09dolphin
Member of DD Central
Posts: 630
Likes: 856
|
Post by 09dolphin on Jun 26, 2017 10:54:35 GMT
I can see progress between the last 2 sets of pictures. There is now mesh fencing between the site and the pavement. Obviously this is what the "contractors on site" have spent the past 2 weeks doing.
However if it has taken 2 weeks to put a few easily portable fence panels in place it doesn't auger well for the actual clearing of the site and rebuilding to be completed. Perhaps a century at this pace? OK I was always the optimist.
|
|
SteveT
Member of DD Central
Posts: 6,873
Likes: 7,918
|
Post by SteveT on Jun 26, 2017 11:01:16 GMT
I can see progress between the last 2 sets of pictures. There is now mesh fencing between the site and the pavement. Obviously this is what the "contractors on site" have spent the past 2 weeks doing.
However if it has taken 2 weeks to put a few easily portable fence panels in place it doesn't auger well for the actual clearing of the site and rebuilding to be completed. Perhaps a century at this pace? OK I was always the optimist. Nope, the first of ali's photos of 11th June clearly show the Heras fencing was already there. I suspect the other 3 were taking hard up against the fence, through a gap in the mesh.
|
|
09dolphin
Member of DD Central
Posts: 630
Likes: 856
|
Post by 09dolphin on Jun 26, 2017 13:00:26 GMT
Oh Steve you do dash a girls hopes.
So there is no discernible progress despite a couple or 3 weeks work since the contractors have been on site. I change my estimate for completion of the development to 2500 as I still feel optimistic. Please note my estimate is based on the progress made since the contractors have been on site.
|
|
rs
Member of DD Central
Posts: 467
Likes: 254
|
Post by rs on Jun 26, 2017 18:51:27 GMT
I will soon have an ISA account and will continue with a non-ISA account for the time being. I suppose a good strategy going forward would be to put prime loans in the ISA, and riskier loans in the non-isa account so that any defaults can then be written off against taxable income. That is a good idea. I hadn't thought of that. Will start doing that but what happens if the loans don't default in non isa account.
|
|
rs
Member of DD Central
Posts: 467
Likes: 254
|
Post by rs on Jun 26, 2017 18:54:31 GMT
I will soon have an ISA account and will continue with a non-ISA account for the time being. I suppose a good strategy going forward would be to put prime loans in the ISA, and riskier loans in the non-isa account so that any defaults can then be written off against taxable income. That is a good idea. I hadn't thought of that. Will start doing that but what happens if the loans don't default in non isa account. shame FS are not communicating properly with lenders on this loan. I think a few words with p2p review sites like will get some positive communications from FS.
|
|
r1200gs
Member of DD Central
Posts: 1,336
Likes: 1,883
|
Post by r1200gs on Jun 28, 2017 8:24:29 GMT
Late last week I was going to write a post asking what the site looked like now the contractor had been there a week, but then I stopped myself. FS didn't say he'd be there a week.
I then convinced myself that no way would FS do this to us again, they must have sought evidence that the borrower was actually getting work done. But still, a nagging doubt.
On Saturday I missed the update saying that work is continuing.
Now we have recent evidence that absolutely sweet FA has been done and that despite all FS know, they are STILL not monitoring this borrower and they are still passing misleading information if not flat out lies to their lenders.
We are still looking at nothing more than a partially cleared demolition site and a list of warm and fuzzy updates and tranches suggesting work is well underway.
FS....What does this borrower have to do, or not do, before you stop doing this? I'm embarrassed for you!
|
|
agent69
Member of DD Central
Posts: 5,591
Likes: 4,182
|
Post by agent69 on Jun 28, 2017 9:08:21 GMT
Their lack of communcation on this loan speaks a thousand words,if that's possible Realistically what do you expect them to say? No doubt there has been a major cock up here, but if they say " sorry we gave the borrower £500k without bothering to check what was happening on site" then they would open themselves up to awkward questions and possible legal action (I assume). Better to keen quiet and hope all comes good in the end.
