mjc
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Post by mjc on Nov 16, 2018 22:53:27 GMT
No one denies FS should work with the borrower to achieve the best outcome for ALL.
If FS simply put NOMINAL 6 month, “non-sophisticated” investors would have adequate warning that it is more likely than not to run over 6m and by a considerable amount in many cases.
I don’t recall any searching questions when signing up about my investment accumen. It is precisely this aspect that the No-Win no fee brigade are pursuing the likes of Hoodless Brenon even though they have ceased trading. A case of failings of regulation. I am sure there will be many platforms wondering when they will be sued.
In almost all cases after 6m the interest should be paid to extend it. FS should ensure the borrower has plans to pay the interest at the end of the 6m, if they haven’t, how are they going to be able to repay the capital?
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ozboy
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Post by ozboy on Nov 17, 2018 0:07:34 GMT
I think bg has mislead my post - I said that perhaps the number of staff employed by FS is inadequate to ensure that overdue loans are properly evaluated and that the necessary DD is carried out to establish whether an extension should be granted. trium refers to loans being "renewed" which is not the same as being "extended" - the opt out choice offered by FS takes care of these in so far as if the lender has indicated "not to renew" they receive their investment back together with any accrued interest. This choice is not available to the lender for extended loans and unless they sell the loan on the SM they are stuck with the loan for the duration of the extension and any others which may follow. I haven't had any renewals in my portfolio for ages but I have a hell of a lot of extended loans - in fact most of my loans have been extended. broadly speaking, there is no such thing as an extended loan. There are only overdue loans where FS delay forced sale proceedings, either because they believe a redemption is imminent, or because a forced sale would materially depress the achieved price, or that they want to maintain a reputation as a lender that doesn't repossess on day 1, or that it is an FCA requirement that a lender works with a borrower in default to find a solution rather than immediately repossessing.This entire thread seems to forget that last point. Oh come off it arby, even The Useless FCA would draw the line at anything beyond a maximum six months past redemption date. Get serious matey, we all know FS has several Loans hundreds of days overdue. That is NOT an " FCA requirement". Sheeeeeeesh.
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ozboy
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Post by ozboy on Nov 17, 2018 0:16:13 GMT
I think bg has mislead my post - I said that perhaps the number of staff employed by FS is inadequate to ensure that overdue loans are properly evaluated and that the necessary DD is carried out to establish whether an extension should be granted. trium refers to loans being "renewed" which is not the same as being "extended" - the opt out choice offered by FS takes care of these in so far as if the lender has indicated "not to renew" they receive their investment back together with any accrued interest. This choice is not available to the lender for extended loans and unless they sell the loan on the SM they are stuck with the loan for the duration of the extension and any others which may follow. I haven't had any renewals in my portfolio for ages but I have a hell of a lot of extended loans - in fact most of my loans have been extended. , it's called shafting your Lenders. When you know full well no-one will touch the renewed crappy Loan with a bargepole. So you extend it, and milk your Lenders.
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arby
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Post by arby on Nov 17, 2018 8:05:18 GMT
broadly speaking, there is no such thing as an extended loan. There are only overdue loans where FS delay forced sale proceedings, either because they believe a redemption is imminent, or because a forced sale would materially depress the achieved price, or that they want to maintain a reputation as a lender that doesn't repossess on day 1, or that it is an FCA requirement that a lender works with a borrower in default to find a solution rather than immediately repossessing.This entire thread seems to forget that last point. Oh come off it arby, even The Useless FCA would draw the line at anything beyond a maximum six months past redemption date. Get serious matey, we all know FS has several Loans hundreds of days overdue. That is NOT an " FCA requirement". Sheeeeeeesh. It's handy that I listed lots of other reasons of which that was just one. You may not like it, but my quick (and surely incomplete) list of 4 reasons can explain almost every overdue loan. There are always exceptions, such as legal disputes (5th reason?). I was only trying to give a spectrum of the various issues. Remember the snow dome or cinema, so many people here said it was a nailed on loss and that FS should just force a sale at any price. They waited and waited and got a full redemption. I agree there's countless loans that may go the opposite way, but so many people seem to think the answer is a quick default and all problems with the platform will be solved. I simply have a different view.
