ton27
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Post by ton27 on Oct 30, 2020 12:25:29 GMT
As I read it for the GBBA remaining balance (but not entirely sure), we only get any more money back if the "profit-sharing" scheme produces any further payments. I cannot see how a provision fund can be called such if it only covers part of the debt for one particular category of investor (GBBA) but 100% for others.
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Post by investor01010101 on Oct 30, 2020 17:58:54 GMT
As I read it for the GBBA remaining balance (but not entirely sure), we only get any more money back if the "profit-sharing" scheme produces any further payments. I cannot see how a provision fund can be called such if it only covers part of the debt for one particular category of investor (GBBA) but 100% for others.
That loan will be in trouble again long before a profit is turned, then offloaded to another investor and our deal completely erased. Rinse, Run, Repeat.
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Post by investor01010101 on Oct 30, 2020 17:59:48 GMT
Slightly off topic, apologies, but... Of all the (dozen) P2Ps that I have invested with, AC is the only one where completely counter-intuitive things are always happening. - month after month I often did not get the expected rate of interest - 7% or whatever - even way back in the good times. I could never extract a transparent reason why.
- in the GBBA, which I opened to spread my risk and benefit from a provision fund, AC immediately invested 25% (one quarter!) of my investment in one loan (D******d M*****!)
- it was never intuitive to me that closing of the account would degrade AC's provision for Provision.
- back in March, I was not concerned about AA illiquidity, because no loan is longer than 5 years, and so my investment would all be paid back (+/- defaults) within 5 years. And then I discover that for some opaque reason, the occasional repayments and redemptions to MY loans are not being repaid to ME, but into some pool, such that at present, it looks as though my 5 year loans will be repaid in about 40 years.
AC stands for Always Counterintuitive.
AC stands for A Con.
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Oct 30, 2020 18:11:41 GMT
As I read it for the GBBA remaining balance (but not entirely sure), we only get any more money back if the "profit-sharing" scheme produces any further payments. I cannot see how a provision fund can be called such if it only covers part of the debt for one particular category of investor (GBBA) but 100% for others.
Because it isnt a provision fund it is a different provision fund for each account. The payoff for lower interest rates in the AA is a greater contribution to the provision fund for those accounts plus those account held very small amounts of the loan so didnt have to pay out as much. As I read it for the GBBA remaining balance (but not entirely sure), we only get any more money back if the "profit-sharing" scheme produces any further payments. I cannot see how a provision fund can be called such if it only covers part of the debt for one particular category of investor (GBBA) but 100% for others.
That loan will be in trouble again long before a profit is turned, then offloaded to another investor and our deal completely erased. Rinse, Run, Repeat. If you are referring the profit sharing scheme then that is not in the hands of the laird but companies controlled by Stuart. As to the refinance all I can say is there are nowt so queer as folk
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shimself
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Post by shimself on Oct 31, 2020 10:10:11 GMT
As I read it for the GBBA remaining balance (but not entirely sure), we only get any more money back if the "profit-sharing" scheme produces any further payments. I cannot see how a provision fund can be called such if it only covers part of the debt for one particular category of investor (GBBA) but 100% for others.
That loan will be in trouble again long before a profit is turned, then offloaded to another investor and our deal completely erased. Rinse, Run, Repeat. Folk to folk are no longer p2p; I just hope they eviscerate the b*****d the first time he tries it on. I'm sure they (f2f) are fully aware of what he did here
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Oct 31, 2020 10:15:03 GMT
That loan will be in trouble again long before a profit is turned, then offloaded to another investor and our deal completely erased. Rinse, Run, Repeat. Folk to folk are no longer p2p; I just hope they eviscerate the b*****d the first time he tries it on. I'm sure they (f2f) are fully aware of what he did here What do you mean? They are clearly a P2P platform.
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Post by angel19 on Oct 31, 2020 11:27:28 GMT
I feel rather quite sad about this now. A few snippets from the sales pitch tell you it is their largest loan to date, carefully structured to guarantee the first 18 months interest, secured against an estate value of over £18million, required to fund infrastructure costs for 66 individual self-build plots. Now where have I heard all this before?
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shimself
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Post by shimself on Oct 31, 2020 14:06:34 GMT
Folk to folk are no longer p2p; I just hope they eviscerate the b*****d the first time he tries it on. I'm sure they (f2f) are fully aware of what he did here What do you mean? They are clearly a P2P platform. No idea sorry. I think I had Landbay in mind. Anyway, I still hope they visit Cornish justice on the laird
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slippery
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Post by slippery on Nov 1, 2020 23:22:20 GMT
I feel rather quite sad about this now. A few snippets from the sales pitch tell you it is their largest loan to date, carefully structured to guarantee the first 18 months interest, secured against an estate value of over £18million, required to fund infrastructure costs for 66 individual self-build plots. Now where have I heard all this before? The bit I hadn't heard before is that the estate is worth over £18 million! Wonder who has provided the valuation .....
