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Post by defaultinator5000 on Jan 28, 2020 12:54:38 GMT
I find the recent updates downright depressing. So many criminally overvalued assets being marketed for peanuts and borrowers who supposedly borrowed money at <70% now offering to redeem the loans for far less than they borrowed. I have written off the thousands I have in my FS account already, and whatever I get back will be a plus. But I find it horrible that the borrowers, valuers and complicit FS' directors will be allowed to get away with murder.
The valuer deliberately inflates the value of the asset many times over. The shrewd borrower "borrows" money way above the true 100% LTV, never intending to pay it back. The FS originates these loans to the investors. The borrower then offers to settle the debts for less money than he borrowed, essentially getting the asset back for free along with some extra cash. The valuers and FS get their fees regardless. No one is prosecuted, only the investors are shafted. I was clearly on the wrong side of this game.
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pip
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Post by pip on Jan 28, 2020 13:04:23 GMT
I find the recent updates downright depressing. So many criminally overvalued assets being marketed for peanuts and borrowers who supposedly borrowed money at <70% now offering to redeem the loans for far less than they borrowed. I have written off the thousands I have in my FS account already, and whatever I get back will be a plus. But I find it horrible that the borrowers, valuers and complicit FS' directors will be allowed to get away with murder.
The valuer deliberately inflates the value of the asset many times over. The shrewd borrower "borrows" money way above the true 100% LTV, never intending to pay it back. The FS originates these loans to the investors. The borrower then offers to settle the debts for less money than he borrowed, essentially getting the asset back for free along with some extra cash. The valuers and FS get their fees regardless. No one is prosecuted, only the investors are shafted. I was clearly on the wrong side of this game.
Agree with everything above and find it very hard to believe all these sky high valuations were simply caused by a load of surveyors having a bad day. So many of the loans seem to have been given to people who clearly know exactly what game they are playing, think we only know a tiny amount of what ACTUALLY was happening here. For what its worth I highly doubt that administrators will pursue potentially long and difficult legal cases against valuers and even if they did not sure they would win especially for unfinished developments. In short wouldn't hold out any hope of this bailing you out.
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michaelc
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Post by michaelc on Jan 28, 2020 14:06:00 GMT
I find the recent updates downright depressing. So many criminally overvalued assets being marketed for peanuts and borrowers who supposedly borrowed money at <70% now offering to redeem the loans for far less than they borrowed. I have written off the thousands I have in my FS account already, and whatever I get back will be a plus. But I find it horrible that the borrowers, valuers and complicit FS' directors will be allowed to get away with murder.
The valuer deliberately inflates the value of the asset many times over. The shrewd borrower "borrows" money way above the true 100% LTV, never intending to pay it back. The FS originates these loans to the investors. The borrower then offers to settle the debts for less money than he borrowed, essentially getting the asset back for free along with some extra cash. The valuers and FS get their fees regardless. No one is prosecuted, only the investors are shafted. I was clearly on the wrong side of this game.
It was an FCA authorised company so that can't be true can it ? How could there possibly have been cowboys at the heart of this company? I share your pain by the way. I also have written off thousands. I would have been fine with it being caused by a property crash or similar but makes it hard to swallow that I've essentially been ripped off by an FCA approved/authorised/whatever company and its associates.
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Post by westcountryfunder on Jan 28, 2020 16:01:16 GMT
The outlook for the loans mentioned in these updates is certainly grim. Obviously there will be some massive losses ahead. But even when we do get some money back, and some repayments and/or interest have been dribbling into our accounts recently, we cannot withdraw said funds. So what is the status of this money? (Is there a simple reason why these repayments are being handled differently from the Lendy administration?) Even after the appointment of administrators, while our funds were on loan we were presumably lenders to the borrowers. But our currently frozen funds probably now make us creditors of FSec. So does this mean that these funds will be whittled away by administration expenses and/or potentially be shared with other creditors who are not lenders and never have been? I fear I can guess the answer, but just hoping that someone may be able to cheer me up.   |
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Godanubis
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Post by Godanubis on Jan 28, 2020 20:22:13 GMT
Godanubis Offer us some hope! What say you oh optimistic one! This might change some selloffs but may require prior action against naughty borrowers. link
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littleoldlady
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Post by littleoldlady on Jan 28, 2020 20:29:16 GMT
Godanubis Offer us some hope! What say you oh optimistic one! This might change some selloffs but may require prior action against naughty borrowers. linkCrikey! A sensible judge!
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Godanubis
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Post by Godanubis on Jan 28, 2020 20:48:43 GMT
This might change some selloffs but may require prior action against naughty borrowers. linkCrikey! A sensible judge! Yip let's get him to look at FCA 
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foolsgold
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Post by foolsgold on Jan 28, 2020 21:10:04 GMT
These company directors have run rings round FS and taken us lenders to the cleaners.....do you honestly think that a judge is going to stop them from getting their hands on these assets through other means such as family/ friends /associates or fellow criminals.
