macq
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Post by macq on Oct 30, 2019 16:33:46 GMT
Would agree about the fee being off putting with the new products as effectively they have created a fixed rate product but with no fixed term to exit fee free.You could just imagine the press if a bank/BS launched the same idea i.e. pay to get your savings back(yes you maybe able to set your repayments high & then withdraw but its a faff).If RS can only survive by charging a fee it should be built into the spread between lender & borrower.The new product penalise's people by charging them more the longer their money is invested and the money grows and which in a sense is a penalty for loyalty in staying long term Personally I dont see the minor difference in needing to set a rate for reinvestment that wont as having any real difference between MAX and 5 year. I fact MAX for most would have a lower sell out fee than 5 year for most, and the liquidity is just the same. Both allow fee free as long as you wait for loans to pay back (from whatever source) I have avoided the new products so may have misunderstood them in the way they work - but to me the difference is i can receive a One year lump sum payment and withdraw fee free but i can't from the new products.At the moment i can receive 5 year payments and not have RS automatically reinvest (as they put it for my benefit!) so they can gain a fee.Yes there may may be away around this by setting a high matching rate but there is no guarantee this loophole if it works will not be closed
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Post by nutfield on Oct 30, 2019 17:08:34 GMT
I suppose the new arrangements really mean that RS have thrown in the towel and admitted that the old system that we all knew and loved (?) was really not viable. Otherwise why change it so fundamentally?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2019 17:24:41 GMT
So I put £21.43 onto the new Access at MR(3%) yesterday and it came through today approx 26 hours later. Not sure though that I want to put money into things at this lower rate but I was curious. Thanks. Presumably that would also be the current timescale for Plus lending at 4% and Max at 5%.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2019 17:28:40 GMT
I suppose the new arrangements really mean that RS have thrown in the towel and admitted that the old system that we all knew and loved (?) was really not viable. Otherwise why change it so fundamentally? I'm not sure it's been changed that fundamentally. You can still access repayments fee-free (via setting a high rate - this option should remain, as the Q&A thread says RS intends to continue to allow investors to set their own rates). Market Rate is now Going Rate for the new products, but the rate at which money is lent is still determined by supply and demand. The Going Rate just suggests to people the rate to expect. If everyone removed their offers and resubmitted them 2% higher, that's where the market would be, regardless of the Going Rate (or Market Rate).
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Post by bernythedolt on Oct 30, 2019 18:16:58 GMT
And of course the old 1yr and 5yr markets still exist... for the time being.
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Post by bernythedolt on Oct 30, 2019 18:23:36 GMT
I suppose the new arrangements really mean that RS have thrown in the towel and admitted that the old system that we all knew and loved (?) was really not viable. Otherwise why change it so fundamentally? My own view: Rates have been dropping for all investments, right across the board. Ratesetter has been running at a loss for some while. The only way to squeeze a profit out of the current situation was to introduce these fundamental changes and try their level best to dress them up as 'improvements' for investors, while actually starting to cream off a little for themselves in a difficult and ever-tightening market.
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Post by p2plender on Oct 31, 2019 0:14:52 GMT
Wasn't hard to see and I predicted this a while back. Coupled with a couple of huge disastrous loans and increasing defaults, RS had to change the model or collapse. Now it is a fixed rate investment product so just a name change required now.
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Post by propman on Oct 31, 2019 8:26:39 GMT
Call me a confused newbie then! I didn't realise that could be done, I was labouring under the illusion that the money would be automatically reinvested at whatever rate you had achieved initially a bit like it is for rolling/access except for cap/interest too. If that's not the case then it seems a bit more appealing.. I'm not sure how these show up at month end, some may be shown as "rolled over" at the new rate as they used to be on Rolling (theer may be a brief period before it shows up as a new loan, but that is just optics, it will happen), but this will just be the amount not repaid, the repaid amount will follw your reinvestment settings, so if too high a rate to be matched, you will be left with an unmatched offer.
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Post by propman on Oct 31, 2019 8:32:20 GMT
Wasn't hard to see and I predicted this a while back. Coupled with a couple of huge disastrous loans and increasing defaults, RS had to change the model or collapse. Now it is a fixed rate investment product so just a name change required now. For the first time on the new products that I have noticed, most of the Going rate money was loaned yesterday, so if they can maintain the loan volume, we may, at last, see rates available above GR shortly. In contrast, 5 year has seen less money loaned than addd at the MR so little hope for improvements there, although that could change if the Max market goes above 5 year.
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robski
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Post by robski on Oct 31, 2019 9:08:54 GMT
Wasn't hard to see and I predicted this a while back. Coupled with a couple of huge disastrous loans and increasing defaults, RS had to change the model or collapse. Now it is a fixed rate investment product so just a name change required now. For the first time on the new products that I have noticed, most of the Going rate money was loaned yesterday, so if they can maintain the loan volume, we may, at last, see rates available above GR shortly. In contrast, 5 year has seen less money loaned than addd at the MR so little hope for improvements there, although that could change if the Max market goes above 5 year. If only there was some benefit to RS to bring down the 5 year to as close to GR as they can. I mean imagine if they could bring down the MR by getting lenders to scrabble for a rate that is just below the current MR due to a large MR queue, and keep lending volumes low so fairly quickly the MR drops Nah surely that situation couldn't come into effect
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robski
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Post by robski on Oct 31, 2019 12:22:41 GMT
So under £800k on GR products now at GR Could be interesting to see if we do go above GR today. Come tomorrow there should be a load of cash washing in and the GR should be "safe" again, although timing could well play a part, only £1.9M upto GR + 0.4%
There is a lot at MR on 5 year (cant see 1 year as lost access), so RS could try to funnel loans to 5YR if GR products start going above GR+0.2% (which is where %YR is in effect right now at 5.2%)
I do wonder if people missed the changes to some extent, or if maybe enough have pulled funds and listed higher that the rates will go up. Do RS have a cunning plan for this, such as an investor to sling in a few £M to make it up short term
Always thought RS were gambling with rates here, if enough people consider the GR too low then they either need to attract more funds, or write less business, or accept GR will be breached at times.
