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Post by beepbeepimajeep on Jul 22, 2018 14:57:21 GMT
Also beginning to suspect something more is up here than just a delinquent borrower. In all of these mostly for the reason I thought they would be easy enough to sell in the case of a default!
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rogerthat
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Post by rogerthat on Jul 22, 2018 16:19:14 GMT
Also beginning to suspect something more is up here than just a delinquent borrower. In all of these mostly for the reason I thought they would be easy enough to sell in the case of a default!I agree FS have left themselves wide open at the outset by not disclosing that 4 loans (or so we are led to believe ) are to one borrower, though the longer this goes on im beginning to wonder if it actually stops there. IF the 4 major ones I refer to (P, L, C & A) are genuine, then I cant believe that any of them would have any difficulty selling at any prestigious auction house, so why hasn't that happened ? But what baffles me is what (not who) sort of organisation or individual possesses 4 art works of this calibre in their own collection, without the means to repay these loans. I mean we're not talking about your local convenience store or an arts and craft shop here..this is a major individual borrower or an art gallery. The insurance against theft or damage alone must be eye watering. I wonder if there's more than a nodding acquaintance between one of the suits at FS and the borrower because one thing is certain in that S***** or E*** didn't sanction this multiple lending, this came from the 4th floor.
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ozboy
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Post by ozboy on Jul 22, 2018 16:23:00 GMT
If it sounds rotten, feels rotten, looks rotten, smells rotten, and if it were edible, tastes rotten, then .........................
[ EDIT: "I wonder if there's more than a nodding acquaintance between one of the suits at FS and the borrower" - I have alluded to this before, and if I were a betting man I'd give you Odds On. ]
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rogerthat
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Post by rogerthat on Jul 22, 2018 16:29:53 GMT
If it sounds rotten, feels rotten, looks rotten, smells rotten, and if it were edible, tastes rotten, then ......................... I'll tell you what it isn't as ive just pulled my porcine leg out of the oven to cool and if it tastes anything like it looks and smells...…….
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rogerthat
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Post by rogerthat on Jul 22, 2018 16:40:37 GMT
If it sounds rotten, feels rotten, looks rotten, smells rotten, and if it were edible, tastes rotten, then ......................... [ EDIT: "I wonder if there's more than a nodding acquaintance between one of the suits at FS and the borrower" - I have alluded to this before, and if I were a betting man I'd give you Odds On. ] A digital pint it is..winner takes all but on a serious note ive got a ridiculous amount invested in the (in) Famous Four..and the interest alone is in the K's already...never, ever again. I'm hoping the lesson isn't going to be too painful but if it does go t*ts up I don't intend to give up without a fight
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rogerthat
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Post by rogerthat on Jul 22, 2018 16:55:42 GMT
I'll tell you what it isn't as ive just pulled my porcine leg out of the oven to cool and if it tastes anything like it looks and smells...……. Given your avatar, that reads a bit like a curious case of 'self cannibalism' (not sure if 'self cannibalism' is possible, sure somebody will say if its wrong)
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ozboy
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Post by ozboy on Jul 22, 2018 17:38:53 GMT
If it sounds rotten, feels rotten, looks rotten, smells rotten, and if it were edible, tastes rotten, then ......................... [ EDIT: "I wonder if there's more than a nodding acquaintance between one of the suits at FS and the borrower" - I have alluded to this before, and if I were a betting man I'd give you Odds On. ] A digital pint it is..winner takes all but on a serious note ive got a ridiculous amount invested in the (in) Famous Four..and the interest alone is in the K's already...never, ever again. I'm hoping the lesson isn't going to be too painful but if it does go t*ts up I don't intend to give up without a fight From what I read on here most contributors seem to be very informed and experienced Lenders, who expect a degree of losses, which are factored in. We investigate the risks, evaluate the offering based on the facts ( or "facts" ) presented, then invest accordingly. Now, when you are not told vitally important facts pertaining to the risks, these facts being withheld, then there's a word for that.
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greenslime
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Post by greenslime on Jul 22, 2018 18:11:52 GMT
I'm accepting (sort of) of business and property loans running over, and that a certain amount of flexibility is sometimes needed to obtain the best result for borrowers and lenders. But these daubs are straightforward 6 month pawn loans where FS holds the items as security for our money (aren't they, don't they ). The loan is unredeemed, the items should be sold to recover our money. The fact that there a number of loans to the same borrower only makes this more pressing - if they're struggling to extend or redeem one loan they've probably no chance of settling multiple loans. Given that the three I'm in are all supposedly 50-55% LTV, even the need to recover a year's interest at 13% would allow them to flogged at prices that should sell quickly.
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ozboy
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Post by ozboy on Jul 22, 2018 18:34:29 GMT
It stinks to high heaven and FS aren't telling us everything. Obviously. What the hell do lawyers have to do with it, unless maybe there's a question over provenance/ownership? It's a Straight Pawn Loan. Supposedly.
FS' track record with this type of security is that they get shot of it fairly swiftly because FS knows the valuation is probably, reasonably accurate.
Unlike the Property Loans, which FS knows ...................
