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Post by df on Feb 18, 2020 11:34:32 GMT
Took me 1 week to sell a small amount (completed today). Not as slow as I thought it might be. My partner made a sale request on 13th, the Growth loan part was sold late yesterday (17th Feb), just under 3 business days. Interest shortfall penalty is 0.26% compared to 3.1% last week. I say liquidity it's still pretty good. LW claims it is "normal" to sell them within 5 business days. p2pindependentforum.com/post/368533Yes, shortfall penalty went down, it's a good news. I've made a sale request yesterday and it was 1.2% incl. 0.5% "growth" penalty.
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Post by befuddled on Feb 18, 2020 11:54:24 GMT
...but do we know the mechanics behind this fluctuating rate.
Seems odd for it to have gone down so much in a week...
what has happened...?
Maybe they realised that they had bitten the hand that feeds them, so use a different method to work out this mysterious rate.
If they felt they had to raise 5% last week, and now can survive on less than 1%, seems three possible conclusions.
1/ They panic'ed at the customer response and rapid rate of increase of withdrawals
2/ They were being plain greedy...
3/ They are making it up as they go along (combined with 1/ above)
None of the above would fill me with much confidence....
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IFISAcava
Member of DD Central
Posts: 3,692
Likes: 3,018
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Post by IFISAcava on Feb 18, 2020 12:10:49 GMT
My partner made a sale request on 13th, the Growth loan part was sold late yesterday (17th Feb), just under 3 business days. Interest shortfall penalty is 0.26% compared to 3.1% last week. I say liquidity it's still pretty good. LW claims it is "normal" to sell them within 5 business days. p2pindependentforum.com/post/368533Yes, shortfall penalty went down, it's a good news. I've made a sale request yesterday and it was 1.2% incl. 0.5% "growth" penalty. I sold out at a 5% shortfall penalty a few days before it was slashed. It feels a bit like when you buy a flight and a few days later the price goes down by £100 (or much more in the case of LW shortfall fees) I still got the flight/sale I wanted at a price I was prepared to pay, but it leaves a bad taste in the mouth. I won't be hurrying back to LW
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Post by propman on Feb 18, 2020 12:52:32 GMT
The deduction from current interest fluctuates depending upon claims on the Fund. The SHortfall goes to the purchaser of the loan, so some recent purchasers have either done exceptionally well (over prudent assumptions on future bad debts), or current ones are being short changed (over optimistic default assumptions now).
Personally I think they were right to be prudent when introducing the shortfall, those brave enough to be still in the market need compensating. Sellers are forgetting that they are only able to exit at all if their are purchasers. I am one of many who have predicted illiquidity if a haircut was introduced. The way this has been managed by LW has managed to avoid this.
For those looking for compensation, while I understand that they feel angry that they were there when the inevitable happenned, compensation / lower sellout fees only come from continuing investors or by bankrupting the platform (probably at the expense of higher fees for all going forward). I for one think keeping enough investors happy to keep the platform running and liquid is a huge achievement. Yes they should have taken action sooner, but I fully support the action when it came.
At the risk of sounding like a stuck record, peole have to realise the distinction between the change in conditions and the haircut. The fee free sales were due to the change in terms and conditions and I believe that these were adequately explained. They also announced a future haircut although they were less clear about how large this was going to be. I think this was very brave and was amazed that most on this board seemed to take this so well. For me a poor situation was being flagged as critical. I think they went further than they were required to (given that announcements by then were all significantly in arrears) and they also agreed to contribute their rate margin to help rectify the situation to provide significant support for lenders that we have not seen from other platforms in equivalent difficlties.
I for one have confidence in the management of the platform. I am not currently confident in their credit assessment that was clearly too optimistic in 2017-18 and remeins to be seen for 2019 & 2020 on which the forecasts depend.
- PM
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tyrex
Posts: 78
Likes: 36
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Post by tyrex on Feb 18, 2020 14:36:01 GMT
Yes, shortfall penalty went down, it's a good news. I've made a sale request yesterday and it was 1.2% incl. 0.5% "growth" penalty. I sold out at a 5% shortfall penalty a few days before it was slashed. It feels a bit like when you buy a flight and a few days later the price goes down by £100 (or much more in the case of LW shortfall fees) I still got the flight/sale I wanted at a price I was prepared to pay, but it leaves a bad taste in the mouth. I won't be hurrying back to LW Same here, although that's the price one pays for panicking I guess. I made my decision on a number of factors including - the initial announcement, the large undershoot in initial interest rate received, the comments on here, Matthew's ominous absence and a gaped-mouth look at LW's last set of accounts. All things considered, confidence was undermined, I made the decision to pull out whilst I could. The sell-out didn't cost much in absolute terms fortunately, but my overall time with LW has been unprofitable and achieved a small capital loss, which is a terrible experience considering what the platform is supposed to be doing for investors. I hope LW are living frugally as a result of the shield problems, not all investors' capital is easily earned. Happy to have 90% of my money back in savings though, I guess my stomach for any significant sums in P2P isn't as strong as I thought.