Could be quite interesting to watch.
But in summary the large wadge of cheap cash that was sitting in rolling, unlent whilst higher rates were lent elsewhere seems to have gone. The benefit to RS may well be short lived.
I will definatly gouge them for all I can should opportunity arise, I never did before, but not all gloves are off, its bare knuckle should opportunity arise. Hell I may even start to switch of my reinvesting at the start of the month if we could see big spikes in GR products later in the month
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aju
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Post by aju on Oct 31, 2019 15:18:40 GMT
So under £800k on GR products now at GR Could be interesting to see if we do go above GR today. Come tomorrow there should be a load of cash washing in and the GR should be "safe" again, although timing could well play a part, only £1.9M upto GR + 0.4% There is a lot at MR on 5 year (cant see 1 year as lost access), so RS could try to funnel loans to 5YR if GR products start going above GR+0.2% (which is where %YR is in effect right now at 5.2%) I do wonder if people missed the changes to some extent, or if maybe enough have pulled funds and listed higher that the rates will go up. Do RS have a cunning plan for this, such as an investor to sling in a few £M to make it up short term Always thought RS were gambling with rates here, if enough people consider the GR too low then they either need to attract more funds, or write less business, or accept GR will be breached at times. Could be quite interesting to watch. But in summary the large wadge of cheap cash that was sitting in rolling, unlent whilst higher rates were lent elsewhere seems to have gone. The benefit to RS may well be short lived. I will definatly gouge them for all I can should opportunity arise, I never did before, but not all gloves are off, its bare knuckle should opportunity arise. Hell I may even start to switch of my reinvesting at the start of the month if we could see big spikes in GR products later in the month Try this for the 1Y when you are logged in i'm watching it every now and then waiting to hopefully pick up something above 5% although not sure it will hit 5% today let alone above it. members.ratesetter.com/your_lending/lend_money/market_full.aspx?ID=35% is currently sitting @246k every now and then something gets sucked up but not that much as far as I can tell mind you earlier to day it was sitting at £650k so some lenders have hit it perhaps.
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Post by propman on Oct 31, 2019 15:40:29 GMT
Try this for the 1Y when you are logged in i'm watching it every now and then waiting to hopefully pick up something above 5% although not sure it will hit 5% today let alone above it. members.ratesetter.com/your_lending/lend_money/market_full.aspx?ID=35% is currently sitting @246k every now and then something gets sucked up but not that much as far as I can tell mind you earlier to day it was sitting at £650k so some lenders have hit it perhaps. I think the movement was using funds at 4.8% and below.
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aju
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Post by aju on Oct 31, 2019 16:32:02 GMT
So my 5% in the 1Y was swept away since I last looked, I was just going to go in and move it up a bit and it's already lent out when I wasn't looking.
At present the 1Y has 5.5% sitting @ 142k i'm wondering if it will go higher than 5.5 today. It is quite bursty at times.
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robski
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Post by robski on Oct 31, 2019 16:54:34 GMT
So under £800k on GR products now at GR Could be interesting to see if we do go above GR today. Come tomorrow there should be a load of cash washing in and the GR should be "safe" again, although timing could well play a part, only £1.9M upto GR + 0.4% There is a lot at MR on 5 year (cant see 1 year as lost access), so RS could try to funnel loans to 5YR if GR products start going above GR+0.2% (which is where %YR is in effect right now at 5.2%) I do wonder if people missed the changes to some extent, or if maybe enough have pulled funds and listed higher that the rates will go up. Do RS have a cunning plan for this, such as an investor to sling in a few £M to make it up short term Always thought RS were gambling with rates here, if enough people consider the GR too low then they either need to attract more funds, or write less business, or accept GR will be breached at times. Could be quite interesting to watch. But in summary the large wadge of cheap cash that was sitting in rolling, unlent whilst higher rates were lent elsewhere seems to have gone. The benefit to RS may well be short lived. I will definatly gouge them for all I can should opportunity arise, I never did before, but not all gloves are off, its bare knuckle should opportunity arise. Hell I may even start to switch of my reinvesting at the start of the month if we could see big spikes in GR products later in the month Try this for the 1Y when you are logged in i'm watching it every now and then waiting to hopefully pick up something above 5% although not sure it will hit 5% today let alone above it. members.ratesetter.com/your_lending/lend_money/market_full.aspx?ID=35% is currently sitting @246k every now and then something gets sucked up but not that much as far as I can tell mind you earlier to day it was sitting at £650k so some lenders have hit it perhaps. Ok, but as i cant lend on 1 and its looking pretty good rightnow I am kind of annoyed I didnt think to get something on there before I was locked out I only ever used it a few times so kind of kicking myself right now
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