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Post by patright on May 29, 2018 6:59:17 GMT
the sale queue is indeed not moving at all or at such a slow rate that it's just not working out The fact that they don't pay interest while parts being on the market for weeks or months on end while you carry the risk is leaving them open to law suits in my opinion, they justify it as a fee but a fee needs to have a clear amount, here the amount increase each day your parts stay on the market..making money only to Lendy It's therefore , from their standpoint a very good deal to have a non liquid secondary market, they make a fortune having you and every one else sit and wait while they keep all the money at your expenses both in risk and interest
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sj
Member of DD Central
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Post by sj on May 29, 2018 7:09:38 GMT
Done a few quick sums, and the defaulted/ "suspended" / "non performing" / "claims underway" total has now grown to just over 38% of the total loan book. Lendy need to stop spending time and money pissing about in little boats and sort this mess out, frankly they seem to be out of their depth and up the creek without a paddle (trying to speak in terms that they might understand). My Lendy holding is a fraction of what it was, I now hold only loans with no sales queue and as soon as a small queue appears it gets listed for sale right away. I won't be returning after abandoning ship!
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Post by patright on May 29, 2018 8:39:53 GMT
and let's not forget (if I understand correctly) that Lendy can put their OWN parts ahead of the queue yeah really, Liberalism at its best (or could it be N.Korea), it's open for debate
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Post by samford71 on May 29, 2018 9:15:48 GMT
The problem with sitting tight and waiting for recovery is we're totally dependent on Ly who don't appear to be as sharp in this area as many of us would have hoped. I still hold loans at ReBS (that haven't been declared as bad debt) where not a single penny has been recovered even though the last payment was in 2015, I can only hope this isn't a sign of things to come at Ly. Well, if patience is not an option then it seems that SS may well be considering variable pricing on the SM. I suspect though that many posters here will cry out that variable pricing is "unfair" or some equal nonsense. However, a market is the only way you can make something illiquid into something liquid and variable pricing is the only way you can compensate for varying risks over the lifetime of the liquid loan. The idea the global bond markets could operate at fixed prices would be seen as utterly bonkers yet posters here seem to think P2P is somehow special and you can operate markets without variable pricing. Given time, a variable priced SM will allow a clearing level to be achieved (possibly at very hefty discounts) and move the risk from weaker hands who want/need to exit to stronger hands who are happy to wait. Of course the strong hands may find that they need Kevlar gloves to catch the falling knife! But without that sort of risk where would the fun be?
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Post by patright on May 29, 2018 9:40:39 GMT
The problem with sitting tight and waiting for recovery is we're totally dependent on Ly who don't appear to be as sharp in this area as many of us would have hoped. I still hold loans at ReBS (that haven't been declared as bad debt) where not a single penny has been recovered even though the last payment was in 2015, I can only hope this isn't a sign of things to come at Ly. Well, if patience is not an option then it seems that SS may well be considering variable pricing on the SM. I suspect though that many posters here will cry out that variable pricing is "unfair" or some equal nonsense. However, a market is the only way you can make something illiquid into something liquid and variable pricing is the only way you can compensate for varying risks over the lifetime of the liquid loan. The idea the global bond markets could operate at fixed prices would be seen as utterly bonkers yet posters here seem to think P2P is somehow special and you can operate markets without variable pricing. Given time, a variable priced SM will allow a clearing level to be achieved (possibly at very hefty discounts) and move the risk from weaker hands who want/need to exit to stronger hands who are happy to wait. Of course the strong hands may find that they need Kevlar gloves to catch the falling knife! But without that sort of risk where would the fun be? and move the risk from weaker hands who want/need to exit to stronger hands who are happy to wait = not sure I like how that's written
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sl75
Posts: 2,092
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Post by sl75 on May 29, 2018 9:46:28 GMT
the sale queue is indeed not moving at all or at such a slow rate that it's just not working out The fact that they don't pay interest while parts being on the market for weeks or months on end while you carry the risk is leaving them open to law suits in my opinion, they justify it as a fee but a fee needs to have a clear amount, here the amount increase each day your parts stay on the market..making money only to Lendy It's therefore , from their standpoint a very good deal to have a non liquid secondary market, they make a fortune having you and every one else sit and wait while they keep all the money at your expenses both in risk and interest For the overdue loans, however, Lendy's "fee" is merely the accrued interest - they would need to make a full recovery in order to see a penny of that "fee" for being listed on the SM. So, in some way, the people who are leaving their loan parts on the SM for weeks and months at a time are doing the rest of us a favour, as every day that a loan part stays listed on the SM, it works towards aligning Lendy's interests with those of us continuing to hold loan parts and accrue interest. As I've said before, I suspect that the SM queues would move a bit faster if Lendy were to convert part of the amount forfeit by the sellers into a "cashback" incentive for the buyers... but they don't seem to consider clearing the SM a priority right now.
