25%. Sounds terrible, but that's with all of the projects having delays in setting up because of refurb, tenant-finding etc. Over the lifetime of the projects, I expect that to be much better, even ignoring capital growth. The more recent projects reduced the THC take, too.
My PM return - currently 5.4% - isn't directly comparable, because those projects haven't had the longer leadtimes of refurbishment. It'll be interesting to see how they compare in a year or so.
By comparison, "real-world" BTL returns are sitting at a figure almost exactly the THC figure, after a longer period, and with a LOT more actual work required... (Anybody want to rent a very nice flat that's currently sitting empty?)
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ahowlin
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Post by ahowlin on Jun 6, 2016 18:52:10 GMT
I've not tried PP - but am in both THC and PM. I've got more in THC, but that's largely because I found 'em first. My first few projects are starting to pay their first dividends now, and I'm happy with the returns, although the bare numbers don't look great. If I look at the XIRR for the projects that've paid a dividend so far, I'm sitting at just over 3.25%. Sounds terrible, but that's with all of the projects having delays in setting up because of refurb, tenant-finding etc. Over the lifetime of the projects, I expect that to be much better, even ignoring capital growth. The more recent projects reduced the THC take, too. My PM return - currently 5.4% - isn't directly comparable, because those projects haven't had the longer leadtimes of refurbishment. It'll be interesting to see how they compare in a year or so. By comparison, "real-world" BTL returns are sitting at a figure almost exactly the THC figure, after a longer period, and with a LOT more actual work required... (Anybody want to rent a very nice flat that's currently sitting empty?) This is pretty much exactly my experience also.
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ben
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Post by ben on Jun 6, 2016 19:44:52 GMT
Dipped my first toe into THC so will see how it goes.
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Homer
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Post by Homer on Jul 12, 2016 14:51:13 GMT
We have invested with THC for about 18 months and PM and PP for about 9 months. The actual rental / dividend returns we have received on investments to date are:
THC: 3.7% p.a. compared to a 5.4% p.a. headline (nett) rate PM: 3.5% p.a. compared to a 5.8% p.a. headline (nett) rate PP: 2.7% p.a. compared to a 3.0% p.a. headline (nett) rate
Note that these are rental payments only as none of our properties have yet been sold. The projected capital appreciation over the minimum terms (of 2, 3 or 5 years) are of course unknown and now dependent upon how Brexit affects the property market, but one would hope to add an additional several percentage points p.a. (nett) on top of the rental returns. All these rates above relate to the start-up year for the properties, so they include the early 'fallow' periods related to property purchase and refurbishment/rebuild time, plus some also have rental voidage. Future years income can be expected to be closer to the advertised headline rates.
The downside of THC versus the other two is that (as has been said before) offers are advertised on headline gross figures; you have to dig deeper to calculate the THC nett figures. THC also typically pays dividends annually (sometimes quarterly for loan notes), whereas PM and PP pay dividends monthly.
THC and PM have no formal secondary market (although I gather THC will help find buyers for shares) , whereas PP does have a formal secondary market, although I have not used it to sell any shares yet.
THC is predominantly active in NW England, PM in NE/NW and the Midlands and PP in London and the SE, but they all seem now to be stretching into wider geographical areas. THC are now offering bridging loans and development loan options in addition to the traditional BTL.
Even after a year or so its difficult to recommend one platform over another. All three seem to try and do a good job and pay when they say they will.
Our conclusion currently is not to try and "pick a winner" but be content to spread the investment across the platforms, which also gives us a geographical spread.
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phil
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Post by phil on Jul 30, 2016 7:54:45 GMT
Has anyone invested in any of their loans? I've read through their website and I can't see what they charge borrowers, do they charge a fee or do they charge a higher rate of interest as most other platforms do?
I can't see the point in investing in any of their buy to lets at a net return of less than 4%, property market drops and you're on a certain loser on your capital.
My current view is that it's better to spread my money with landbay 4%, lendinvest 7%, funding secure, bridgecrowd and collateral at 12%, aiming for an average of around 10%, money is reasonably well diversified over several platforms, invest in 65% LTV maximum and property prices would have to fall in excess of 35% before repossessions would result in capital losses.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Jul 30, 2016 8:38:09 GMT
Has anyone invested in any of their loans? I've read through their website and I can't see what they charge borrowers Borrowers? What borrowers? THC aren't lending money out.
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phil
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Post by phil on Jul 30, 2016 8:59:30 GMT
Has anyone invested in any of their loans? I've read through their website and I can't see what they charge borrowers Borrowers? What borrowers? THC aren't lending money out. For example, the Mile End Road Loan borrowers. "A 9 month secured peer to peer loan, with a comparatively low loan to value (LTV) of just 61%, giving investors added security. This loan took place 13th June 2016. There is still space in it as we underwrote the loan. Please note any funds received post 13th June will have their interest calculation started from the date our solicitor confirms receipt".
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