Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Feb 12, 2022 13:48:29 GMT
The problem I am having with EM is the lack of transparency over where my money is. I don't know if I am in 1, 10, 100 or 1000 loans. The more my money was spread across the happier I would be but I just dont know. They currently have just over 3% of my P2P investment and I would like to add more but I just dont feel comfortable adding more. They claim to split £100 deposit over 'several' loans. I don't know if that means larger deposits are split over many more loans or in proportion over the same number of loans. So you must be in more than one! They claim to have 4500 borrowers (at end of last year) and I would imagine loans naturally get churned about quite a bit between lenders as different borrowers pay some funds back or take funds out.
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nyneil
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Post by nyneil on Feb 12, 2022 15:06:20 GMT
I've been with Elfin just under a year now and so far all has worked 'reasonably' well, definitely a few quirks such as the annoying 2 weeks cash drag at the end of an investment term before it can be re-invested or withdrawn but interest has been paid regularly. Lack of transparency is a major issue, Mansour B. Elfin needs to work on this ASAP.
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Post by df on Feb 13, 2022 22:31:07 GMT
I've been with Elfin just under a year now and so far all has worked 'reasonably' well, definitely a few quirks such as the annoying 2 weeks cash drag at the end of an investment term before it can be re-invested or withdrawn but interest has been paid regularly. Lack of transparency is a major issue, Mansour B . Elfin needs to work on this ASAP. Just looked at mine. My next maturity is on 15th and the repayment is already "in queue", which makes 20% of my funds uninvested. I don't mind this - I treat it as a rate reduction for the comfort of shorter term investments.
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Post by Ace on Feb 14, 2022 22:43:48 GMT
In a recent correspondence with ElfinMarket it came to light that all of our investments are spread over all active borrowers on the platform. This is something I wasn't aware of, so thought I would post it here as I suspect many others are also unaware. This makes me feel that the investments are less risky, as they won't be badly hit by being unluckily lent to a small number of delinquent borrowers. It makes it feel more like the consumer lending equivalent of Loanpad to me.
The actual response was: "Investments are diversified over 3,980 active borrowers on our platform – and growing each day. Each investment has exposure to all our borrowers."
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tallsuk
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Post by tallsuk on Feb 14, 2022 23:35:43 GMT
In a recent correspondence with ElfinMarket it came to light that all of our investments are spread over all active borrowers on the platform. This is something I wasn't aware of, so thought I would post it here as I suspect many others are also unaware. This makes me feel that the investments are less risky, as they won't be badly hit by being unluckily lent to a small number of delinquent borrowers. It makes it feel more like the consumer lending equivalent of Loanpad to me. The actual response was: "Investments are diversified over 3,980 active borrowers on our platform – and growing each day. Each investment has exposure to all our borrowers." Thanks for sharing this. That info makes a huge difference and does make it sound far more attractive.
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Feb 15, 2022 7:25:11 GMT
In a recent correspondence with ElfinMarket it came to light that all of our investments are spread over all active borrowers on the platform. This is something I wasn't aware of, so thought I would post it here as I suspect many others are also unaware. This makes me feel that the investments are less risky, as they won't be badly hit by being unluckily lent to a small number of delinquent borrowers. It makes it feel more like the consumer lending equivalent of Loanpad to me. The actual response was: "Investments are diversified over 3,980 active borrowers on our platform – and growing each day. Each investment has exposure to all our borrowers."But if that is the case why doesn't each investment tranche have the same interest rate? Mine are still wildly different implying a different mix of borrowers in each tranche. That sentence above does imply that lenders funds are re-allocated daily (or monthly or something) which again should mean all lenders would get the same rate of interest on every investment.
