stevio
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Post by stevio on Oct 30, 2016 12:15:02 GMT
How does that work again? Why only bid what want? Because SS are filling all new loans "bottom up" these days, so the days of gaming the "pro-rata % of what you asked for" allocation process are dead and gone. The only thing that pre-funding more than you want can now achieve is your being allocated more than you want. Thanks, I don't know if I ever have understood it though - what does bottom up actual mean and why wouldn't you achieve anything from pre-funding more?
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Oct 30, 2016 12:24:23 GMT
Because SS are filling all new loans "bottom up" these days, so the days of gaming the "pro-rata % of what you asked for" allocation process are dead and gone. The only thing that pre-funding more than you want can now achieve is your being allocated more than you want. Thanks, I don't know if I ever have understood it though - what does bottom up actual mean and why wouldn't you achieve anything from pre-funding more? Bottom-up means that everybody who asked for £100 or more gets allocated £100. Then everybody that asks for £200 or more gets allocated another £100. Repeat until SS can no longer fill everybody at that request level. Then spread what's left evenly amongst all. So - let's say the loan is big enough to fill all £1000 requests, but not the next level up - £1,500. SS then spread it out, and all those who requested £1,500 or more get <say> £1,250 - even if they requested £1m. But all those who requested £1,000 or less get what they requested in full. No point in gaming. Compare to top-down, where you look at the total pre-fund and the total loan size, and work out the %age. Then EVERYBODY gets that %age - no matter how much or little they requested. So if the pre-fund is twice the loan size, everybody gets 50%. You asked for £100? You get £50. You asked for £1m? You get £500k. Gaming? Bring it on! I want £200, and think it'll be 2x oversubscribed? Then I'll ask for £400!
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Oct 30, 2016 13:35:32 GMT
SS explained the "bottom up" process themselves when they first proposed pre-funding 14 months ago: p2pindependentforum.com/post/58105/thread(After a backlash against the proposal from BHs, they initially went with a "pro-rata %" allocation instead for loans over £1m, before finally switching to their preferred "bottom up" allocation for all loans a few weeks back) |
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Oct 30, 2016 16:35:03 GMT
Bottom-up means that everybody who asked for £100 or more gets allocated £100. Then everybody that asks for £200 or more gets allocated another £100. Repeat until SS can no longer fill everybody at that request level. Then spread what's left evenly amongst all. Close, but I think 'what's left' gets distributed down to a granularity of £10 per punter (at least for small loans), and then what's still left after that gets put onto the SM in one lump for FFF. For large loans the granularity may be bigger (£100, or £500 even), just so whatever reaches the SM at the end of the day isn't too ridiculously large.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Oct 30, 2016 20:11:56 GMT
My allocation £4000... oops.....only expected £1500 or so. Why on earth did you ask for £4000 then? To be fair, he didn't say he didn't want £4000. He simply said he expected £1500. And if he doesn't want all he was allocated he can dispose of the excess quickly enough via the SM. Besides, we need people who put in large pre-funding requests. That's the easiest way to find out what the maximum allocations are! And it probably won't be very long before cooling_dude updates his pre-funding info table to reflect this new info.
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poppyland
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Post by poppyland on Oct 31, 2016 6:27:48 GMT
Still no interest accrued on my 2 day old £3000 loan part for this, and interest rate still marked as 0%. Hope they get it all sorted out and backdated today.
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ablender
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Post by ablender on Oct 31, 2016 7:12:29 GMT
The people who are reporting 0%, may I ask if you are in negative balance?
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ganymede
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Post by ganymede on Oct 31, 2016 7:47:47 GMT
The people who are reporting 0%, may I ask if you are in negative balance? Did say I had a negative balance and still do. Just checked this morning and the problem has been corrected. Show £1.64 interest, and expanded to show loan part I see 9.96%. Still not correct as loan itself shows 9.9996% so lost some 0.0396%, if only displaying to 2dp it should be 9.99%. For now £1.64 is correct amount, over the year it makes £1.19 difference or over 182days term £0.59.
