elliotn
Member of DD Central
Posts: 3,063
Likes: 2,681
|
Post by elliotn on Jul 31, 2017 12:38:36 GMT
And how might this impact the chances of refinance / sale? We do not just ask platforms to tell us of a valuer's opinion, we look at the reasoning for it. The yield has changed substantially, the valuation far less and we cannot externally test reasonableness as we do not know the expected revised yield. If some investors deemed the valuation to be toppy they can reduce exposure in case a materially less valuable asset was disposed of in a forced auction or, given the size, distressed private sale. Hopefully this never arises but it's the basis I invest on and need to see the opining to do it.
|
|
|
Post by settersam on Jul 31, 2017 13:27:52 GMT
Yes. A typical deliberately misleading "illustration" to support a sensationalist headline, showing a graph where the price (apparently) drops almost 100% to "the bottom" ... but doesn't actually show the bottom three quarters of the graph down to zero on the vertical axis. We were warned about this practice in the 1950s in year one maths classes at the grammar school. Definitely not intended to be "deliberately misleading", there would be no purpose in me doing that. I just thought that the performance of the investment trust may be worth looking into when doing our DD. The timescale was accidental - just the default provided by the FT page - unfortunate but not deliberate.
|
|
oldgrumpy
Member of DD Central
Posts: 5,087
Likes: 3,233
|
Post by oldgrumpy on Jul 31, 2017 13:59:50 GMT
Yes. A typical deliberately misleading "illustration" to support a sensationalist headline, showing a graph where the price (apparently) drops almost 100% to "the bottom" ... but doesn't actually show the bottom three quarters of the graph down to zero on the vertical axis. We were warned about this practice in the 1950s in year one maths classes at the grammar school. Definitely not intended to be "deliberately misleading", there would be no purpose in me doing that. I just thought that the performance of the investment trust may be worth looking into when doing our DD. The timescale was accidental - just the default provided by the FT page - unfortunate but not deliberate. Not getting at you in particular, as I didn't realise you had generated the chart; just the practice of showing a small "convenient" part of the full graph to further a point being made.
|
|
n
Member of DD Central
Yet another Nick
Posts: 879
Likes: 461
|
Post by n on Jul 31, 2017 14:06:52 GMT
Just try saying 'Statistical misrepresentation' after a couple of brandies - it's fun!
|
|
registerme
Member of DD Central
Posts: 6,212
Likes: 6,021
|
Post by registerme on Jul 31, 2017 14:13:44 GMT
And how might this impact the chances of refinance / sale? We do not just ask platforms to tell us of a valuer's opinion, we look at the reasoning for it. The yield has changed substantially, the valuation far less and we cannot externally test reasonableness as we do not know the expected revised yield. If some investors deemed the valuation to be toppy they can reduce exposure in case a materially less valuable asset was disposed of in a forced auction or, given the size, distressed private sale. Hopefully this never arises but it's the basis I invest on and need to see the opining to do it. Sorry elliotn, I think we got our wires crossed there. I wasn't asking you.... ".. and how might the points you raise be important", I was asking MoneyThing "... and how might the prospective change in legislation impact the chances of refinance, sale, or other exit route", in other words I was agreeing with you / supporting you .
|
|
stub8535
Member of DD Central
personal opinions only. Not qualified to advise on investment products.
Posts: 1,442
Likes: 945
|
Post by stub8535 on Jul 31, 2017 16:14:13 GMT
Definitely not intended to be "deliberately misleading", there would be no purpose in me doing that. I just thought that the performance of the investment trust may be worth looking into when doing our DD. The timescale was accidental - just the default provided by the FT page - unfortunate but not deliberate. Not getting at you in particular, as I didn't realise you had generated the chart; just the practice of showing a small "convenient" part of the full graph to further a point being made. Nothing wrong with presentation. Axes and units are clearly marked which makes interpretation straightforward. 8% drop in price is significant. Hopefully Sophie gets the document she is waiting for and can post it on the loan this afternoon about the valuation so investors may run the data against their own risk reward b4 tomorrow.
|
|
oldgrumpy
Member of DD Central
Posts: 5,087
Likes: 3,233
|
Post by oldgrumpy on Jul 31, 2017 16:48:28 GMT
Not getting at you in particular, as I didn't realise you had generated the chart; just the practice of showing a small "convenient" part of the full graph to further a point being made. Nothing wrong with presentation. Axes and units are clearly marked which makes interpretation straightforward. 8% drop in price is significant. Yes, clearly marked but selectively illustrated to make it appear more like an 80% drop than an 8% one (which closer examination will reveal) - purely to grab attention.
|
|
agent69
Member of DD Central
Posts: 5,625
Likes: 4,195
|
Post by agent69 on Jul 31, 2017 16:51:49 GMT
maths classes at the grammar school. Posh boy
|
|
oldgrumpy
Member of DD Central
Posts: 5,087
Likes: 3,233
|
Post by oldgrumpy on Jul 31, 2017 16:54:15 GMT
The riff-raff used to call us grammar-grubs.
|
|
stub8535
Member of DD Central
personal opinions only. Not qualified to advise on investment products.
Posts: 1,442
Likes: 945
|
Post by stub8535 on Jul 31, 2017 17:01:32 GMT
Play nicely children! Take your point oldgrumpy but always showed my students to illustrate the graph correctly and use descriptives for emphasis. Didn't get the chance at grammar as totally lacked interest in education in childhood. No stopper to academic achievement though.
|
|
|
Post by yorkshireman on Jul 31, 2017 17:47:19 GMT
maths classes at the grammar school. Posh boy Nothing wrong with grammar schools in the 1950’s and 60’s when they were an excellent means of social mobility for many youngsters like me from working class backgrounds although I’ve got to admit that I personally did not take full advantage of the academic opportunities available at the time. However, the grammar schools of today whether it’s those which are still run by local authorities or the fee paying variety are a totally different type of school, mostly attended by children from financially comfortable backgrounds.
|
|
|
Post by sannytwist on Jul 31, 2017 18:24:29 GMT
This loan is a interesting one, in my short time of p2p investing l have learned the most from this loan for sure. Credit must be given to this forum, alot of really experienced investors here with alot of valuable insight.
|
|
ozboy
Member of DD Central
Mine's a Large One! (Snigger, snigger .......)
Posts: 3,156
Likes: 4,830
|
Post by ozboy on Jul 31, 2017 18:31:54 GMT
Oh yes, there's some VERY Bright Sparks contributing on here all the time that's for sure, and for their postings I am always truly grateful. I'm learning all the time and try to reciprocate when I can with my modest "Inputs" as and when I feel I won't make a t*t of meself!!!
|
|
stub8535
Member of DD Central
personal opinions only. Not qualified to advise on investment products.
Posts: 1,442
Likes: 945
|
Post by stub8535 on Jul 31, 2017 19:45:04 GMT
Hmmf! ozboy sometimes its difficult to know how to take your self deprecating humility and shyness. You know your contributions are always enjoyed for being usually direct and cutting through bs as is an admirable trait in your countryment and womens dna. Always good to get an alternative cultures viewpoint.
|
|
|
Post by martin44 on Jul 31, 2017 19:55:52 GMT
Oh yes, there's some VERY Bright Sparks contributing on here all the time that's for sure, and for their postings I am always truly grateful. I'm learning all the time and try to reciprocate when I can with my modest "Inputs" as and when I feel I won't make a t*t of meself!!! Which you did last week (ish) Edit,, Darn!! And so did i as well a while back.
|
|