We have the longest tax code on record and it gets longer each year through crafty accountants who find loopholes.It will be the same with directors who will get their grubby mits on it again
I have little optimism that the outcome is going to be good.At the start of all this I thought worst case scenario 75 percent loss perhaps as low as 50...now Im thinking we will be lucky to get 25 percent overall return once everything unravels.
We can tell ourselves its going to be OK in the end but Im being realistic as to the eventual outcome.
The only chance we have is a proper investigation into how the FCA supposedly regulated FS and some form of compensation through media attention on how poor pensioners have lost their life savings
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Godanubis
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Post by Godanubis on Jan 28, 2020 22:08:50 GMT
Here is the FS money making plan and how Admin works. link |
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Godanubis
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Post by Godanubis on Jan 28, 2020 22:20:03 GMT
These company directors have run rings round FS and taken us lenders to the cleaners.....do you honestly think that a judge is going to stop them from getting their hands on these assets through other means such as family/ friends /associates or fellow criminals.
We have the longest tax code on record and it gets longer each year through crafty accountants who find loopholes.It will be the same with directors who will get their grubby mits on it again
I have little optimism that the outcome is going to be good.At the start of all this I thought worst case scenario 75 percent loss perhaps as low as 50...now Im thinking we will be lucky to get 25 percent overall return once everything unravels.
We can tell ourselves its going to be OK in the end but Im being realistic as to the eventual outcome.
The only chance we have is a proper investigation into how the FCA supposedly regulated FS and some form of compensation through media attention on how poor pensioners have lost their life savings
As your name implies you feel P2P is fools gold with the promise of ritches . That may not be the case it also is the case that even fools gold has value link so there will be a return .
From the article
Some pyrites can contain 0.25% gold by weight or more. Although this is a tiny fraction of the ore, the value of gold is so high that the pyrite might be a worthwhile mining target. If pyrite contains 0.25% gold and the gold price is $1500 per troy ounce, then one ton of pyrite will contain about 73 troy ounces of gold worth over $109,000. That is not a guaranteed money-maker. It depends upon how efficiently the gold can be recovered and the cost of the recovery process.
Which means there can be a good return depending on the effort. Some loans will be bad others as today will return a profit. Realistic is your word for "Guess"
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foolsgold
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Post by foolsgold on Jan 28, 2020 22:22:50 GMT
These company directors have run rings round FS and taken us lenders to the cleaners.....do you honestly think that a judge is going to stop them from getting their hands on these assets through other means such as family/ friends /associates or fellow criminals.
We have the longest tax code on record and it gets longer each year through crafty accountants who find loopholes.It will be the same with directors who will get their grubby mits on it again
I have little optimism that the outcome is going to be good.At the start of all this I thought worst case scenario 75 percent loss perhaps as low as 50...now Im thinking we will be lucky to get 25 percent overall return once everything unravels.
We can tell ourselves its going to be OK in the end but Im being realistic as to the eventual outcome.
The only chance we have is a proper investigation into how the FCA supposedly regulated FS and some form of compensation through media attention on how poor pensioners have lost their life savings
I this your DAD link I really hope your right on this for all our sakes including yours but I dont think you are being at all realistic .
The evidence is starting to emerge of incompetence or corruption on a grand scale by valuers and FS directors who were happy to mismanage loans and happy to take fees that benefited them.
A friend of mine tonight discovered that he is down on average 50 percent on his recent updates tonight and thats IF the rest of his loans pay out 100 percent capital which is highly unlikely.....that is fact....and its not a few pounds either as he was heavily invested so much so he could have bought a few of those cheap houses that were linked earlier with his loss so its no joke for him
No point burying our heads in the sand and pretending otherwise....the outlook is dire
I would be surprised if you said that if you had the chance to rewind time you would invest one penny in FS.
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Godanubis
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Post by Godanubis on Jan 28, 2020 22:45:20 GMT
I this your DAD link I really hope your right on this for all our sakes including yours but I dont think you are being at all realistic .
The evidence is starting to emerge of incompetence or corruption on a grand scale by valuers and FS directors who were happy to mismanage loans and happy to take fees that benefited them.
A friend of mine tonight discovered that he is down on average 50 percent on his recent updates tonight and thats IF the rest of his loans pay out 100 percent capital which is highly unlikely.....that is fact....and its not a few pounds either as he was heavily invested so much so he could have bought a few of those cheap houses that were linked earlier with his loss so its no joke for him
No point burying our heads in the sand and pretending otherwise....the outlook is dire
I would be surprised if you said that if you had the chance to rewind time you would invest one penny in FS.
I just checked what I have in the updated loans today. In total £47000. Not all updates were a disaster a lot did apply to one or two borrowers so are not indicative of all borrowers. Were I to just get 25% from those updated I would still be well ahead in my investments this year alone never mind profits from previous years.
Yes I would look at things differently now but things always evolve and you learn. Sometimes being right does not mean you win.