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Oct 31, 2016 8:04:32 GMT
Maybe SS are halfway thru implementing the oft requested 'no interest until you pay', which would obviate the need for the 7 day lock?
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Oct 31, 2016 8:09:08 GMT
For now £1.64 is correct amount, over the year it makes £1.19 difference or over 182days term £0.59. On what size holding? Since I've earned 27p on my £500 holding, it sounds like that 59p difference is on a holding of six grand or so, right?
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ganymede
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Post by ganymede on Oct 31, 2016 8:38:37 GMT
For now £1.64 is correct amount, over the year it makes £1.19 difference or over 182days term £0.59. On what size holding? Since I've earned 27p on my £500 holding, it sounds like that 59p difference is on a holding of six grand or so, right? Holding size is £3000. For £500 it's about 10p difference. >>> 0.0396/100.0*182/365*500.00 0.09872876712328768 >>> 0.0396/100.0*182/365.25*3000.00 0.5919671457905545 rounds to £0.10 and £0.59
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am
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Post by am on Oct 31, 2016 9:07:21 GMT
The people who are reporting 0%, may I ask if you are in negative balance? No.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Oct 31, 2016 9:39:21 GMT
On what size holding? Since I've earned 27p on my £500 holding, it sounds like that 59p difference is on a holding of six grand or so, right? Holding size is £3000. D'oh. Six times £500 is £3k, not £6k, isn't it? Monday morning.
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twoheads
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Programming
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Post by twoheads on Oct 31, 2016 9:50:08 GMT
Maybe SS are halfway thru implementing the oft requested 'no interest until you pay', which would obviate the need for the 7 day lock? The 'no interest until you pay' solution would complicate their software. I assume they have implemented a very simple 'loan part' on which the interest can be calculated based simply on the value, age and A.P.R. However, if some loan parts were purchased and not paid for (fully or in part) then the interest would no longer be calculable in this simple way. The administration concerning interest would become less transparent within their system.
However: a different solution (which would have required very little software effort if all loans were still 12%) would be for SS to charge interest of 12% on the negative balance. This would exactly balance any interest that is 'unfairly' gained on loans which have not yet been paid for. Of course now, with different loans having different APRs, this calculation (while still fairly simple) is no longer trivial.
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sl75
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Post by sl75 on Oct 31, 2016 10:38:33 GMT
The 'no interest until you pay' solution would complicate their software. I assume they have implemented a very simple 'loan part' on which the interest can be calculated based simply on the value, age and A.P.R. However, if some loan parts were purchased and not paid for (fully or in part) then the interest would no longer be calculable in this simple way. The administration concerning interest would become less transparent within their system. "No interest until you pay" can be implemented perfectly well with such a simple loan part... it merely needs to determine the "age" (or rather the "start date" on which the age is calculated) based on the date on which the loan part was paid for, rather than the date on which the loan part was created. I'd expect that to be far simpler than your alternative of keeping track separately of each lender's negative balance each day in order to charge 12% interest on it (together with additional legal complications of needing a formal loan agreement to allow the charging of that 12% interest). Loan parts already have various status flags to allow for "live", "repaid", "selling", "sold", etc. (with the 4 mentioned visibly broken down into separate sub-sections of "my loans"). It would seem quite a simple task to create an extra status / section for "unpaid loanparts" or "reserved loanparts" or whatever they should be called, and whenever someone receives money into their account, trigger a process to determine which of the unpaid loan parts are now considered to have been paid for, transferring them to "live" with today's date as the start date. I can only assume that the reason SS continue to avoid creating a "no interest until you pay" mechanism is that their systems currently do not find out when you paid for a loan part until the following working day (when someone gets round to [manually?] crediting the account), potentially leading to negative situations where someone has actually paid for the loan part by transferring money the same day, but SS systems treat it as unpaid and withhold the interest. If or when SS implement a mechanism to allow "real time" (or at least same-day) processing of credits to our accounts, I'd expect "no interest until you pay" to follow soon afterwards.
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