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Post by Ace on Feb 15, 2022 8:58:29 GMT
In a recent correspondence with ElfinMarket it came to light that all of our investments are spread over all active borrowers on the platform. This is something I wasn't aware of, so thought I would post it here as I suspect many others are also unaware. This makes me feel that the investments are less risky, as they won't be badly hit by being unluckily lent to a small number of delinquent borrowers. It makes it feel more like the consumer lending equivalent of Loanpad to me. The actual response was: "Investments are diversified over 3,980 active borrowers on our platform – and growing each day. Each investment has exposure to all our borrowers."But if that is the case why doesn't each investment tranche have the same interest rate? Mine are still wildly different implying a different mix of borrowers in each tranche. That sentence above does imply that lenders funds are re-allocated daily (or monthly or something) which again should mean all lenders would get the same rate of interest on every investment. It's a good point, and I don't know the answer to your question, but I can envisage scenarios that could apply. Probably best to ask the platform directly. They've been good at responding to me. It doesn't say that there is a Loanpad-like reallocation on a daily or monthly basis. It also doesn't say that we are all exposed to the same borrowers in equal proportions. I'm just guessing here, but... it could be that our investments are spread over all loans at the point they are created, but that they only pick up shares of new loans when repayments are made, leading to different proportions of loans in each investment. This would mean that the statement isn't precisely correct, as an investment wouldn't be exposed to new borrowers until a repayment from an old loan was made, but I think the statement would still be fair enough at the level I was asking.
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Post by overthehill on Feb 15, 2022 9:09:12 GMT
But if that is the case why doesn't each investment tranche have the same interest rate? Mine are still wildly different implying a different mix of borrowers in each tranche. That sentence above does imply that lenders funds are re-allocated daily (or monthly or something) which again should mean all lenders would get the same rate of interest on every investment. It's a good point, and I don't know the answer to your question, but I can envisage scenarios that could apply. Probably best to ask the platform directly. They've been good at responding to me. It doesn't say that there is a Loanpad-like reallocation on a daily or monthly basis. It also doesn't say that we are all exposed to the same borrowers in equal proportions. I'm just guessing here, but... it could be that our investments are spread over all loans at the point they are created, but that they only pick up shares of new loans when repayments are made, leading to different proportions of loans in each investment. This would mean that the statement isn't precisely correct, as an investment wouldn't be exposed to new borrowers until a repayment from an old loan was made, but I think the statement would still be fair enough at the level I was asking.
I'm interested in the precise situation as I stated a while ago the model was the same as Growth Street, every lender with equal exposure, but I couldn't find where I had read it when challenged so I dropped it. If it is then it's more likely I will invest the next tax year.
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Post by Ace on Feb 15, 2022 9:13:45 GMT
It's a good point, and I don't know the answer to your question, but I can envisage scenarios that could apply. Probably best to ask the platform directly. They've been good at responding to me. It doesn't say that there is a Loanpad-like reallocation on a daily or monthly basis. It also doesn't say that we are all exposed to the same borrowers in equal proportions. I'm just guessing here, but... it could be that our investments are spread over all loans at the point they are created, but that they only pick up shares of new loans when repayments are made, leading to different proportions of loans in each investment. This would mean that the statement isn't precisely correct, as an investment wouldn't be exposed to new borrowers until a repayment from an old loan was made, but I think the statement would still be fair enough at the level I was asking.
I'm interested in the precise situation as I stated a while ago the model was the same as Growth Street, every lender with equal exposure, but I couldn't find where I had read it when challenged so I dropped it. If it is then it's more likely I will invest the next tax year.
I'll seek clarification from the platform and either report back or get them to respond directly.
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tallsuk
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Post by tallsuk on Feb 15, 2022 9:31:56 GMT
But if that is the case why doesn't each investment tranche have the same interest rate? Mine are still wildly different implying a different mix of borrowers in each tranche. That sentence above does imply that lenders funds are re-allocated daily (or monthly or something) which again should mean all lenders would get the same rate of interest on every investment. It's a good point, and I don't know the answer to your question, but I can envisage scenarios that could apply. Probably best to ask the platform directly. They've been good at responding to me. It doesn't say that there is a Loanpad-like reallocation on a daily or monthly basis. It also doesn't say that we are all exposed to the same borrowers in equal proportions. I'm just guessing here, but... it could be that our investments are spread over all loans at the point they are created, but that they only pick up shares of new loans when repayments are made, leading to different proportions of loans in each investment. This would mean that the statement isn't precisely correct, as an investment wouldn't be exposed to new borrowers until a repayment from an old loan was made, but I think the statement would still be fair enough at the level I was asking. I had similar concerns and therefore emailed them last night and have already had a response saying: At the moment we have approximately 4,500 Borrowers and we target to deploy each investment a lender makes, to each of our Borrowers. Furthermore, we have a daily loan novation process that ensures a part of each lenders investment be re-deployed to new Borrowers. It does not clarify if we have equal exposure to borrowers but clarifies some details.
