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Post by Butch Cassidy on Jan 23, 2017 10:09:52 GMT
This firm basically hires vans/cars at airports & the like; growing very fast, turnover doubled in latest figures & has a good credit score, no great borrowings due to leasing the vehicles & looks at decent enough proposition for a D band @ 17.9%.
I bought some 28819 yesterday at par for a long term hold, today a "repay & refinance notice" (same risk band just for a larger sum), perhaps it's just coincidence that a large amount found it's way onto the SM at par the day before the announcement - I wouldn't suggest that FC was insider trading or any favoured "bot clients" were given the nod  but interestingly it was also payment day, so when the new loan, 31412 is drawn it will repay 28819 with nearly another full months interest as a bonus, so I have taken advantage of this fortuitous timing & absorbed the rest of my spare cash for a 1.5% gain in a couple of days - obviously not investment advice but gifthorse & mouth spring to mind.
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acky
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Post by acky on Jan 23, 2017 11:27:07 GMT
This firm basically hires vans/cars at airports & the like; growing very fast, turnover doubled in latest figures & has a good credit score, no great borrowings due to leasing the vehicles & looks at decent enough proposition for a D band @ 17.9%.
I bought some 28819 yesterday at par for a long term hold, today a "repay & refinance notice" (same risk band just for a larger sum), perhaps it's just coincidence that a large amount found it's way onto the SM at par the day before the announcement - I wouldn't suggest that FC was insider trading or any favoured "bot clients" were given the nod but interestingly it was also payment day, so when the new loan, 31412 is drawn it will repay 28819 with nearly another full months interest as a bonus, so I have taken advantage of this fortuitous timing & absorbed the rest of my spare cash for a 1.5% gain in a couple of days - obviously not investment advice but gifthorse & mouth spring to mind. Well bought, Butch. I was one of those who dumped a load of 28819 on the market at par yesterday - I'm not an insider or recipient of a nod, but was too much exposed to carry through the risk of a (non?)repayment date! I also spotted the comment this morning and cursed myself for missing out on the likely extra month's interest! Thankfully I kept some 28819! I agree the business looks good by FC's normal D standards (surprised it's not A+ really), except that I don't think I trust a business that borrows £x and then 2 months later goes back for another £100k. I've bought into 31412, but you'll be able to buy that from me soon!!
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voss
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Post by voss on Jan 23, 2017 11:30:15 GMT
When you recently bought 28819 (launched on 23/11/16, I think) at par, did you not have to pay about a month's interest to the seller? Not sure where your 1.5% comes from?
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acky
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Post by acky on Jan 23, 2017 11:59:41 GMT
1.5% comes from the fact that FC's 'state of the art' IT systems are incapable of paying any interest less than one month. So if a borrower repays a loan mid-month, a full month's interest is paid. As the new loan was listed today, the assumption is that it will repay the old loan on which one month's additional interest will have to be paid - not sure it will though in this case because the repayment date of the old loan is today, so as long as they can get the new loan drawndown and the old loan repaid today, there should be no need to pay the additional interest.
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Post by Butch Cassidy on Jan 23, 2017 12:13:28 GMT
When you recently bought 28819 (launched on 23/11/16, I think) at par, did you not have to pay about a month's interest to the seller? Not sure where your 1.5% comes from? Whilst it is true that I paid virtually a month's worth of interest to acky - thanks for the kind gift BTW the borrower then repaid it to me on time last night, the very risk that the seller wasn't willing to take in this instance; When loans are repaid early on FC they are usually paid upto the next payment day & being nearly a month away that roughly equates to 17.9/12 = 1.5% so effectively 2 full monthly payments over a couple of days holding, albeit the first was paid away to buy the holding risk.
As I said previously this was a buy to hold purchase, so the repayment day was largely irrelevant, except that it provide a risk averse seller the chance to dump at par & me a buying opportunity. It is simply a quirk of fate that circumstances have given me the opportunity for what can only be described as a no brainer for some easy money, given that I was happy to take the risk of holding & any potential non payment.
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blender
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Post by blender on Jan 23, 2017 18:53:00 GMT
I'm not sure they are going to do this. 31412 is live and 28819 is up for sale still on the SM for 0.4% premium. I thought of investing another £1000 and making a few, but I think it is in limbo. If I were the borrower and made a payment for the due date (payment made in advance) then I would not be expecting to pay an extra month's interest for repayment on the very same day - zero extra days borrowed. So I think you will get nowt - but hope you have a birthday present. I already hold £600 of 28819 and so will share the windfall - or not. We do get rare windfalls. I remember when FC sold off one of its property interventions at a 3% discount, and I made over £100. These bright spots help.