Learn lessons and move on. Poor little old pensioners are due to get wiped out for supporting local firm with sale of Sirius minerals (SXX) so there is always someone worse off.
We look down from our positions where most of us never have to worry if we are going to live to the end of the day. I just watched documentary on Hlocaust it was humbling.
It puts into perspective how petty modern western middle class people think they have been hard done too.
Accecpt the fact we all here are the lucky ones. Thousand if not billions of people in the world would love 1% of the 25% you say we will get. Thank our lucky stars for the life we have.
Sometimes a dose of reality can be useful to show us the error of our insular lives.
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foolsgold
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Post by foolsgold on Jan 28, 2020 23:08:18 GMT
I really hope your right on this for all our sakes including yours but I dont think you are being at all realistic .
The evidence is starting to emerge of incompetence or corruption on a grand scale by valuers and FS directors who were happy to mismanage loans and happy to take fees that benefited them.
A friend of mine tonight discovered that he is down on average 50 percent on his recent updates tonight and thats IF the rest of his loans pay out 100 percent capital which is highly unlikely.....that is fact....and its not a few pounds either as he was heavily invested so much so he could have bought a few of those cheap houses that were linked earlier with his loss so its no joke for him
No point burying our heads in the sand and pretending otherwise....the outlook is dire
I would be surprised if you said that if you had the chance to rewind time you would invest one penny in FS.
I just checked what I have in the updated loans today. In total £47000. Not all updates were a disaster a lot did apply to one or two borrowers so are not indicative of all borrowers. Were I to just get 25% from those updated I would still be well ahead in my investments this year alone never mind profits from previous years.
Yes I would look at things differently now but things always evolve and you learn. Sometimes being right does not mean you win.
Learn lessons and move on. Poor little old pensioners are due to get wiped out for supporting local firm with sale of Sirius minerals (SXX) so there is always someone worse off.
We look down from our positions where most of us never have to worry if we are going to live to the end of the day. I just watched documentary on Hlocaust it was humbling.
It puts into perspective how petty modern western middle class people think they have been hard done too.
Accecpt the fact we all here are the lucky ones. Thousand if not billions of people in the world would love 1% of the 25% you say we will get. Thank our lucky stars for the life we have.
Sometimes a dose of reality can be useful to show us the error of our insular lives.
Very true what you say about people being less fortunate and I am grateful for what I have but what relevance is this to our discussion?
Telling people on this forum to suck it up because people in the 3rd world are poor dodges the issue that we all have been mis-sold our investment.
Remember maybe you can afford to lose your investment and I can as well but many many people on this forum wrongly invested with FS as they believed it was properly regulated by the FCA and invested their life saving , many will be pensioners who may have relied on the investment to make their life a bit more comfortable rather than earning 0.5 percent with the bank.
So what do you tell them?
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Godanubis
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Post by Godanubis on Jan 29, 2020 9:28:46 GMT
Pensioners here are still far richer than millions of others and should never invest in a single investment type.
We are far far too selfish and always look to blame others for our mistakes or accuse people of deliberately failing when they are just trying to get on in life. Yes prosecute the criminals but don’t criminalise the those simply make errors.
The warnings were everywhere P2P is not a risk free investment and like all in life rewards are based on risk.
That is all associated risks including fraud and mismanagement
Basically it is a gamble you pay your money you take your chance with the proviso you would never loose all your money on a primary or bling loan.
Just look at the bigger picture and stop fixating on only the negative facts.
Thousands of people make money and thousands don’t it depends on your own choices as to individual exposure if you only invested 1% you can only loose 1% and as far as I can see if you only invested 1% in P2P or FS in particular you would have lost less than you would have made from repayments.
You still have 99% elsewhere
Again I ask anyone to show an overall loss from P2P properly diversified. Nobody to date has done this and that I am sure includes those on this thread.
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foolsgold
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Post by foolsgold on Jan 29, 2020 9:38:23 GMT
Pensioners here are still far richer than millions of others and should never invest in a single investment type. We are far far too selfish and always look to blame others for our mistakes or accuse people of deliberately failing when they are just trying to get on in life. Yes prosecute the criminals but don’t criminalise the those simply make errors. The warnings were everywhere P2P is not a risk free investment and like all in life rewards are based on risk. That is all associated risks including fraud and mismanagement Basically it is a gamble you pay your money you take your chance with the proviso you would never loose all your money on a primary or bling loan. Just look at the bigger picture and stop fixating on only the negative facts. Thousands of people make money and thousands don’t it depends on your own choices as to individual exposure if you only invested 1% you can only loose 1% and as far as I can see if you only invested 1% in P2P or FS in particular you would have lost less than you would have made from repayments. You still have 99% elsewhere Again I ask anyone to show an overall loss from P2P properly diversified. Nobody to date has done this and that I am sure includes those on this thread. I hope with your optimism and my pessimism we end up somewhere in the middle......lets just leave it at that
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