|
|
r1200gs
Member of DD Central
Posts: 1,336
Likes: 1,883
|
Post by r1200gs on Jun 28, 2017 9:26:03 GMT
Their lack of communcation on this loan speaks a thousand words,if that's possible Realistically what do you expect them to say? No doubt there has been a major cock up here, but if they say " sorry we gave the borrower £500k without bothering to check what was happening on site" then they would open themselves up to awkward questions and possible legal action (I assume). Better to keen quiet and hope all comes good in the end. You're right about one thing, better to keep quiet than keep doing this and I wish the hell they would! I expected the "sorry, we cocked up" type answer (in slightly different terms) when they first realised that the borrower was spinning them a yarn and FS realised we knew, but they CONTINUE to tell us that contractors are on site and works are continuing when they clearly are not, and they STILL are not checking what the borrower tells them. I can forgive them being fooled once and passing the borrowers nonsense on to us, but to be aware the borrower is doing this and to continue to provide updates that have nothing to do with reality is already opening FS up to the legal action you mention. Yes, say nothing, stop feeding us BS! Seriously, I'm waiting for the next cheery update saying works going well, and the next tranche release to pay for snagging, internal decoration and marketing followed by another picture of a half cleared building plot... This is beyond ridiculous and sadly, through my own bad management, I've just realised I had more than I thought in this loan on another account. Legal action you say? Well, should I lose money on this, I won't be taking it laying down.
|
|
09dolphin
Member of DD Central
Posts: 630
Likes: 856
|
Post by 09dolphin on Jun 28, 2017 10:19:16 GMT
As has already been suggested how difficult is it for FS to ask for a picture each week from the developer asking for photographic evidence of progress?
|
|
|
Post by charliebrown on Jul 2, 2017 0:11:28 GMT
Not specific to this loan, nor specific to FS, but it seems to me that due to poor practice, perhaps due to lack of scale and lack of resources, p2p platforms are a soft target for fraud and/ or skulduggery.
There's been lots of cases of wildly inaccurate valuations, total lack of due diligence, poorly managed loans, poorly managed defaults, useless/ deceitful updates and borrowers with incredibly shady pasts.
i can't see any happy ending to this particular loan. FS have shown major flaws and weaknesses.
|
|
09dolphin
Member of DD Central
Posts: 630
Likes: 856
|
Post by 09dolphin on Jul 2, 2017 3:00:45 GMT
I agree I can't see a happy ending for this loan. Personally I think FS have been "scammed" into providing funds for a civil court case without sufficient equity to support the amount lent, even at 100% LTV. Exactly why FS supported and offered loans after the initial loan is unclear as they only had assertions that work had been completed. but FS choose not to share this sort of information.
According to FS a court case was won a some time ago and the borrower agreed to pay the loan and interest from their successful action which they obviously have not.
Because the loan obviously significantly exceeds the sum lent FS cannot even consider defaulting this loan without them potentially suffering a serious loss.
What action should they take? Should it be similar to the "Jock boatyard" where FS accept every statement the borrower makes without question and they hope for the best? Should it be classed as "unredeemed" even though the equity is obviously totally inadequate? Should they continue to post meaningless updates in the hope that the borrower may eventually repay the loan? Perhaps FS think investors will lose interest if they continue to post inaccurate updates and hope that investors have lost interest?
I'm sure there are other options but I can't think of any others. What action should FS take regarding this loan?
|
|
mikes1531
Member of DD Central
Posts: 6,452
Likes: 2,320
|
Post by mikes1531 on Jul 2, 2017 11:07:47 GMT
According to FS a court case was won a some time ago and the borrower agreed to pay the loan and interest from their successful action which they obviously have not. I think we need to remember that winning a court case and receiving payment from the resulting judgement are two different events -- often separated by a considerable time. Do we know whether the borrower actually has received any payout from the successful case yet? Because the loan obviously significantly exceeds the sum lent ... 09dolphin: ? ? ?