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chris1200
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Post by chris1200 on Jul 23, 2018 6:04:48 GMT
It stinks to high heaven and FS aren't telling us everything. Obviously. What the hell do lawyers have to do with it, unless maybe there's a question over provenance/ownership? It's a Straight Pawn Loan. Supposedly. FS' track record with this type of security is that they get shot of it fairly swiftly because FS knows the valuation is probably, reasonably accurate. Unlike the Property Loans, which FS knows ................... When I emailed them (about loan 1614460897, at least), their line was that if they go through lawyers, as lawyers are bound by certain professional conduct obligations, FS can have more faith/trust in what they are being told. Whereas they wouldn't necessarily be able to have that same confidence in what they are being told if going straight to the borrower (the penny finally drops that maybe they're being led up the garden path by these borrowers!). This isn't to excuse any of what FS is doing, and it doesn't necessarily explain why lawyers are involved in the first place. In that regard, though, they also told me: This is a complex case and therefore will take some time to recover. Unfortunately the repayments have not arrived as expected, but we have confidence that there will be tangible progress shortly. We are unfortunately not able to disclose details at this time but we are still talking to the borrower as well as their legal teams.Apologies if I wasn't meant to post that for some reason, but I assume it's okay as there isn't anything much concrete in it.
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greenslime
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Post by greenslime on Jul 23, 2018 6:21:05 GMT
It stinks to high heaven and FS aren't telling us everything. Obviously. What the hell do lawyers have to do with it, unless maybe there's a question over provenance/ownership? It's a Straight Pawn Loan. Supposedly. FS' track record with this type of security is that they get shot of it fairly swiftly because FS knows the valuation is probably, reasonably accurate. Unlike the Property Loans, which FS knows ................... When I emailed them (about loan 1614460897, at least), their line was that if they go through lawyers, as lawyers are bound by certain professional conduct obligations, FS can have more faith/trust in what they are being told. Whereas they wouldn't necessarily be able to have that same confidence in what they are being told if going straight to the borrower (the penny finally drops that maybe they're being led up the garden path by these borrowers!). This isn't to excuse any of what FS is doing, and it doesn't necessarily explain why lawyers are involved in the first place. In that regard, though, they also told me: This is a complex case and therefore will take some time to recover. Unfortunately the repayments have not arrived as expected, but we have confidence that there will be tangible progress shortly. We are unfortunately not able to disclose details at this time but we are still talking to the borrower as well as their legal teams.Apologies if I wasn't meant to post that for some reason, but I assume it's okay as there isn't anything much concrete in it. Thanks for sharing. Personally I can't see what's 'complex' about selling items held as security against unredeemed pawn loans. That assumes, of course, that the items are held by FS and the lending agreement is straightforward pawn.
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debaura
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Post by debaura on Jul 23, 2018 7:01:54 GMT
If it sounds rotten, feels rotten, looks rotten, smells rotten, and if it were edible, tastes rotten, then ......................... [ EDIT: "I wonder if there's more than a nodding acquaintance between one of the suits at FS and the borrower" - I have alluded to this before, and if I were a betting man I'd give you Odds On. ] A digital pint it is..winner takes all but on a serious note ive got a ridiculous amount invested in the (in) Famous Four..and the interest alone is in the K's already...never, ever again. I'm hoping the lesson isn't going to be too painful but if it does go t*ts up I don't intend to give up without a fight Me too rogerthat, I have a lot of money in these loans, will be all going all the way with this one.
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debaura
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Post by debaura on Jul 23, 2018 7:04:40 GMT
It stinks to high heaven and FS aren't telling us everything. Obviously. What the hell do lawyers have to do with it, unless maybe there's a question over provenance/ownership? It's a Straight Pawn Loan. Supposedly. FS' track record with this type of security is that they get shot of it fairly swiftly because FS knows the valuation is probably, reasonably accurate. Unlike the Property Loans, which FS knows ................... When I emailed them (about loan 1614460897, at least), their line was that if they go through lawyers, as lawyers are bound by certain professional conduct obligations, FS can have more faith/trust in what they are being told. Whereas they wouldn't necessarily be able to have that same confidence in what they are being told if going straight to the borrower (the penny finally drops that maybe they're being led up the garden path by these borrowers!). This isn't to excuse any of what FS is doing, and it doesn't necessarily explain why lawyers are involved in the first place. In that regard, though, they also told me: This is a complex case and therefore will take some time to recover. Unfortunately the repayments have not arrived as expected, but we have confidence that there will be tangible progress shortly. We are unfortunately not able to disclose details at this time but we are still talking to the borrower as well as their legal teams.Apologies if I wasn't meant to post that for some reason, but I assume it's okay as there isn't anything much concrete in it. Exactly the same response I received! Same BS> make a formal complaint. I am doing. We need these paintings sold NOW>
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reinvestor
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Post by reinvestor on Jul 23, 2018 7:11:24 GMT
If FS have their documentation in order, which they damn well should have, how can there be a problem that requires lawyers???
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on Jul 23, 2018 7:24:58 GMT
exactly - FS have a duty if care to we lenders to ensure there is no problem with any asset they lend against before taking OUR money. I regard "complex" to be FS speak for "we have c*cked up big time up yet again". I am sick to the back teeth of this constant failure to respond to our questions as to what is actually happening here - I don't see what good releasing "updates" on Sunday evenings does as either the staff are working very late or this is yet another PR stunt to try and minimise bad press although clearly it has the opposite effect.
I really don't understand why these items could not have been shifted by now and I expect FS to pay these legal fees !
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