stevio
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Post by stevio on Jan 18, 2017 13:27:43 GMT
So in summary, in my copious notes on how platforms work , I put: Ablrate confirmed interest amounts sent to HMRC consist of: - Accrued interest
- Interest paid
- Instant returns are NOT included
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Post by ablrate on Jan 18, 2017 13:31:26 GMT
So in summary, in my copious notes on how platforms work , I put: Ablrate confirmed interest amounts sent to HMRC consist of: - Accrued interest
- Interest paid
- Instant returns are NOT included
Correct
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gt94sss2
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Post by gt94sss2 on Jan 18, 2017 14:00:24 GMT
Apologies - not read the whole thread but when one says that "Accrued interest" is included in the figures Ablrate supply to HMRC... I understood that personal taxpayers only need to declare 'interest paid' not 'accrued' to HMRC?
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stevio
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Post by stevio on Jan 18, 2017 14:18:35 GMT
So in summary, in my copious notes on how platforms work , I put: Ablrate confirmed interest amounts sent to HMRC consist of: - Accrued interest
- Interest paid
- Instant returns are NOT included
Correct Having thought about it, I understand accrued interest received from sales being included in the figure for interest sent to HMRC, but do you also deduct the accrued interest paid for purchases when sending your figures to HMRC ?
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blender
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Post by blender on Jan 18, 2017 15:26:35 GMT
Not wishing to put words in Ablrate's mouth but I understand that Accrued Interest and Interest Paid refer to the entries in your account history. Accrued interest is an actual payment made to you by a purchaser for the interest accrued against a sold loan part. And Interest Paid is the full monthly interest payment (or quarterly or whatever periodicity or on repayment) actually paid to you directly by a borrower (without any deductions). I am not sure how that five year loan with rolled up interest is handled, but I will not be buying any to find out.
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stevio
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Post by stevio on Jan 18, 2017 15:46:48 GMT
Not wishing to put words in Ablrate's mouth but I understand that Accrued Interest and Interest Paid refer to the entries in your account history. Accrued interest is an actual payment made to you by a purchaser for the interest accrued against a sold loan part. And Interest Paid is the full monthly interest payment (or quarterly or whatever periodicity or on repayment) actually paid to you directly by a borrower (without any deductions). I am not sure how that five year loan with rolled up interest is handled, but I will not be buying any to find out. Yes, thats fine for accrued interest from sales, but here www.ablrate.com/FAQs/View.aspx?id=75a6e0b4-0a80-443b-af9f-5eb8a2d5cbf9 it says that accrued interest paid from purchases can be offset against interest received (my underlining) Seller: Where a seller of loans receives interest, paid by the incoming buyer for a sale, for the period within the month, that interest would attract tax as per the normal interest on a primary trade.
Buyer: Where a buyer pays interest to the seller for the period the loan has been held the buyer is entitled to relief on the amount paid, offset against the interest received on the following payment date. Where the payment straddles a tax year, the payment can be offset against previous interest earned.
Therefore the amounts for interest sent to HMRC should have accrued interest from sales added, but ALSO accrued interest from purchases deducted
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blender
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Post by blender on Jan 18, 2017 16:02:57 GMT
Stevio, the word 'may' in bold precedes that text, and Ablrate's reporting seems to have taken the cautious view. Whatever we think Ablrate should have reported, I think Ablrate have said what they have reported. They have said that they include the Interest Paid amounts, and have said nothing about any reduction for accrued interest we may have purchased. That amount is not even identified in our account history. Ablrate are not going to send a complete new file to HMRC and ask them to review the tax accounts of all Ablrate lenders - even if they thought that justified. You have to declare what you think is correct. What we need for 2016-7 is at least our Account Histories updated so that we have the purchased accrued interest itemised, and therefore the information to declare what we think is right for us as individuals.
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Jan 18, 2017 16:05:05 GMT
My accrued interest for 2015-2016 is only £9 something, so I will include that in my declaration (or should I?). I just hope that doesn't get included again in my actual interest earned figures for 2016-2017 (or does it?).
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stevio
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Post by stevio on Jan 18, 2017 16:13:21 GMT
Stevio, the word 'may' in bold precedes that text, and Ablrate's reporting seems to have taken the cautious view. Whatever we think Ablrate should have reported, I think Ablrate have said what they have reported. They have said that they include the Interest Paid amounts, and have said nothing about any reduction for accrued interest we may have purchased. That amount is not even identified in our account history. Ablrate are not going to send a complete new file to HMRC and ask them to review the tax accounts of all Ablrate lenders - even if they thought that justified. You have to declare what you think is correct. There shouldn't be a 'cautious view', there should be a "black and white" view ie the correct view! I have come to the conclusion Ablrate are unsure themselves what to report and hence their candour Which leaves us in the position we were 6 pages back, unclear!
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archie
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Post by archie on Jan 18, 2017 16:24:15 GMT
I think tax statements are an area the FCA should have influence over, so we get a clear picture from all platforms.
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blender
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Post by blender on Jan 18, 2017 16:34:21 GMT
Stevio, the word 'may' in bold precedes that text, and Ablrate's reporting seems to have taken the cautious view. Whatever we think Ablrate should have reported, I think Ablrate have said what they have reported. They have said that they include the Interest Paid amounts, and have said nothing about any reduction for accrued interest we may have purchased. That amount is not even identified in our account history. Ablrate are not going to send a complete new file to HMRC and ask them to review the tax accounts of all Ablrate lenders - even if they thought that justified. You have to declare what you think is correct. There shouldn't be a 'cautious view', there should be a "black and white" view ie the correct view! I have come to the conclusion Ablrate are unsure themselves what to report and hence their candour Which leaves us in the position we were 6 pages back, unclear! I think your second sentence is right, and the lack of clear advice from their advisors comes through in the FAQ. For me it is important that the Ablrate who assesses the loan opportunities to be presented to us is very cautious and careful about those things, and I might be worried if the same Ablrate took a punt on the tax position, against the expert advice, and declared figures on a basis which might leave a contingent tax liability. We can report something different as individuals, but I do need to data for 2016-7. I am happy that I believe I know what Ablrate has reported for 2015-6, and it's all done and dusted for me personally. Edit: sorry thought previous post had not made it. Deleted and replaced.
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Post by ablrate on Jan 18, 2017 17:46:05 GMT
Hi Guys
Just formulating the downloadable tax statement and have the gubbins done. Rather than us creating what we think is the best format (for the layout) for you is, can someone send me a PM with the best example of a layout you have or how you would prefer it and we will do that.
Regards Ablrate
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james
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Post by james on Jan 18, 2017 18:37:13 GMT
Hi Guys Just formulating the downloadable tax statement and have the gubbins done. Rather than us creating what we think is the best format (for the layout) for you is, can someone send me a PM with the best example of a layout you have or how you would prefer it and we will do that. There's a comprehensive one in this post: p2pindependentforum.com/post/156338/threadItems 4 and 5 don't apply to 2015-16 so should be skipped for that year. No defaults so they can't apply.
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blender
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Post by blender on Jan 18, 2017 19:31:36 GMT
Not skipped but included as net zero, presumably.
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james
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Post by james on Jan 18, 2017 21:07:38 GMT
Yes, either way works.
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