bigfoot12
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Post by bigfoot12 on Sept 28, 2018 14:09:39 GMT
bigfoot12 Why? Can't see small companies, say 300 workers, are going to just close or re-register abroad. Okay, 1. Good luck raising any additional equity for your 300 worker company (or your 200 worker company). 2. Debt is going to be even more favoured than today so companies will be less resilient than today. 3. Good luck hiring a new senior manager for that 300 worker company. 4. Good news for the lawyers and accounts vast amounts of money (and management time) will be spent here. 5. Most of the rest of management time will be spent working out how to restructure the company (sell a bit, split into two, move all or part overseas, sack a proportion of workers and contract out...). 6. At the same time employee costs, other taxes and regulation will be increasing. Of course there might well be some companies that survive, but I wonder how many...
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Sept 28, 2018 14:34:32 GMT
On the positive side, if youre a water company boss you dont need to worry.  |
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jwatson
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Post by jwatson on Sept 28, 2018 14:35:50 GMT
... I'd also envisage that for lower paid staff the chances are they would be sold as soon as possible for cash in the bank.. AIUI employees won't be given shares, only the dividends that result from those shares (to a maximum of £500), hence they won't be able to sell them asap as can happen in some profit share schemes. Thanks, hadn't realised that, so not much of a deal for the employee but potentially a lot of income for the government.
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cb25
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Post by cb25 on Sept 28, 2018 14:57:54 GMT
I could see some voters being attracted to Labour due to this scheme, because they'll be thinking "If I vote Labour, I'll get an extra £500/yr". They're only going to change their minds if people can give specific reasons that it'll backfire AND those reasons are ones they understand. I don't think that problems with financing companies - however true that might be - will wash with voters. What's more likely imo is the argument that whilst they might get up to £500 (and it is an 'up to' not a guarantee), their employer may well suppress wage growth: i) if their existing salary plus these dividends is enough to keep/attract staff, why add a pay rise on top? ii) if the scheme costs their employer money, the employer will seek to recoup the cost somewhere. Eliminating/reducing pay rises and/or shrinking the workforce are obvious ways to do this.
Same will be true of increased national minimum wage. Voters might think "oh, goody, pay rise!". Employers will most likely respond with "oh, poo, increased costs, time to loose a few workers".
I believe Labour are also talking of having workers on company boards. Can't see that going well. Workers are much more likely to be voting for more workers, more pay and not so much controlling costs, shrinking the workforce.
As many in the media have said, Labour appear to be the only party currently throwing out ideas - even if it they get mocked by some - Tories seem devoid of any initiatives.
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benaj
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Post by benaj on Sept 28, 2018 15:00:12 GMT
Another bad scenario would be all employees renewed new contracts with lower salaries but promised a high dividend like 20% yield in the coming year to make up the difference, then firm could not pay the dividend because of "losses".
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zlb
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Post by zlb on Oct 18, 2018 21:37:51 GMT
Why will debt be more favoured bigfoot12 ? Because everything runs on it, so the connection can't be broken? The minimum wage is panning out at £10 an hour for range of jobs in SE, eg cleaner, bookkeeper, teaching assistant (extraordinarily low paid probably owing demand for school hours work). Soon, the lower paid professions won't earn much more than this, and the incentive to bother will be less. A route to lots of jobs having the same salary. £500 dividend isn't much compensation to be treated worse by bosses. The government would be thrashing employers for not meeting targets. Maybe those earning over a certain amount shouldn't get the dividend  interesting salary threshold there. |
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bigfoot12
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Post by bigfoot12 on Oct 18, 2018 23:05:33 GMT
Why will debt be more favoured bigfoot12 ? Because everything runs on it, so the connection can't be broken? The minimum wage is panning out at £10 an hour for range of jobs in SE, eg cleaner, bookkeeper, teaching assistant (extraordinarily low paid probably owing demand for school hours work). Soon, the lower paid professions won't earn much more than this, and the incentive to bother will be less. A route to lots of jobs having the same salary. £500 dividend isn't much compensation to be treated worse by bosses. The government would be thrashing employers for not meeting targets. Maybe those earning over a certain amount shouldn't get the dividend interesting salary threshold there. I am referring to corporate debt, not consumer debt, because anyone investing in equity is about to see a 10% dilution/taxation (so no-one will invest), whereas if you lend the company money they still have to pay it back with interest. Most of the people you highlight won't receive the shares as it applies to private companies only. I don't understand you final few lines. Isn't the point of a minimum wage that more people earn the same? Why is the government thrashing employers?
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zlb
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Post by zlb on Oct 19, 2018 14:08:46 GMT
Why will debt be more favoured bigfoot12 ? Because everything runs on it, so the connection can't be broken? The minimum wage is panning out at £10 an hour for range of jobs in SE, eg cleaner, bookkeeper, teaching assistant (extraordinarily low paid probably owing demand for school hours work). Soon, the lower paid professions won't earn much more than this, and the incentive to bother will be less. A route to lots of jobs having the same salary. £500 dividend isn't much compensation to be treated worse by bosses. The government would be thrashing employers for not meeting targets. Maybe those earning over a certain amount shouldn't get the dividend interesting salary threshold there. I am referring to corporate debt, not consumer debt, because anyone investing in equity is about to see a 10% dilution/taxation (so no-one will invest), whereas if you lend the company money they still have to pay it back with interest. Most of the people you highlight won't receive the shares as it applies to private companies only. I don't understand you final few lines. Isn't the point of a minimum wage that more people earn the same? Why is the government thrashing employers? my speculative train of thought was, the government could aggressively pester employers to meet dividend targets. Some may think this means employers would be nice to employees to get them to perform better, but it would often just mean that employees are treated poorly by managers. Meeting government targets exists in public sector, and it often means staff are badly treated. People wonder why productivity low in UK compared EU, I think it's owing staff being so upset about the way they're treated that they talk all day about how crop the management is, or avoid work because feel resentment. People I've known from EU marvel at the level of bickering, resentment and unpleasantness there is in UK workplaces. So maybe a dividend incentive could work, but I get all the arguments against. Interested that the minimum wage was to get everyone earning the same. It's more the lack of public sector pay rises (pnot nhs not police) that's causing this I initially thought. But I'm no expert.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 23, 2018 18:10:25 GMT
Can you imagine the day when the company decides that there will be no dividend and the workers ask "where is our £500". Let me guess, will the government that has taken all these 10% offer to fund it? Nah. So all these companies will have to offer a dividend that has to calculate through as £500 per staff member.
But we are not investing enough in the future..... our clogs are not up to market conditions, tough, but at least the divi is up to snuff.
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Godanubis
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Anubis is known as the god of death and is the oldest and most popular of ancient Egyptian deities.
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Post by Godanubis on Oct 26, 2018 21:56:20 GMT
Politics on the forum - You're brave, have you thought about asking something on Brexit opinions? Any mention of B word results in removal of post.
The heading "CHAT" about anyting (legal) is a bit misleading and should read.
Anything that does actually involve discussion of opposite views.
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interesting salary threshold there.