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SteveT
Member of DD Central
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Post by SteveT on May 29, 2018 13:19:44 GMT
The sooner Lendy get their variable pricing SM coded and live, the better for all concerned. Once nervous "locked in" lenders understand they now have a route to exit, albeit possibly requiring a discount to the incoming buyer, they can either sell up and reinvest the proceeds elsewhere or else rationalise the risk vs reward of staying invested with Lendy. And once that recurring gripe is fixed, the chances of new loans (and new tranches of existing loans) filling should be much improved.
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invester
P2P Blogger
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Post by invester on May 29, 2018 13:36:37 GMT
It will be interesting to see what sort of premiums sellers want to offer in order to get out. For some loans I think it'll be pretty big.
Across the P2P platforms, it seems obvious as to why there are delays, the platform would love to believe in the story that the borrowers tell them; it makes life easier for everyone. That is why they get the chances to prove that it is true, at lenders expense of course. Delay stuff long enough and even getting the capital back is seen as some kind of great result.
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mh
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Post by mh on May 29, 2018 13:59:11 GMT
The sooner Lendy get their variable pricing SM coded and live, the better for all concerned. Once nervous "locked in" lenders understand they now have a route to exit, albeit possibly requiring a discount to the incoming buyer, they can either sell up and reinvest the proceeds elsewhere or else rationalise the risk vs reward of staying invested with Lendy. And once that recurring gripe is fixed, the chances of new loans (and new tranches of existing loans) filling should be much improved. I always liked to simplicity of having no discount/premium on the SM. But now I think it's going to be the only way.
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sirius
Member of DD Central
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Post by sirius on May 29, 2018 15:31:57 GMT
I am into high 4 figures of this loan and although I cannot add to the 2nd charge, as I refused Lendy's new terms, I would still not have added further if I could, without a substantial % increase and cashback.
The reason?: 0005; whereby I put more in there to see it over the line and then Lendy pulled a fast one with regard to that £1m. It could so easily happen again.
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dovap
Member of DD Central
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Post by dovap on May 29, 2018 18:38:01 GMT
ah variable pricing to cure to all evils - Zzzzzzzzzzzz
I guess the Ly chancers are desperate enough to try any old cobblers - reet load of spivery in the offing
I wonder how they'll resolve the conundrum of their unsold junk pushing into the queue ?
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xpubman1
Member of DD Central
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Post by xpubman1 on May 29, 2018 21:26:33 GMT
Once again the whiners get from under their rocks, best thing I read in the recent posts was how to stop a whiner from appearing in my reader list. As usual a number of so called investors have no idea what they let themselves in for when they signed up with a P2P platform. Exit strategy is a phrase which only applies to an individuals thought process, as I have said in the past....sign up for the Pussy Platform and you really have things to whine about, they would just love Iain to add to their list of banned investors.
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empirica
Member of DD Central
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Post by empirica on May 29, 2018 21:34:24 GMT
Well, if patience is not an option then it seems that SS may well be considering variable pricing on the SM. I suspect though that many posters here will cry out that variable pricing is "unfair" or some equal nonsense. However, a market is the only way you can make something illiquid into something liquid and variable pricing is the only way you can compensate for varying risks over the lifetime of the liquid loan. The idea the global bond markets could operate at fixed prices would be seen as utterly bonkers yet posters here seem to think P2P is somehow special and you can operate markets without variable pricing. Given time, a variable priced SM will allow a clearing level to be achieved (possibly at very hefty discounts) and move the risk from weaker hands who want/need to exit to stronger hands who are happy to wait. Of course the strong hands may find that they need Kevlar gloves to catch the falling knife! But without that sort of risk where would the fun be? and move the risk from weaker hands who want/need to exit to stronger hands who are happy to wait = not sure I like how that's written Seemed to me to be a pretty accurate way of describing describing a free market to me. What didn't you like?
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empirica
Member of DD Central
Posts: 326
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Post by empirica on May 29, 2018 21:39:53 GMT
The sooner Lendy get their variable pricing SM coded and live, the better for all concerned. Once nervous "locked in" lenders understand they now have a route to exit, albeit possibly requiring a discount to the incoming buyer, they can either sell up and reinvest the proceeds elsewhere or else rationalise the risk vs reward of staying invested with Lendy. And once that recurring gripe is fixed, the chances of new loans (and new tranches of existing loans) filling should be much improved. I always liked to simplicity of having no discount/premium on the SM. But now I think it's going to be the only way. I wonder if Lendy have considered how a variable market would affect DFLs. (Will new tranches fill if there is a chance that a variable market would throw up some more tempting offers.) An option would be to have only PBLs and DFLs that are at max LTV trade-able on a variable market.
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hazellend
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Post by hazellend on May 29, 2018 21:41:54 GMT
Lendy should copy ABLrates bid/offer system.
Those wanting out could offer 5-20% discount depending how quickly they want their money
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