mason
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Post by mason on Nov 7, 2018 21:21:29 GMT
Yes but AIUI (regulated) P2P interest is a different 'flavour' from bank / bsoc / etc interest, in that P2P interest/losses can be offset (in either direction) against P2P losses/interest (and other interest can't). This might, one day, matter to someone with lots of (much delayed) Collateral interest which they want to offset against an (equally long delayed) LY P2P loss. That reads as though you think the outcome for LY lenders might be worse than the outcome for COL lenders. I'm not sure if you are implying that someone WOULD be able to offset tax liabilities from COL interest against losses from LY P2P, but it seems unlikely this will in fact be possible.
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mason
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Post by mason on Nov 7, 2018 21:22:32 GMT
Against capital gains? It doesn't qualify to count against interest. Why capital and what other capital gains offset againsta Best I can type! Do you have any unwrapped S&S investments?
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stevio
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Post by stevio on Nov 8, 2018 7:08:03 GMT
Why capital and what other capital gains offset againsta Best I can type! Do you have any unwrapped S&S investments? Yes, understand what other investments have capital gains to offset, just not following how the losses at CO will be a capital loss?
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Nov 8, 2018 7:28:28 GMT
Do you have any unwrapped S&S investments? Yes, understand what other investments have capital gains to offset, just not following how the losses at CO will be a capital loss? How else would you categorise such losses? If someone invests £10k in a collective investment scheme and gets only £8k back, they’ve realised a £2k capital loss. The option under SAIM12000 to offset P2P loan losses against other P2P income only applies to 36H-compliant loans via authorised P2P platforms (which COL were not)
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archie
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Post by archie on Nov 8, 2018 7:36:57 GMT
Yes, understand what other investments have capital gains to offset, just not following how the losses at CO will be a capital loss? How else would you categorise such losses? If someone invests £10k in a collective investment scheme and gets only £8k back, they’ve realised a £2k capital loss. The option under SAIM12000 to offset P2P loan losses against other P2P income only applies to 36H-compliant loans via authorised P2P platforms (which COL were not) What about the other way around? If COL interest is treated as P2P interest, could losses from compliant platforms (not COL) be offset against your total P2P income (i.e. including COL)?
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Nov 8, 2018 8:00:13 GMT
How else would you categorise such losses? If someone invests £10k in a collective investment scheme and gets only £8k back, they’ve realised a £2k capital loss. The option under SAIM12000 to offset P2P loan losses against other P2P income only applies to 36H-compliant loans via authorised P2P platforms (which COL were not) What about the other way around? If COL interest is treated as P2P interest, could losses from compliant platforms (not COL) be offset against your total P2P income (i.e. including COL)? COL “interest” (if that how it’s ultimately deemed”) cannot be “P2P income” under SAIM12000 since COL were not authorised.
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archie
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Post by archie on Nov 8, 2018 8:06:39 GMT
What about the other way around? If COL interest is treated as P2P interest, could losses from compliant platforms (not COL) be offset against your total P2P income (i.e. including COL)? COL “interest” (if that how it’s ultimately deemed”) cannot be “P2P income” under SAIM12000 since COL were not authorised. Probably better not to declare any totals for COL until someone bothers to tell us how it should be categorised and what the totals are.
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Nov 8, 2018 8:40:22 GMT
Yes but AIUI (regulated) P2P interest is a different 'flavour' from bank / bsoc / etc interest, in that P2P interest/losses can be offset (in either direction) against P2P losses/interest (and other interest can't). This might, one day, matter to someone with lots of (much delayed) Collateral interest which they want to offset against an (equally long delayed) LY P2P loss. That reads as though you think the outcome for LY lenders might be worse than the outcome for COL lenders. I'm not sure if you are implying that someone WOULD be able to offset tax liabilities from COL interest against losses from LY P2P, but it seems unlikely this will in fact be possible. Nope, I was implying you might WANT to, but I don't think you'll be ABLE to, since Coll interest, if any, probably isn't in the P2P bucket.