|
|
|
Post by charliebrown on Jul 2, 2017 11:18:56 GMT
According to FS a court case was won a some time ago and the borrower agreed to pay the loan and interest from their successful action which they obviously have not. I think we need to remember that winning a court case and receiving payment from the resulting judgement are two different events -- often separated by a considerable time. Do we know whether the borrower actually has received any payout from the successful case yet? Because the loan obviously significantly exceeds the sum lent ... 09dolphin : ? ? ? According to the FS updates the borrower hasn't yet won the court case, it's been adjourned. I'd also agree that winning a court case and receiving the compensation monies are not the same thing, no guarantees at all, I also find the court case a totally irrelevant smoke screen. Even if monies are received by the borrower will he hand them over to pay off this loan? Seems a long shot at best. This loan is pure incompetence by FS. It proves that any scammer can scam FS without much hard work.
|
|
r1200gs
Member of DD Central
Posts: 1,336
Likes: 1,883
|
Post by r1200gs on Jul 2, 2017 11:34:17 GMT
I think we need to remember that winning a court case and receiving payment from the resulting judgement are two different events -- often separated by a considerable time. Do we know whether the borrower actually has received any payout from the successful case yet? 09dolphin : ? ? ? According to the FS updates the borrower hasn't yet won the court case, it's been adjourned. I'd also agree that winning a court case and receiving the compensation monies are not the same thing, no guarantees at all, I also find the court case a totally irrelevant smoke screen. Even if monies are received by the borrower will he hand them over to pay off this loan? Seems a long shot at best. This loan is pure incompetence by FS. It proves that any scammer can scam FS without much hard work. With the exception of my "not available for sale" parts, my entire portfolio on both accounts is for sale and mostly sold already. I did think about going through them all very carefully, but decided to lose the lot. I wouldn't say I would never lend here again, but if I ever do it will have to be a very good loan indeed. As to the court case, I said some time back that I knew somebody who won a case and years later still didn't have the money. I don't know if he ever got it. Regardless, as has been pointed out already, we loaned against security for a building project and that loan was never to exceed 70 of the value of the security. We did not lent to fund legal action in the hope we get paid out from the proceeds of a court case. five tranches, the last one sold on the basis that the project was going well with the foundations down. And we have a nearly cleared hole in the wall. And despite FS knowing full well that they have been fed a pack of lies and knowing they have some very unhappy lenders, FS have continued to pass on updates from the borrower without checking if they are true or not. That is disgraceful. Latest one being that the contractor is on site followed by works continuing. I have £1500 in this FS, and I better get it back.
|
|
sb
Posts: 166
Likes: 118
|
Post by sb on Jul 2, 2017 12:46:18 GMT
I agree I can't see a happy ending for this loan. Personally I think FS have been "scammed" into providing funds for a civil court case without sufficient equity to support the amount lent, even at 100% LTV. Exactly why FS supported and offered loans after the initial loan is unclear as they only had assertions that work had been completed. but FS choose not to share this sort of information.
According to FS a court case was won a some time ago and the borrower agreed to pay the loan and interest from their successful action which they obviously have not.
Because the loan obviously significantly exceeds the sum lent FS cannot even consider defaulting this loan without them potentially suffering a serious loss.
What action should they take? Should it be similar to the "Jock boatyard" where FS accept every statement the borrower makes without question and they hope for the best? Should it be classed as "unredeemed" even though the equity is obviously totally inadequate? Should they continue to post meaningless updates in the hope that the borrower may eventually repay the loan? Perhaps FS think investors will lose interest if they continue to post inaccurate updates and hope that investors have lost interest?
I'm sure there are other options but I can't think of any others. What action should FS take regarding this loan?
I think FS should a) stop repeating lies and share full info it has with lenders b) let the lenders decide the next step (it would be useful to have some non-public forum to discuss the situation) c) compensate lenders for mistakes it has made I doubt they will do this as this scenario doesn't fit their "business model". If the lenders don't take any action then most likely the loan will be carried in this state for years until FS closes business or by some luck the borrower pays the loan off. I think it would be useful to start asap the official complaint procedure so that in eight weeks time the complaint can be referred to the Financial Ombudsman Service.
|
|