ozboy
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Mine's a Large One! (Snigger, snigger .......)
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Post by ozboy on May 15, 2019 9:27:04 GMT
All the about workers rights and human rights being lost is a just crazy. We would most likely keep in line with EU changes as they will be the best for everyone. No point in leaving, then... Yes there is, we will have the option to not be forced to adopt any rules & regulations we don't agree with.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on May 15, 2019 9:34:10 GMT
No point in leaving, then... Yes there is, we will have the option to not be forced to adopt any rules & regulations we don't agree with. That's odd. He just told us there was no risk of losing rights, because post-Brexit UK would stay in step... Now you say that there may be, because we don't have to. (FWIW, I think you're right - there is a risk. We've been told enough times that's one of the aims, after all...)
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ozboy
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Mine's a Large One! (Snigger, snigger .......)
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Post by ozboy on May 15, 2019 12:46:07 GMT
I knew I shouldn't have popped my head above the parapet on this Topic, I'm ducking down back out of sight again. Just chat among yourselves...............
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shimself
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Post by shimself on May 15, 2019 13:10:00 GMT
Regarding the confirmatory vote, I am British and was born here but my father who was also British lived in Moscow for 20 years in the late 70s and 80s. I have many other family ties and there are some in my family who are essentially out and out communists. Clearly I'm not (and neither was my father). The point I want to make is during communist Russia it was very common to have "elections" where the public would simply vote "yes" or "no". I would call that a "confirmatory vote" and it was at the time ridiculed by most of the population as pointless - a pretence of democracy. I just cannot believe so many are advocating a move in the direction of something like that. To be clear I'm not in any way suggesting remainers are in some way linked to such a system, but just highlighting that what they are advocating with a "confirmatory vote" is not a million miles from the """Democracy""" present in soviet russia last century. Isn't it rather that in Soviet Russia "yes" won every time.
This new vote would be more on the lines of "we've now got a detailed proposal and we choose ..."
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Godanubis
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Post by Godanubis on May 15, 2019 18:51:54 GMT
Regarding the confirmatory vote, I am British and was born here but my father who was also British lived in Moscow for 20 years in the late 70s and 80s. I have many other family ties and there are some in my family who are essentially out and out communists. Clearly I'm not (and neither was my father). The point I want to make is during communist Russia it was very common to have "elections" where the public would simply vote "yes" or "no". I would call that a "confirmatory vote" and it was at the time ridiculed by most of the population as pointless - a pretence of democracy. I just cannot believe so many are advocating a move in the direction of something like that. To be clear I'm not in any way suggesting remainers are in some way linked to such a system, but just highlighting that what they are advocating with a "confirmatory vote" is not a million miles from the """Democracy""" present in soviet russia last century. Isn't it rather that in Soviet Russia "yes" won every time.
This new vote would be more on the lines of "we've now got a detailed proposal and we choose ..."
Those wanting to leave will come out in droves and vote to say "WE TOLD YOU ONCE NOW GET ON WITH IT"
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shimself
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Post by shimself on May 15, 2019 19:02:04 GMT
Isn't it rather that in Soviet Russia "yes" won every time.
This new vote would be more on the lines of "we've now got a detailed proposal and we choose ..."
Those wanting to leave will come out in droves and vote to say "WE TOLD YOU ONCE NOW GET ON WITH IT" Let's have another referendum then and we'll see if you're right. Which, I fear, you may be
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on May 15, 2019 19:04:50 GMT
Those wanting to leave will come out in droves and vote to say "WE TOLD YOU ONCE NOW GET ON WITH IT" Lovely, an' all... But how? Remember... ...and of course... ...not to forget... ...and the all-time classic of...
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Godanubis
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Post by Godanubis on May 15, 2019 23:30:32 GMT
And every single government leaflet said we will leave customs union and single market.
We would have a deal on WTO terms. The quotes about tariffs all mentioned the highest possible there is no need to impose any particular tariffs.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on May 16, 2019 7:12:06 GMT
And every single government leaflet said we will leave customs union and single market. All the government leaflets from the campaign supported Remain, and used leaving the CU/SM as an example of how the economy would suffer. The Leave campaign said they were Project Fear.
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on May 16, 2019 7:55:56 GMT
And every single government leaflet said we will leave customs union and single market. We would have a deal on WTO terms. The quotes about tariffs all mentioned the highest possible there is no need to impose any particular tariffs. Unfortunately the PM who was head of the government that said all that resigned, and we have had a general election since then with new pledges. No party won a majority, including the Tories who ran explicitly on leaving SM and CU. No government can bind its successors. Democracy isn't a one off event, and a democracy that can't change its mind ceases to be a democracy (arch Leaver David Davis said that btw).
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on May 16, 2019 8:22:12 GMT
a democracy that can't change its mind ceases to be a democracy (arch Leaver David Davis said that btw). Surely not the same David Davis who was in charge of the A50 negotiations for the first two years after the referendum...? THAT arch leaver David Davis...? He wasn't alone.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on May 16, 2019 9:44:08 GMT
Anyway, going back to the subject of St Nige of the Farridge... LedByDonkeys are back... thebrexitparty.com/
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on May 16, 2019 11:02:03 GMT
...and just to prove there is more to the Brexit party than St Nige...
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ilmoro
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Post by ilmoro on May 16, 2019 12:02:40 GMT
...and just to prove there is more to the Brexit party than St Nige... That one seems to be on dangerous ground. Opinions held becuase of religious beliefs are probably not a good subject for political propaganda, opens a dangerous can of worms.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on May 16, 2019 12:16:06 GMT
...and just to prove there is more to the Brexit party than St Nige... That one seems to be on dangerous ground. Opinions held becuase of religious beliefs are probably not a good subject for political propaganda, opens a dangerous can of worms, particularly when it is completely irrelevant to the subject of the election. Even when it's a direct quote from the politician in question, in a debate on civil partnerships in the House of Commons, as documented in Hansard? publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200304/cmhansrd/vo041109/debtext/41109-18.htm#41109-18_spnew5(edit: And, as far as her homophobia being a "religious belief", several of the staunchest Catholics I know happen to be gay - including one who converted from Anglicanism over female ordination, as Widdecombe did.)
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