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Post by investor01010101 on Nov 5, 2020 22:22:54 GMT
I feel rather quite sad about this now. A few snippets from the sales pitch tell you it is their largest loan to date, carefully structured to guarantee the first 18 months interest, secured against an estate value of over £18million, required to fund infrastructure costs for 66 individual self-build plots. Now where have I heard all this before? Thats odd it was only worth 4m if it went into receivership ................and now its worth 18m, what a joke. For all that 2 years+ of messing around he got a remarkably simple deal there which begs the question if it was so easy why didn't we get that deal? Maybe I will delay that question until month 1 interest is due.......... www.folk2folk.com/blog/folk2folk-completes-largest-loan-of-2020/I love their sales pitch "We’re choosy but fair and turn down Borrowers who don’t meet our criteria. Our credit assessment process includes undertaking credit reference checks, due diligence, checking asset ownership and often holding a personal meeting prior to loan approval." Really?
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Post by jevans4949 on Nov 6, 2020 9:47:45 GMT
The Laird has obvoiusly hoodwinked them too. Or else they fancy owming a chateau.
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Nov 6, 2020 14:03:15 GMT
I feel rather quite sad about this now. A few snippets from the sales pitch tell you it is their largest loan to date, carefully structured to guarantee the first 18 months interest, secured against an estate value of over £18million, required to fund infrastructure costs for 66 individual self-build plots. Now where have I heard all this before? Thats odd it was only worth 4m if it went into receivership ................and now its worth 18m, what a joke. For all that 2 years+ of messing around he got a remarkably simple deal there which begs the question if it was so easy why didn't we get that deal? Maybe I will delay that question until month 1 interest is due.......... www.folk2folk.com/blog/folk2folk-completes-largest-loan-of-2020/I love their sales pitch "We’re choosy but fair and turn down Borrowers who don’t meet our criteria. Our credit assessment process includes undertaking credit reference checks, due diligence, checking asset ownership and often holding a personal meeting prior to loan approval." Really? Your not really comparing like with like though. The current valuation I assume (havent seen it) includes the castle, operating businesses and the GDV of the plots once the infrastructure is completed at OMV, the other is distressed sale excluding the castle, non operating businesses and no infrastructure so the plots are merely worth the land & planning value. Any purchaser would have significant costs to proceed and that is reflected in the 'price' seen as achievable ... not to mention the inevitable circumstances discount. AC could perhaps have done the deal, but would anybody have lent the additional £3.5m on top of the outstanding capital & interest? Would investors have lent at rates that reflect current market conditions with interest rates at zero? Was the deal viable without the debt forgiveness? LTV/LTGDV would probably been too high and I doubt AC could have funded a loan if lenders had to take a haircut to make it viable.
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Post by investor01010101 on Nov 6, 2020 14:49:25 GMT
I feel rather quite sad about this now. A few snippets from the sales pitch tell you it is their largest loan to date, carefully structured to guarantee the first 18 months interest, secured against an estate value of over £18million, required to fund infrastructure costs for 66 individual self-build plots. Now where have I heard all this before? Pretty sure the whole site is selling itself exactly as AC were when I first invested along with the statement "No Folk lender has lost any money to date"..................... They are in for a real shock, although in the one defaulted loan they have had they sold the property within 7 months so perhaps this time the Laird will not end up on top.
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Post by investor01010101 on Nov 6, 2020 14:53:11 GMT
Thats odd it was only worth 4m if it went into receivership ................and now its worth 18m, what a joke. For all that 2 years+ of messing around he got a remarkably simple deal there which begs the question if it was so easy why didn't we get that deal? Maybe I will delay that question until month 1 interest is due.......... www.folk2folk.com/blog/folk2folk-completes-largest-loan-of-2020/I love their sales pitch "We’re choosy but fair and turn down Borrowers who don’t meet our criteria. Our credit assessment process includes undertaking credit reference checks, due diligence, checking asset ownership and often holding a personal meeting prior to loan approval." Really? Your not really comparing like with like though. The current valuation I assume (havent seen it) includes the castle, operating businesses and the GDV of the plots once the infrastructure is completed at OMV, the other is distressed sale excluding the castle, non operating businesses and no infrastructure so the plots are merely worth the land & planning value. Any purchaser would have significant costs to proceed and that is reflected in the 'price' seen as achievable ... not to mention the inevitable circumstances discount. AC could perhaps have done the deal, but would anybody have lent the additional £3.5m on top of the outstanding capital & interest? Would investors have lent at rates that reflect current market conditions with interest rates at zero? Was the deal viable without the debt forgiveness? LTV/LTGDV would probably been too high and I doubt AC could have funded a loan if lenders had to take a haircut to make it viable. I dont dispute what you are saying, you are indeed correct, but as I pointed out to AC the continual beating down of the outcome of administration may well have influenced many votes, and the outcome may not have been as bad as they were pitching. I guess we will never know for sure.
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shimself
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Post by shimself on Nov 9, 2020 11:46:20 GMT
Can anyone do some fag-packet calculations of how the laird is doing in all this?
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