benaj
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Post by benaj on Jan 26, 2021 8:10:18 GMT
www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.01.25.427948v1.full.pdf+htmlmRNA-1273 vaccine induces neutralizing antibodies against spike mutants from global SARS-CoV-2 variants It’s probably “too early” to panic, it’s better wait for more data how this vaccine provides real protection for the elderly and vulnerable from future vaccine trials. Meanwhile, let’s hope the everyone on this planet do their parts to reduce virus circulation. Surely, the news of protection reduction means it is riskier than before to wait for a booster shot.
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james100
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Post by james100 on Jan 26, 2021 9:03:08 GMT
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Jan 26, 2021 9:14:34 GMT
I voted remain, although not through any great love for the EU. However, they claim to have pumped £1bn into AZ to ensure manufacturing capacity was available when needed, so you can understand them being a bit miffed (albeit premature given they haven't approved the vaccine yet).
The BBC are reporting the AZ supply issue stems from a partner firm in Belgium.
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Jan 26, 2021 9:51:13 GMT
The media are reporting that Israel are vaccinatuing 16 - 18yo.
Anyone know what our plans are for the under 18's? Are the current vaccines dangerous for that age group, or does the lower mortality rate mean there are higher priorities elsewhere.
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mrk
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Post by mrk on Jan 26, 2021 10:04:12 GMT
The media are reporting that Israel are vaccinatuing 16 - 18yo.
Anyone know what our plans are for the under 18's? Are the current vaccines dangerous for that age group, or does the lower mortality rate mean there are higher priorities elsewhere.
Not any time soon. Phase 1 stops at those aged 50+. I believe the Pfizer vaccine is the only one approved for 16+ anyway. AstraZeneca and Moderna are 18+ only.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2021 10:44:08 GMT
Listening to Radio 4 this am and heard a very worried Doctor explaining that she does not know what to do with the stuff at the bottom of the vial when she has taken 5 doses out. Very annoyed with the government that they have not told her what to do. Also how does she choose who to give any jabs left at the end of the day.
Yet Starmer and Boris think the British public are capable of making sensible decisions.
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jonno
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nil satis nisi optimum
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Post by jonno on Jan 26, 2021 10:54:31 GMT
Listening to Radio 4 this am and heard a very worried Doctor explaining that she does not know what to do with the stuff at the bottom of the vial when she has taken 5 doses out. Very annoyed with the government that they have not told her what to do. Also how does she choose who to give any jabs left at the end of the day.
Yet Starmer and Boris think the British public are capable of making sensible decisions.
I've heard from a reliable source that some NHS staff are putting relatives and friends on "standby" for a late call to come and "mop-up" leftovers. Not sure about the ethics but better than going to waste I suppose.
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r00lish67
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Post by r00lish67 on Jan 26, 2021 10:56:02 GMT
Listening to Radio 4 this am and heard a very worried Doctor explaining that she does not know what to do with the stuff at the bottom of the vial when she has taken 5 doses out. Very annoyed with the government that they have not told her what to do. Also how does she choose who to give any jabs left at the end of the day.
Yet Starmer and Boris think the British public are capable of making sensible decisions.
I didn't hear the piece, but that sounds a bit of a harsh take bobo. She could obviously give it to any Tom Dick or Harry, but every country has seen people severely reprimanded for jumping the queue, and she herself could easily be so too if it was deemed that she had enabled someone to do so. I'd personally definitely want some formal policy to cover my ass if i was in that situation. x'd with jonno - but you can imagine a tabloid article, right? 'Dodgy doctor gives 30 year old chums vaccine ahead of those desperately in need.....'
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r00lish67
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Post by r00lish67 on Jan 26, 2021 10:59:45 GMT
The European Medicines Agency is expected to decide on AZN by the end of this week so we'll know soon enough. I don't think 8% is right, but the US is holding back approval precisely because of insufficient data in the elderly, so I'm curious to see what the EMA says. I was looking at this last night and it seemed insane. The journalist was claiming not to have any data because it was a "political briefing" despite specifically claiming 8% efficacy for 65+ . He even doubled down on his comments by writing a further translated thread about it. However: I think this journalist is in for a bit of a shoeing frankly. Even if there was some substance to his claims, I don't think this was the way to try and break it to the public. I really struggle to imagine how you could make such serious allegations which run contrary to all previous indications without some serious corroboration. Mixing up a sample size with efficacy? I mean, wow.
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Jan 26, 2021 11:09:18 GMT
Listening to Radio 4 this am and heard a very worried Doctor explaining that she does not know what to do with the stuff at the bottom of the vial when she has taken 5 doses out. Very annoyed with the government that they have not told her what to do. Also how does she choose who to give any jabs left at the end of the day.