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arby
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Post by arby on Nov 17, 2018 8:08:12 GMT
No one denies FS should work with the borrower to achieve the best outcome for All. Unfortunately that isn't how the regulator primarily looks at it. First consideration is the borrower. The rights of the lender come way down the ladder. Unfortunately, with p2p, the lender is also typically an average person too and not an institution, this is an area where regulatory best practice advice is still catching up.
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on Nov 17, 2018 10:05:51 GMT
The above is very true - but this is out of how many loans? I would surmise exceptions don't prove a rule. Be interesting to see how many major FS loans go pectorals up...
Am I a sleeper - answers on a digital postcard.
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bg
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Post by bg on Nov 17, 2018 10:31:05 GMT
I think bg has mislead my post - I said that perhaps the number of staff employed by FS is inadequate to ensure that overdue loans are properly evaluated and that the necessary DD is carried out to establish whether an extension should be granted. trium refers to loans being "renewed" which is not the same as being "extended" - the opt out choice offered by FS takes care of these in so far as if the lender has indicated "not to renew" they receive their investment back together with any accrued interest. This choice is not available to the lender for extended loans and unless they sell the loan on the SM they are stuck with the loan for the duration of the extension and any others which may follow. I haven't had any renewals in my portfolio for ages but I have a hell of a lot of extended loans - in fact most of my loans have been extended. Can you give me an example of a loan that has been 'extended' in the way that you imply? Unless there has been a big change to the FS operating model that I have missed it is not possible to extend the term of a loan. What happens is an existing loan is repaid with interest and a new loan is made, or the loan becomes overdue.
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Post by dan1 on Nov 17, 2018 11:14:54 GMT
I think bg has mislead my post - I said that perhaps the number of staff employed by FS is inadequate to ensure that overdue loans are properly evaluated and that the necessary DD is carried out to establish whether an extension should be granted. trium refers to loans being "renewed" which is not the same as being "extended" - the opt out choice offered by FS takes care of these in so far as if the lender has indicated "not to renew" they receive their investment back together with any accrued interest. This choice is not available to the lender for extended loans and unless they sell the loan on the SM they are stuck with the loan for the duration of the extension and any others which may follow. I haven't had any renewals in my portfolio for ages but I have a hell of a lot of extended loans - in fact most of my loans have been extended. Can you give me an example of a loan that has been 'extended' in the way that you imply? Unless there has been a big change to the FS operating model that I have missed it is not possible to extend the term of a loan. What happens is an existing loan is repaid with interest and a new loan is made, or the loan becomes overdue. Loans are extended by FS to the borrower as indicated in their statistics page: For example, take a look at the loan updates for the South Wales Property, which has been active for 1193 days to date (my bold): The point I'm making is that FS do agree extensions with the borrower (and the example above is by no means an exception).
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bg
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Post by bg on Nov 17, 2018 11:21:07 GMT
Can you give me an example of a loan that has been 'extended' in the way that you imply? Unless there has been a big change to the FS operating model that I have missed it is not possible to extend the term of a loan. What happens is an existing loan is repaid with interest and a new loan is made, or the loan becomes overdue. Loans are extended by FS to the borrower as indicated in their statistics page: For example, take a look at the loan updates for the South Wales Property, which has been active for 1193 days to date (my bold): The point I'm making is that FS do agree extensions with the borrower (and the example above is by no means an exception). The example you give is of an overdue loan. FS is agreeing to give the borrower more time and not to just default the loan (which would be bonkers if they believe repayment to be imminent). In these circumstances there is no magic wand to be waived that will force an immediate repayment of the loan. The borrower just does not have the money. The circumstances described by the poster were of "the borrower has paid the interest to date and the loan has been extended". That is a repayment of the loan and a start of a new loan. Any investor can get their money back at this point.