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Post by carol167 on Feb 18, 2020 14:48:53 GMT
Absolutely no regrets selling out of LW. That they then dramatically reduced the sellout cost a mere week later just shows what a muppet show this has been the last couple of months. I don't do serious investing with large amounts of money with those sorts of shinanigans going on and lack of clarity as to exactly how things are run or worked out. Who knows what interest rate anyone is getting and are you seriously going to end up with that at the end of it all anyway ?
Retrospectively taking interest away from you ?? How is that even legal.
I used to think P-2-P was a halfway house in risk terms between cash and shares.
Some of what I've seen going on between various platforms makes shares almost a safe bet by comparison.
Real shame as I thought the industry had a lot to offer...
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Post by gravitykillz on Feb 18, 2020 16:49:23 GMT
I cant believe they got so much out of Carol that they slashed rates the next day for everyone else.
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Post by carol167 on Feb 18, 2020 16:53:52 GMT
I cant believe they got so much out of Carol that they slashed rates the next day for everyone else. It's a good job I'm a great believer in karma.
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Post by gravitykillz on Feb 18, 2020 17:31:04 GMT
I cant believe they got so much out of Carol that they slashed rates the next day for everyone else. It's a good job I'm a great believer in karma.
Have you tried complaining? Maybe you can get a partial refund or something? Just does not sound fair to me.
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Post by carol167 on Feb 18, 2020 17:48:33 GMT
It's a good job I'm a great believer in karma.
Have you tried complaining? Maybe you can get a partial refund or something? Just does not sound fair to me. I absolutely did.
They didn't uphold. Now escalated to FOS.
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Post by gravitykillz on Feb 18, 2020 17:52:20 GMT
Have you tried complaining? Maybe you can get a partial refund or something? Just does not sound fair to me. I absolutely did.
They didn't uphold. Now escalated to FOS.
Good luck
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Nomad
Member of DD Central
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Post by Nomad on Feb 18, 2020 18:32:13 GMT
I cant believe they got so much out of Carol that they slashed rates the next day for everyone else. And from me 
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Post by carol167 on Feb 18, 2020 18:49:39 GMT
I cant believe they got so much out of Carol that they slashed rates the next day for everyone else. And from me And many others I suspect too....
Disproportionate, unbalanced, rip off merchants.... Different rules for different people.
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Post by helpis on Feb 18, 2020 23:25:29 GMT
Absolutely no regrets selling out of LW. That they then dramatically reduced the sellout cost a mere week later just shows what a muppet show this has been the last couple of months. I don't do serious investing with large amounts of money with those sorts of shinanigans going on and lack of clarity as to exactly how things are run or worked out. Who knows what interest rate anyone is getting and are you seriously going to end up with that at the end of it all anyway ?
Retrospectively taking interest away from you ?? How is that even legal.
I used to think P-2-P was a halfway house in risk terms between cash and shares.
Some of what I've seen going on between various platforms makes shares almost a safe bet by comparison.
Real shame as I thought the industry had a lot to offer...
This is pretty much where I'm at, except I'd say that all peer to peer and 'innovative' finance investing is a complete waste of time.
Pretty much every platform has been a disaster and I wish I'd never heard of any of them in the first place, but you have to learn your lessons somehow huh.
Stocks and shares at least are in companies which make things. Or some of them are. Or something. I don't know but I do know that I give up on p2p for life. I'm never coming back to any of it.
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Post by carol167 on Feb 19, 2020 15:38:44 GMT
This is pretty much where I'm at, except I'd say that all peer to peer and 'innovative' finance investing is a complete waste of time.
Pretty much every platform has been a disaster and I wish I'd never heard of any of them in the first place, but you have to learn your lessons somehow huh.
Stocks and shares at least are in companies which make things. Or some of them are. Or something. I don't know but I do know that I give up on p2p for life. I'm never coming back to any of it.
Low cost passive index funds in a broad spectrum of countires and or asset categories are the way to go. Mix them with a smattering of bonds. Invest for the long haul.
Personally I wouldn't touch individual companies or fund managers if you paid me (and I've tried both before I wised up to index funds).
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