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Post by elephantrosie on Aug 27, 2017 0:50:32 GMT
Apart from the recent defaulted loan, as an investor of MT, i am requesting MT to be transparent and provide us with a list of loans that they have been paying out of pocket.
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elliotn
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Post by elliotn on Aug 27, 2017 4:57:54 GMT
Exactly what I was going to ask. MoneyThing will you as a matter of urgency confirm which of our live loans serviced by borrowers: - have had late payments; - have had payments paid for by Moneything; - are still in arrears. Merseyside storage updates via Support should act as a very useful template for future late payments. Many thanks. |
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Post by geraldine1210 on Aug 27, 2017 7:13:42 GMT
Ed said that occasionally interest payments run a couple of days late due
to unforseen circumstances.
He said they have been happy to give that grace period.
That seems reasonable.
If the grace period is, for example, two days, I think any updates to us should happen after this period of tolerance.
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elliotn
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Post by elliotn on Aug 27, 2017 8:05:30 GMT
Ed said that occasionally interest payments run a couple of days late due to unforseen circumstances. He said they have been happy to give that grace period. That seems reasonable. If the grace period is, for example, two days, I think any updates to us should happen after this period of tolerance. I disagree. If the borrower has paid two days late we need to know about it. If it's because of a glitch with the bank or a non-working day then that should be explained to us. We certainly need some kind of substantiation of how many payments MT make on behalf of borrowers to allow investors to make their own assessment of platform impact. Check out AC, abl, this is not difficult and should be basic compliance to provide this transparency to the investors of these loans and for potential buyers to be able to quickly appraise the borrower's repayment history.
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averageguy
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Post by averageguy on Aug 27, 2017 11:30:54 GMT
Ed said that occasionally interest payments run a couple of days late due to unforseen circumstances. He said they have been happy to give that grace period. That seems reasonable. If the grace period is, for example, two days, I think any updates to us should happen after this period of tolerance. I agree ..I don't want to be distracted by those type of loans
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robski
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Post by robski on Aug 27, 2017 12:33:26 GMT
Ed said that occasionally interest payments run a couple of days late due to unforseen circumstances. He said they have been happy to give that grace period. That seems reasonable. If the grace period is, for example, two days, I think any updates to us should happen after this period of tolerance. I disagree. If the borrower has paid two days late we need to know about it. If it's because of a glitch with the bank or a non-working day then that should be explained to us. We certainly need some kind of substantiation of how many payments MT make on behalf of borrowers to allow investors to make their own assessment of platform impact. Check out AC, abl, this is not difficult and should be basic compliance to provide this transparency to the investors of these loans and for potential buyers to be able to quickly appraise the borrower's repayment history. You don't NEED to know about it, you WANT to know about it
I don't feel the need to know about every minor issue that happens
All I can see is that a big and over the top reaction will happen to a minor issue, causing disruption and panic on the forums, and SM on the platform.
Lets see the post-mortem on the 2 administrations and then people can decide if there is enough smoke to warrant a fire being lit.
Funds are often late being remitted in the real world, due to so many factors, often the issue is quickly and easily resolved.
And lastly and almost more importantly for me is that I prefer to see loans that repay frequently as it allows the things to see more visibility, if the platform gets a rep for having over reactive investors that's bad and the other solution could be people want to move to bullet type repayments as they are no repayments to be late until it could go horribly wrong at the end.
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elliotn
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Post by elliotn on Aug 27, 2017 12:48:31 GMT
I disagree. If the borrower has paid two days late we need to know about it. If it's because of a glitch with the bank or a non-working day then that should be explained to us. We certainly need some kind of substantiation of how many payments MT make on behalf of borrowers to allow investors to make their own assessment of platform impact. Check out AC, abl, this is not difficult and should be basic compliance to provide this transparency to the investors of these loans and for potential buyers to be able to quickly appraise the borrower's repayment history. You don't NEED to know about it, you WANT to know about it
I don't feel the need to know about every minor issue that happens
All I can see is that a big and over the top reaction will happen to a minor issue, causing disruption and panic on the forums, and SM on the platform.
Lets see the post-mortem on the 2 administrations and then people can decide if there is enough smoke to warrant a fire being lit.
Funds are often late being remitted in the real world, due to so many factors, often the issue is quickly and easily resolved.
And lastly and almost more importantly for me is that I prefer to see loans that repay frequently as it allows the things to see more visibility, if the platform gets a rep for having over reactive investors that's bad and the other solution could be people want to move to bullet type repayments as they are no repayments to be late until it could go horribly wrong at the end.
Non-repayment by borrowers will be a primary indicator of future default. The investors funding these loans should know about these late payments. Why do you think other platforms provide the transparency of their borrowers' monthly payments?
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robski
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Post by robski on Aug 27, 2017 13:06:55 GMT
Your grossly simplifying I am afraid
I will quote my other half here who is a credit manager of many years "not worried about the people who repeatedly pay a little late, the ones we worry about are the ones who's payment pattern gets worse"
In the real world as already said people pay late. I work for a multi billion pound turnover co, we pay every single invoice for every single supplier late.