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Post by dan1 on Nov 17, 2018 11:46:06 GMT
Loans are extended by FS to the borrower as indicated in their statistics page: For example, take a look at the loan updates for the South Wales Property, which has been active for 1193 days to date (my bold): The point I'm making is that FS do agree extensions with the borrower (and the example above is by no means an exception). The example you give is of an overdue loan. FS is agreeing to give the borrower more time and not to just default the loan (which would be bonkers if they believe repayment to be imminent). In these circumstances there is no magic wand to be waived that will force an immediate repayment of the loan. The borrower just does not have the money. The circumstances described by the poster were of "the borrower has paid the interest to date and the loan has been extended". That is a repayment of the loan and a start of a new loan. Any investor can get their money back at this point. You were replying to an old post by tony in this thread: ..."the borrower has paid the interest to date and the loan has been extended"... which was subsequently corrected by trium. However, you quoted their most recent post in which they acknowledge the differentiation between "renewed" and "extended": ... trium refers to loans being "renewed" which is not the same as being "extended" - the opt out choice offered by FS takes care of these in so far as if the lender has indicated "not to renew" they receive their investment back together with any accrued interest. This choice is not available to the lender for extended loans and unless they sell the loan on the SM they are stuck with the loan for the duration of the extension and any others which may follow... Hence the confusion with respect to your post. Just to add further confusion, in the loan I reference above the borrower has made a partial payment of interest, which wasn't sufficient to renew the loan and doesn't appear to have been passed on to investors to date.
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jj
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Jolly Jammy
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Post by jj on Nov 17, 2018 12:08:48 GMT
I would interested to see what class of loan 2355178947 would be put in ?
537 days active. The loan was split in two with no say in if this was acceptable or not. Yet the interest is still accruing on the bad part the good part was paid back. Not renewed or option of a new drawdown loan yet the loan terms are different from the original. Not looking to start an argument just opinions.
I am sure that this was not in the T&C.
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Post by df on Nov 17, 2018 23:12:46 GMT
Can you give me an example of a loan that has been 'extended' in the way that you imply? Unless there has been a big change to the FS operating model that I have missed it is not possible to extend the term of a loan. What happens is an existing loan is repaid with interest and a new loan is made, or the loan becomes overdue. Loans are extended by FS to the borrower as indicated in their statistics page: For example, take a look at the loan updates for the South Wales Property, which has been active for 1193 days to date (my bold): The point I'm making is that FS do agree extensions with the borrower (and the example above is by no means an exception). For some reason I always thought that "extension" means the interest was paid and retained for the duration of extended term, probably because of SS/Ly where completion date is altered accordingly. FS "extension" in this example is something else - the loan is still overdue, but we've given them another deadline to repay... meanwhile, for investors it means frozen funds with unknown outcome - same as "default".
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sarahcount
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Post by sarahcount on Nov 19, 2018 13:24:41 GMT
I've just received an e-mail from FS advising of a new development loan coming to the platform.
"Given the nature of the development, we expect this loan to renew after 6 months as construction will be ongoing."
Maybe they are listening.
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Post by df on Nov 19, 2018 14:56:04 GMT
I've just received an e-mail from FS advising of a new development loan coming to the platform.
"Given the nature of the development, we expect this loan to renew after 6 months as construction will be ongoing."
Maybe they are listening. Yes, FS is monitoring this forum. The absence of direct replies from FS rep doesn't mean that they are not reading it. It's not the first time when FS actions on forum posts.
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mjc
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Post by mjc on Nov 20, 2018 8:27:42 GMT
I've just received an e-mail from FS advising of a new development loan coming to the platform.
"Given the nature of the development, we expect this loan to renew after 6 months as construction will be ongoing."
Maybe they are listening. Yes, FS is monitoring this forum. The absence of direct replies from FS rep doesn't mean that they are not reading it. It's not the first time when FS actions on forum posts. Sure they’d be monitoring to correct factual mistruths, but they are hampered by FCA regulations. Also they know we know they are a poor performer. I do have more confidence in the other platforms that engage with users on here. I think they think it’s a case of least said, soonest forgotten - when the next big crisis comes along. FS haven’t even bothered to update their New Loans thread for nearly three months.
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