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nick
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Post by nick on Jan 24, 2017 10:24:20 GMT
I see that 28819 is still trading on the SM following the repayment on the 23rd and despite 31412 being accepted. Maybe they aren't going to use the funds to settle the original loan........
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blender
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Post by blender on Jan 24, 2017 10:44:07 GMT
Yes, you are right. Both loans were live yesterday and are still live today, and interest will have been accrued today (a game changer). On paper the borrower has live loans of over £400k and is accruing interest for that - which is not sensible. On these replacements the original outstanding amount is usually deducted by FC and repaid, while the balance after fees goes forward to the borrower. I wonder if FC have mis-operated (sorry, suffered a technical error) and have just given the full amount to the Borrower. If so, how long will it take them to find out and how will they fix it, bearing in mind the contractual rights of the 28819 lenders, like me and Butch, and acky? You don't mess with the Sundance Chameleon, let alone with the whole wild bunch..
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nick
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Post by nick on Jan 24, 2017 11:04:32 GMT
I was tempted to hoover up the loan parts on offer at par yesterday and even the ones currently at a 0.3% mark-up on the basis of imminent repayment and one months interest, but decided not to let greed to get the better of me! It is strange that they let the existing loan continue to trade given they actually warn/state that it is likely to be imminently refinanced. I thought their standard policy was to suspend the SM for loans that in the process of being refinanced - maybe I'm getting confused with RebS?
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acky
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Post by acky on Jan 24, 2017 14:17:48 GMT
I was very tempted to hoover up as well. And just went back to have another think about it, and I find 28819 has been repaid - together with a full month's interest! D**n - should have got the hoover out!
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Post by Butch Cassidy on Jan 24, 2017 14:30:02 GMT
nick & acky I thought my posts had made the position crystal clear?
On the downside FC have managed to lose just shy of £200 of my due repayment so I guess you win some you lose some!!!!
Edit: Spoke too soon - the balance is just trickling through now; Now the major problem - what to reinvest in? as any decent E seems to be getting refinanced
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blender
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Post by blender on Jan 24, 2017 14:51:48 GMT
I gave in to greed once it became clear that they could no longer repay it yesterday, and used the available funds to buy at +0.4%. I already had £600 from the start because it also looked good to me. So about 1.5% on that and 1% on a larger chunk. I suppose it's not much more than a £20 note, but it all counts. Thank you Butch for the tip. I think FC has corrupted me.
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Post by betterthanworking on Jan 24, 2017 17:10:24 GMT
I also had a small hoover after the end of office hours yesterday  . Thanks Butch for the heads up. There was something else odd about this affair. The replacement loan, 31412, had a very large amount of £20@par available on the secondary market just after the loan closed. Either there is a bot programmed to loose 0.25%, or 'the management' bought up part of what was a pretty large loan to ensure it filled by end of day, with the intention of avoiding paying the extra month's interest. |
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acky
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Post by acky on Jan 24, 2017 17:15:25 GMT
nick & acky I thought my posts had made the position crystal clear?
On the downside FC have managed to lose just shy of £200 of my due repayment so I guess you win some you lose some!!!!
Edit: Spoke too soon - the balance is just trickling through now; Now the major problem - what to reinvest in? as any decent E seems to be getting refinanced Ok, Butch, you are allowed to be smug. After all, it's not as though FC have ever failed to do what they say they'll do ....... oh, hang on a minute!
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acky
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Post by acky on Jan 24, 2017 17:16:44 GMT
I also had a small hoover after the end of office hours yesterday . Thanks Butch for the heads up. There was something else odd about this affair. The replacement loan, 31412, had a very large amount of £20@par available on the secondary market just after the loan closed. Either there is a bot programmed to loose 0.25%, or 'the management' bought up part of what was a pretty large loan to ensure it filled by end of day, with the intention of avoiding paying the extra month's interest. Well there was loads of +0.3% available minutes before the loan repaid, so none of your hoovers are up to much - you should get a Dys*n!
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but interestingly it was also payment day, so when the new loan, 31412 is drawn it will repay 28819 with nearly another full months interest as a bonus, so I have taken advantage of this fortuitous timing & absorbed the rest of my spare cash for a 1.5% gain in a couple of days - obviously not investment advice but gifthorse & mouth spring to mind.
. Thanks Butch for the heads up.