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Nov 8, 2018 10:26:41 GMT
COL “interest” (if that how it’s ultimately deemed”) cannot be “P2P income” under SAIM12000 since COL were not authorised. Probably better not to declare any totals for COL until someone bothers to tell us how it should be categorised and what the totals are. I would, but for various financial planning reasons I'd rather have taxable interest in 17-18 than a later tax year. So I am estimating and will claim relief as and when final figures are known. FWIW I would treat COL income and losses as normal P2P income and let HMRC challenge if they feel like it - the technical small print being discussed here seems beyond me and most reasonable taxpayers investing in what they were told by the FCA was normal P2P.
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archie
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Post by archie on Nov 8, 2018 10:39:55 GMT
Probably better not to declare any totals for COL until someone bothers to tell us how it should be categorised and what the totals are. I would, but for various financial planning reasons I'd rather have taxable interest in 17-18 than a later tax year. So I am estimating and will claim relief as and when final figures are known. FWIW I would treat COL income and losses as normal P2P income and let HMRC challenge if they feel like it - the technical small print being discussed here seems beyond me and most reasonable taxpayers investing in what they were told by the FCA was normal P2P. FCA got us into this mess. BDO should tell us our tax figures for last year and eventually for this year (*) and explain how they should be categorised on our tax returns. * Possibly next year too at the current rate of progress.
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Post by Duane Dibley on Nov 8, 2018 22:59:36 GMT
I would, but for various financial planning reasons I'd rather have taxable interest in 17-18 than a later tax year. So I am estimating and will claim relief as and when final figures are known. FWIW I would treat COL income and losses as normal P2P income and let HMRC challenge if they feel like it - the technical small print being discussed here seems beyond me and most reasonable taxpayers investing in what they were told by the FCA was normal P2P. FCA got us into this mess. BDO should tell us our tax figures for last year and eventually for this year (*) and explain how they should be categorised on our tax returns. * Possibly next year too at the current rate of progress. I presume that if they're not telling us then they're also not telling the taxman. So when they do, when I get something definitive in writing as to what's been paid in interest, what's deductable as losses and what's been declared to the taxman, that's when I'll include it in my tax return, not before and certainly not based on the musings of anonymous posters on internet forums.
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Post by martin44 on Nov 10, 2018 0:00:48 GMT
Having departed before they went TU... and having a few hundred interest to declare... what next?
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mason
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Post by mason on Nov 14, 2018 19:45:33 GMT
Having departed before they went TU... and having a few hundred interest to declare... what next? Take your position at the beginning of last tax year, combine with the sum of credits and withdrawals between your COL account and bank account. The difference is the amount of interest you were paid (there might be some cashback in there, but it will be the best you could do).
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ozboy
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Mine's a Large One! (Snigger, snigger .......)
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Post by ozboy on Nov 14, 2018 20:09:18 GMT
Just been attempting to calculate my COLL returns from my Bank Statements for the ole Tax Return, but of course it’s a mixture of Capital Returned and Interest, with no way to differentiate. What surprised me was I had forgotten how large the amounts were winging into my account every month, I’d been assiduously exiting COLL for several months and still beat myself up for not being quicker off the mark and getting caught. Guess we’ve all learned the hard way just how illiquid p2P is. And I hope The Spice Brothers get everything they deserve, while they rot in hell.
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sarahcount
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Post by sarahcount on Nov 14, 2018 20:25:32 GMT
Just been attempting to calculate my COLL returns from my Bank Statements for the ole Tax Return, but of course it’s a mixture of Capital Returned and Interest, with no way to differentiate. What surprised me was I had forgotten how large the amounts were winging into my account every month, I’d been assiduously exiting COLL for several months and still beat myself up for not being quicker off the mark and getting caught. Guess we’ve all learned the hard way just how illiquid p2P is. And I hope The Spice Brothers get everything they deserve, while they rot in hell.Completely agree with your last point. I was even further behind you in heading for the door. I didn't like many of the development loans and could sense that the platform was in trouble raising funds but kept re-investing interest and pouring in more money whenever the previously scarce Bolton first charge came onto the SM. Told myself that when Bolton repaid I'd pull out the proceeds and just stick with bling and a few small private house bridging loans. Never got the chance.
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