Yet Starmer and Boris think the British public are capable of making sensible decisions.
I didn't hear the piece, but that sounds a bit of a harsh take bobo. She could obviously give it to any Tom Dick or Harry, but every country has seen people severely reprimanded for jumping the queue, and she herself could easily be so too if it was deemed that she had enabled someone to do so. I'd personally definitely want some formal policy to cover my ass if i was in that situation. x'd with jonno - but you can imagine a tabloid article, right? 'Dodgy doctor gives 30 year old chums vaccine ahead of those desperately in need.....' As long as it's a 40 year old Tory MP (vaccine volunteer) or passing Labour MP it'll be fine as they'll get all the blowback when they brag
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Jan 26, 2021 11:54:42 GMT
Listening to Radio 4 this am and heard a very worried Doctor explaining that she does not know what to do with the stuff at the bottom of the vial when she has taken 5 doses out. Very annoyed with the government that they have not told her what to do. Also how does she choose who to give any jabs left at the end of the day.
Yet Starmer and Boris think the British public are capable of making sensible decisions.
As somebody who has dealt with health and safety issues during a lifetime in the construction industry, I can probably answer this;
She disposes of the residue in line with the method statement that should have been produced for the task in hand, giving due regard to the recomendations contained in the manufacturers COSHH data sheet. Both documents should have been briefed to her by her line manager before she started work.
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aju
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Post by aju on Jan 26, 2021 12:14:24 GMT
Listening to Radio 4 this am and heard a very worried Doctor explaining that she does not know what to do with the stuff at the bottom of the vial when she has taken 5 doses out. Very annoyed with the government that they have not told her what to do. Also how does she choose who to give any jabs left at the end of the day.
Yet Starmer and Boris think the British public are capable of making sensible decisions.
As somebody who has dealt with health and safety issues during a lifetime in the construction industry, I can probably answer this;
She disposes of the residue in line with the method statement that should have been produced for the task in hand, giving due regard to the recomendations contained in the manufacturers COSHH data sheet. Both documents should have been briefed to her by her line manager before she started work.
I like the idea that all these docs are available to the trained people. Didn't they say in briefing while back that the uk was finding they could get 6 does out of some vials, perhaps the makers reduced the vial contents to stop this so you only get what you pay for.... Surely an experienced person can see whether there is another dose left. They could try and get one and waste a needle perhaps!
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Jan 26, 2021 12:20:16 GMT
As somebody who has dealt with health and safety issues during a lifetime in the construction industry, I can probably answer this;
She disposes of the residue in line with the method statement that should have been produced for the task in hand, giving due regard to the recomendations contained in the manufacturers COSHH data sheet. Both documents should have been briefed to her by her line manager before she started work.
I like the idea that all these docs are available to the trained people. Didn't they say in briefing while back that the uk was finding they could get 6 does out of some vials, perhaps the makers reduced the vial contents to stop this so you only get what you pay for.... Surely an experienced person can see whether there is another dose left. They could try and get one and waste a needle perhaps! From the previous discussion it seems there are seven doses in a vial, so allowing for a little wastage six usable doses seems pretty likely and five may be a bit wasteful.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2021 12:31:05 GMT
I would have thought it was obvious but then I'm a simple man. Since we stick the same amount into a 6 stone person and a 22 stone person the route would be
Use up everything in the vial I might even mix two vials in the same syringe but only if they come from the same batch
Have a standby list of people that can be called in with half an hours notice, especially warned that is what they are
line manager....... the person was a Doctor not a trainee idiot.
Perhaps my reaction is over the top but if people are professionals I expect professional performance
Bevan said "stuff their mouths with gold", not "take their brains out at the same time"
And yes I continue to be grateful for the NHS and the flexability it has shown this last year I just wonder why it lacked that flexability in the last few years
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Post by Badly Drawn Stickman on Jan 26, 2021 12:32:53 GMT
I like the idea that all these docs are available to the trained people. Didn't they say in briefing while back that the uk was finding they could get 6 does out of some vials, perhaps the makers reduced the vial contents to stop this so you only get what you pay for.... Surely an experienced person can see whether there is another dose left. They could try and get one and waste a needle perhaps! From the previous discussion it seems there are seven doses in a vial, so allowing for a little wastage six usable doses seems pretty likely and five may be a bit wasteful. Based purely on watching endless TV footage of Syringes being filled, I would guess 'needle craft' plays a part. Following the logic if 6 doses is relatively easy working on a few vials at the end of the day could produce quite a few extra............ Just in case in some parallel dimension it is not obvious, I am not a Doctor.
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