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Feb 15, 2022 9:59:59 GMT
But if that is the case why doesn't each investment tranche have the same interest rate? Mine are still wildly different implying a different mix of borrowers in each tranche. That sentence above does imply that lenders funds are re-allocated daily (or monthly or something) which again should mean all lenders would get the same rate of interest on every investment. It's a good point, and I don't know the answer to your question, but I can envisage scenarios that could apply. Probably best to ask the platform directly. They've been good at responding to me. It doesn't say that there is a Loanpad-like reallocation on a daily or monthly basis. It also doesn't say that we are all exposed to the same borrowers in equal proportions. I'm just guessing here, but... it could be that our investments are spread over all loans at the point they are created, but that they only pick up shares of new loans when repayments are made, leading to different proportions of loans in each investment. This would mean that the statement isn't precisely correct, as an investment wouldn't be exposed to new borrowers until a repayment from an old loan was made, but I think the statement would still be fair enough at the level I was asking. I can imagine a scenario where all lenders with funds (from deposits, churning of borrower funds and interest payments) are matched with all borrowers with a requirement for funds (daily?) which effectively gives possible exposure to all or any subset of borrowers. Now there are a good number of borrowers churning funds and new borrowers being added daily I would think this would give pretty good diversity. And theoretically at least all lenders have the possibility to match with all borrowers over time. Edit: Crossed with above which is very helpful!
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tallsuk
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Post by tallsuk on Feb 19, 2022 10:52:50 GMT
Folowing Ace 's excellent example, I asked about exposure to EM customer service. The reply was: Percentage share of each loan may vary a bit between different lenders, as it may depend on when the investment was made as well as on the maturity chosen for the investment. But overall returns rates on investments have generally been quite close for all our lenders. While it is clearly slightly different from LP (or at least as I understand it) our investments are as well diversified as they possibly can be. It is also worth saying that I thought customer services there were excellent.
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Feb 20, 2022 20:36:57 GMT
Folowing Ace 's excellent example, I asked about exposure to EM customer service. The reply was: Percentage share of each loan may vary a bit between different lenders, as it may depend on when the investment was made as well as on the maturity chosen for the investment. But overall returns rates on investments have generally been quite close for all our lenders. While it is clearly slightly different from LP (or at least as I understand it) our investments are as well diversified as they possibly can be. It is also worth saying that I thought customer services there were excellent. I agree customer service excellent (although not my most important criteria for a platform) I also agree that I think my investments are well diversified, however my overall returns are still very variable between loan tranches which may be due to me being an early investor the earlier investments do seem to have the most variability.
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jester
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Post by jester on Mar 2, 2022 12:00:59 GMT
Thanks Ace and tallsuk for providing this diversification information. Elfin has been on my radar for a while but this has encouraged me to use the last of this years ISA money to dip my toe in! As I've mentioned elsewhere P2P platform diversification is becoming harder to achieve so another provider is welcome.
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Post by overthehill on Apr 20, 2022 9:56:53 GMT
1. Early exit is likely to be fast and is free but the money is withdrawn direct to your bank account. The IFISA is not flexible so you lose that amount from your allowance. One of these two factors needs to change.
2. It's not possible to directly switch between the products so you need to wait until maturity which could be 3 years. Or you could just withdraw as above and re-invest from your bank account.
3. You can't transfer IN from another ISA.
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