Godanubis
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Anubis is known as the god of death and is the oldest and most popular of ancient Egyptian deities.
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Post by Godanubis on Jan 15, 2020 14:53:53 GMT
"Very low levels compared to the capital"? The capital is £899,500k. What are we talking about? £150k or something?
Our favourite valuers, Hard** ***ck, reckoned this acre was worth £1.8m. I reckon a lot of investors thought this one would be safe as houses, lending at just under 50% LTV. You Sir should go top of the class..an update just in says that an exact offer has been accepted..original valuation £1.8m 9 mins ago "Appointed receivers Av***n Y***g have received and accepted and offer of £150k. Given the anticipated shortfall, we are considering options that may be available to compensate this position."
An utter disgrace..the 'valuers' ought to be brought to book I think a few here would buy at 10% of valuations why was it not put to current investors ?
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on Jan 15, 2020 15:02:19 GMT
well I got that one wrong (again)- this is silly £900K lent against a plot valued at £1.8m and sold for £150K! Even so I think this is under-priced (may be wrong but £150k for an acre!) Some developer here is a damn sight smarter than I am!
Assuming HB aren't sued what are we talking about £100K out of £900K recovered viz 11%?
Question/discussion point for the CC - why the hell has this one not been put to auction with a reserve of say £160K if reached then sold at auction else sold to this buyer - this really does not strike me as the administrators acting in our interests!
Don't forget "organic growth - it's a process !"
I need a drink...
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rocky1
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Post by rocky1 on Jan 15, 2020 15:02:57 GMT
dont forget though further secured by a PG.suppose thats worth sod all, more fool me for falling for all this fintech platform/borrower BS.
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rogerthat
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Post by rogerthat on Jan 15, 2020 15:08:08 GMT
You Sir should go top of the class..an update just in says that an exact offer has been accepted..original valuation £1.8m 9 mins ago "Appointed receivers Av***n Y***g have received and accepted and offer of £150k. Given the anticipated shortfall, we are considering options that may be available to compensate this position."
An utter disgrace..the 'valuers' ought to be brought to book I think a few here would buy at 10% of valuations why was it not put to current investors ? Well if this is indicative of whats to come then perhaps a valid question to ask the Creditor Committee ?...8.3% realisation of valuation ! Was the 1st offer accepted ?..will CG & Co pursue the RICS valuers..did the receivers consult with CG & Co prior to accepting the offer ?
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on Jan 15, 2020 15:21:33 GMT
damn good point - for £150K I would be tempted myself!
Have carefully read the black pencil valuation - the below looks like a golden get-out clause to me if planning has not been formally approved - I guess it is just about possible the borrower was not exactly honest about the actual position and FS never checked !
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pfffill
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Post by pfffill on Jan 15, 2020 16:00:24 GMT
Certainly looks a perfect get-out clause. I'd be more inclined to ask what the hell were FS doing, offering such a colander-investment to their mugs investors - us - and what were we doing walking lemming-like towards the cliff?
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on Jan 15, 2020 16:07:06 GMT
just seen the FS DD thread about this one - it seems the buyer only paid about £125K so if planning has not been approved then £150K is about right! I am in this one and I don't think the FS notes about the planning were exactly accurate- tell you what I think - FS or rather "we" have been had yet again! Be interested if we can ask the administrators just what has happened with the planning process.
FS valued this one at £1.8m so I assumed there was planning so I feel cheated ...
Some people may think this borrower is a wide boy as he has other fantastical developments e.g. Tower Block , H*** rd etc but I could not possibly comment - why the hell did FS lend to multiple speculative schemes - oh I forgot they are seasoned property experts...
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ozboy
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Mine's a Large One! (Snigger, snigger .......)
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Post by ozboy on Jan 15, 2020 16:33:28 GMT
Certainly looks a perfect get-out clause. I'd be more inclined to ask what the hell were FS doing, offering such a colander-investment to their mugs investors - us - and what were we doing walking lemming-like towards the cliff?FS were trusted. In the early days. [EDIT: I mean, they were "vetted" by the FCA. ] Until it became blatanly obvious they couldn't be trusted. At ALL.
