bugs4me
Member of DD Central
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Post by bugs4me on Dec 11, 2013 17:22:19 GMT
In simple terms, it is easy to prove. You signed our agreement on DD MMM YY but then subsequently agreed to new debt/charge on DD+ MMM+ YY+. Simple to prove. Knowing that they have done it... Thanks for the clarification Andrew
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Post by andrewholgate on Dec 11, 2013 17:34:46 GMT
In simple terms, it is easy to prove. You signed our agreement on DD MMM YY but then subsequently agreed to new debt/charge on DD+ MMM+ YY+. Simple to prove. Knowing that they have done it... Thanks for the clarification Andrew My pleasure as always. A
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merlin
Minor shareholder in Assetz and many other companies.
Posts: 902 
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Post by merlin on Dec 11, 2013 17:39:01 GMT
Thanks for the clarification Andrew My pleasure as always. A Hi Andrew
What is your middle name this week - Job (as in the patience of)?
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Post by andrewholgate on Dec 12, 2013 10:03:12 GMT
Merlin - LOL. Not at all. If you must know and it should all be at Companies House, David John are my middle names. Christian family going after Saintly names.
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Post by chielamangus on Dec 8, 2014 16:37:48 GMT
Can anyone explain the conundrum that Pawnpusher (Q&A) has identified?
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bigfoot12
Member of DD Central
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Post by bigfoot12 on Dec 8, 2014 17:49:12 GMT
The borrow has provided updated accounts covering first 7 months of this year (see in downloads) with a certain number for total interest and other banking and finance costs. But we know that they have paid interest to us of about double that (see in repayments). We await an explanation.
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Post by chielamangus on Dec 8, 2014 17:55:30 GMT
That's what I want - the explanation.
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Post by chielamangus on Dec 10, 2014 14:52:50 GMT
Here is the "explanation":
" I have now heard back from the external accountant who, although he doesn't produce the figures, thinks this will be down to a mis-allocation of interest and capital in their internal management figures which would be corrected on year end.
This is not uncommon according to the accountant."
I know accountants have the reputation for believing accounts are just a framework for weaving whatever fairy tale they choose, so perhaps the above described practice is fairly common. But where does it leave us? is the accountant suggesting that come the year end, the firm will suddenly discover their costs are much higher than they thought? What is the purpose of these accounts? To make investors nervous?
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jonno
Member of DD Central
nil satis nisi optimum
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Post by jonno on Dec 10, 2014 15:15:45 GMT
Without wishing to defend the "dark art", a "Mis-allocation" sounds as if the costs are currently sitting in the wrong place,and following re-allocation,shouldn't have a detrimental impact on the bottom line. However,"Management Accounts" are precisely that; an important aid to management decision making,and if decisions are being based on flaky information, it doesn't inspire much confidence.
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Post by mrclondon on Dec 10, 2014 20:38:09 GMT
Sometimes I wonder whether the accountancy firms employed to produce year end accounts deliberately don't help their clients set up their management accounts to reflect accountancy norms, as that would reduce the work needed in producing the year end accounts. Or am i just being cynical.
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mikes1531
Member of DD Central
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Post by mikes1531 on Dec 10, 2014 21:25:40 GMT
Without wishing to defend the "dark art", a "Mis-allocation" sounds as if the costs are currently sitting in the wrong place,and following re-allocation,shouldn't have a detrimental impact on the bottom line. However,"Management Accounts" are precisely that; an important aid to management decision making,and if decisions are being based on flaky information, it doesn't inspire much confidence. : If the outgoings are put in expense category A when they should be in category B, then it would be true that the bottom line profit number still would be correct. But management might be misled into making wrong decisions based on the bad data, and that's not a good thing. In this case however, we're not talking about expenses being put into the wrong category. Looking again at what we've just been told... If the £14k paid out to AC has appeared in the management accounts as £7k of interest and £7k of capital when it should have been £14k of interest then, while the cash flow may still be correct, the bottom line profit will overstated by £7k -- and that's a lot more serious error IMHO. And the suggestion from an accountant that accountants commonly make errors like this is rather disturbing!
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bugs4me
Member of DD Central
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Post by bugs4me on Dec 10, 2014 22:36:57 GMT
Without wishing to defend the "dark art", a "Mis-allocation" sounds as if the costs are currently sitting in the wrong place,and following re-allocation,shouldn't have a detrimental impact on the bottom line. However,"Management Accounts" are precisely that; an important aid to management decision making,and if decisions are being based on flaky information, it doesn't inspire much confidence. : If the outgoings are put in expense category A when they should be in category B, then it would be true that the bottom line profit number still would be correct. But management might be misled into making wrong decisions based on the bad data, and that's not a good thing. In this case however, we're not talking about expenses being put into the wrong category. Looking again at what we've just been told... If the £14k paid out to AC has appeared in the management accounts as £7k of interest and £7k of capital when it should have been £14k of interest then, while the cash flow may still be correct, the bottom line profit will overstated by £7k -- and that's a lot more serious error IMHO. And the suggestion from an accountant that accountants commonly make errors like this is rather disturbing! In my experience, unless you employ your own in-house accountant full time then many of them simply do not have a grasp on the many individual businesses that they are producing accounts for. They use a general template and everything must fit into that somewhere. So 'mistakes' are often made but usually it's a question of just getting the job done and making sure the bottom line adds up. Most are on a fixed fee these days and the industry is highly competitive so my faith in accountants generally is not as high as in olden days. Some are obviously better than others and are more diligent but they seem to becoming a rarer breed these days. Just my thoughts.
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