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james100
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Post by james100 on Aug 27, 2017 13:18:46 GMT
Non-repayment by borrowers will be a primary indicator of future default. The investors funding these loans should know about late payments. Why do you think other platforms provide the transparency of their borrowers' monthly payments? I agree with this 100%. Late payment / default history is absolutely a material fact for me in choosing to a) invest and b) hold. Ablrate do it well and the full transparency makes it easy to assess if it were a one-off or casual/slipping payment pattern....no dramas and if you don't want to use that bit of info then don't. For a 70% LTV, I definitely need it....for a 50% LTV, not bothered. I'm sure everyone has their own tolerance parameters and that's fine. But knowing I can trust a platform to convey all material facts relating to a loan is really important (if I want it to remain a major platform for me). I like MT (my biggest p2p pot is here) and am prepared to wait for the "post-mortem" on L***S***A*** (not that I have any choice with that loan any more  ) however to hold current investments, I would like confirmation that none are effectively in "secret default". If they are, it would be good to know any mitigating circs etc then people can care or not care as they please. Thanks as always to Ed and the Things for listening and communicating, it's very much appreciated.
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elliotn
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Post by elliotn on Aug 27, 2017 13:22:12 GMT
I worked in audit and international investment finance all my life. This is still a new industry trying to build its credibility as a form of finance. If a platform hides late payments - and staying in the real word this hasn't been defaulted on day one of a missed payment - investors must know about non-performing loans to manage their investment risks.
Edit - crossed with James100.
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seeingred
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Post by seeingred on Aug 27, 2017 13:48:46 GMT
I really do think one has to separate put the glitches and bank errors from the real cases of non-payment.
Couple of days grace is surely OK and doesn't need to be notified. As has been said, many businesses pay invoices late - indeed have a policy of doing so.
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elliotn
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Post by elliotn on Aug 27, 2017 13:59:01 GMT
I really do think one has to separate put the glitches and bank errors from the real cases of non-payment. Couple of days grace is surely OK and doesn't need to be notified. As has been said, many businesses pay invoices late - indeed have a policy of doing so. Agreed, investors can quite easily take in on AC and abl one-off late payments for technical issues (although the discipline of recording them still offers a good precedent). That shouldn't sidetrack us from where there has been previous non-payment requiring default on payment day - this is the non-reporting that must be addressed.
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r00lish67
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Post by r00lish67 on Aug 27, 2017 14:43:36 GMT
I err on the side of being informed of such things, perhaps not as forcefully as some, but regardless is this not already a MoneyThing commitment under the current terms and conditions?
Section 12.1:
"If a Borrower misses a payment on a Loan or only partially pays the amount due to you as a
Lender Member, you authorise us, acting on your behalf, and we undertake to, contact the
Borrower to attempt to collect an amount equivalent to the outstanding payment and any
additional fees and charges due under the relevant Loan Contract. We will keep you informed
of the progress of the attempts to collect the outstanding payment(s)"
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robski
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Post by robski on Aug 29, 2017 11:19:42 GMT
I worked in audit and international investment finance all my life. This is still a new industry trying to build its credibility as a form of finance. If a platform hides late payments - and staying in the real word this hasn't been defaulted on day one of a missed payment - investors must know about non-performing loans to manage their investment risks. Edit - crossed with James100. Without turning this into a game of top trumps, during the last recession I was FD of an FTSE company and working as supply to construction I saw a hell of a lot of companies that had never missed a payment go poof and take people for lots of money. Equally there were companies then who were a pain to get monies out of even during the good times, they still exist today as I see their vans about. I don't disagree that one of the potential signs of a company or individual having issues is missed payment(s), what I disagree with is that we should urgently need to find out the day the payment is late. There needs to be a reasonable time frame whilst MT contact the borrower and identify the simple facts, as they have demonstrated if there is an issue as far as they are concerned they will act.
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robski
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Post by robski on Aug 29, 2017 11:23:46 GMT
I err on the side of being informed of such things, perhaps not as forcefully as some, but regardless is this not already a MoneyThing commitment under the current terms and conditions? Section 12.1: "If a Borrower misses a payment on a Loan or only partially pays the amount due to you as a Lender Member, you authorise us, acting on your behalf, and we undertake to, contact the Borrower to attempt to collect an amount equivalent to the outstanding payment and any additional fees and charges due under the relevant Loan Contract. We will keep you informed
of the progress of the attempts to collect the outstanding payment(s)"I'm slightly concerned about this, this is the 3rd time in the last couple of weeks that there seems to be a difference in whats being done / proposed to be done vs the new T&Cs. I think MT need to check and refine their T&Cs to ensure that they are being followed. As far as notification of missed payments, I suggest 3 working days is a good balance to filter out the noise that may well happen with a borrower who leaves it to the last minute and misses bank cut off and other similar very short term issues, before MT notify lenders that a payment has been missed.
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) however to hold current investments, I would like confirmation that none are effectively in "secret default". If they are, it would be good to know any mitigating circs etc then people can care or not care as they please.