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crazi
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Post by crazi on Jan 15, 2020 17:43:21 GMT
£150k !!!! Definitely one we should get the lawyers on retention to follow up. I'm thinking we need to get some action now to show all the administrators we will take legal action if they continue to scr*w us over like this...
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kielbasa
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Post by kielbasa on Jan 15, 2020 17:49:20 GMT
£150k !!!! Definitely one we should get the lawyers on retention to follow up. I'm thinking we need to get some action now to show all the administrators we will take legal action if they continue to scr*w us over like this... The loan update on 31 July 2019 said: "The only interest in purchasing the property has been at very low levels compared to the capital." We were warned. It's been up for sale for the best part of a year. I think the main problem is just a massive overvaluation in the first place.
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iRobot
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Post by iRobot on Jan 15, 2020 18:25:54 GMT
Not in this as Dev loans were a founding member of my 'Avoid' list, so took the option not to renew. Does the information released to lenders make mention of whether the Administrators or their agents considered obtaining PP of their own in an attempt to elevate the value of the land? (My notes for an earlier iteration mention " plot forming part of the new Wirral Waterfront Regeneration Scheme" - so there presumably would be appetite for some kind of development assuming the WWRS had been radically altered in the intervening period.) If not, that maybe something the CC ( Mucho P2P) might want to raise as a query. Specifically for this one and generally for future loans - ie what length are the Administrators prepared to go to to increase value? Apply for PP (Outline of Full)? Finish off partially completed developments? etc. etc.
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rocky1
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Post by rocky1 on Jan 15, 2020 19:08:10 GMT
i feel the administators are prepared to do as little as possible for as much as possible and whatever else they can legally get away with on top of that.they will do whatever they want and move on to the next FSs cock ups.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Jan 15, 2020 19:16:39 GMT
what length are the Administrators prepared to go to to increase value? Apply for PP (Outline of Full)? I suspect the answer to the first question is 'pretty minimal'.
I presume that obtaining PP for a big project like envisioned here would require a fair amount of funding for design, etc. Where would that money come from? There'd obviously be a risk that PP wouldn't be granted quickly and that appeals, etc. would be needed by the proposers or result from unhappy objectors.
Administrators aren't known for happily letting administrations be extended for these sort of reasons or for taking risks like that. And I suppose creditors aren't too keen on long administrations either, since the longer they go on the more they cost.
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Mucho P2P
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Post by Mucho P2P on Jan 15, 2020 20:27:20 GMT
Not in this as Dev loans were a founding member of my 'Avoid' list, so took the option not to renew. Does the information released to lenders make mention of whether the Administrators or their agents considered obtaining PP of their own in an attempt to elevate the value of the land? (My notes for an earlier iteration mention " plot forming part of the new Wirral Waterfront Regeneration Scheme" - so there presumably would be appetite for some kind of development assuming the WWRS had been radically altered in the intervening period.) If not, that maybe something the CC ( Mucho P2P ) might want to raise as a query. Specifically for this one and generally for future loans - ie what length are the Administrators prepared to go to to increase value? Apply for PP (Outline of Full)? Finish off partially completed developments? etc. etc. I do not believe that the administrators will seek planning permission for any plots. As for finishing off partly completed plots, there is a group of HNW investors seeking to form an entity that will consider finishing off the partially completed developments. My understanding (to date) from the administrators, is that they will still seek to dispose of the partly finished developments without taking on additional risk to themselves or the lenders. These points are being monitored by the CC for any future updates or change in direction from the administrators.
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crazi
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Post by crazi on Jan 15, 2020 20:40:47 GMT
Is it not legal requirement that FS had to have "Professional Indemnity Insurance" - normally in the very high millions. Surely we can sue FS also where they have been blatantly irresponsible like with this loan?
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