cb25
Posts: 3,528 
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Post by cb25 on Jun 4, 2020 9:34:15 GMT
No, Some of my stocks fell by 50% in March and have since recovered more than half of the loss, so a 50% was easily possible. I think it highly likely that some stocks will have fallen further and subsequently recovered more. Gains can also be made by buying on the lows and selling on the bounce. Repeatable in highly volatile markets. I did not buy low (apart from dividend re-investment) because I was as paniced as most of the market - I did not sell though, I expected a bounce and I now expect further falls as post lockdown reality sinks in. What the hell are you talking about your down 25%, not up 50% Both can be true.
Imagine a share that was trading at 100p then lost 50% to 50p before recovering half of the loss to 75p -you're correct, somebody holding the share from outset went from 100p to 75p, hence 25% loss, however -if somebody only bought in at the low point of 50p, they saw a 50% rise to 75p.
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littleoldlady
Member of DD Central
Running down all platforms due to age
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Post by littleoldlady on Jun 4, 2020 9:37:33 GMT
No, Some of my stocks fell by 50% in March and have since recovered more than half of the loss, so a 50% was easily possible. I think it highly likely that some stocks will have fallen further and subsequently recovered more. Gains can also be made by buying on the lows and selling on the bounce. Repeatable in highly volatile markets. I did not buy low (apart from dividend re-investment) because I was as paniced as most of the market - I did not sell though, I expected a bounce and I now expect further falls as post lockdown reality sinks in. What the hell are you talking about your down 25%, not up 50% He's quite right, we can now see that there was an opportunity for a 50% gain. There's a lot of money to be made following his strategy. Providing you have access to a time travel machine, but then making it in a casino where you can double your money in seconds would be easier.
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
Posts: 11,329
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Post by ilmoro on Jun 4, 2020 9:46:40 GMT
What the hell are you talking about your down 25%, not up 50% He's quite right, we can now see that there was an opportunity for a 50% gain. There's a lot of money to be made following his strategy. Providing you have access to a time travel machine, but then making it in a casino where you can double your money in seconds would be easier. He's down 25% but if you'd bought at the 50% down price, you would be 50% up, which is the point he appears to.be making. Plenty of stocks have made major gains over the period so extremely feasible to be 50% up without a time machine.
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sd2
Member of DD Central
Posts: 621
Likes: 224
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Post by sd2 on Jun 4, 2020 9:56:46 GMT
No, Some of my stocks fell by 50% in March and have since recovered more than half of the loss, so a 50% was easily possible. I think it highly likely that some stocks will have fallen further and subsequently recovered more. Gains can also be made by buying on the lows and selling on the bounce. Repeatable in highly volatile markets. I did not buy low (apart from dividend re-investment) because I was as paniced as most of the market - I did not sell though, I expected a bounce and I now expect further falls as post lockdown reality sinks in. What the hell are you talking about your down 25%, not up 50% He didn't buy at the low point is my point.
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corto
Member of DD Central
one-syllabistic
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Post by corto on Jun 4, 2020 10:17:42 GMT
With respect to the original poster:
For example: Tesla is up >100% since March, so if he invested x£ then he could have plausibly doubled his investment as Tesla is not a particularly far-fetched option and the OP calls himself 'valueinvestor', so he probably has some insight into what's available and how to get it.
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Post by Harland Kearney on Jun 4, 2020 10:59:17 GMT
I don't want to jump into the fire here. But I too used A.C as a place to park overflowing cash. Of course I'm not really jolted about it as I made those decisions myself. Additionally and more logically currently those funds are still paying decent interest as opposed to a many other platforms I will not list. Some in the same lending sphere, others cannot be compared fairly but people will anyway. (cough RS)
The issue is before this crash, and now even more so after it. If you want to balance your portfilio, using TIPS, Capital Gearing Trust or very questionble money market accounts all appear to take hits during a crash and thrus become useless to use as a place to park your "cash is king" ammo.
I'm a investor who likes to keep a nice stack of cash for opportunities. People pointed out hindsight sniping, unless you timed (very lucky or have access to the wallstreet floor) its hard to make those clear cut gains with a safe entry. My strat is just to invest at a daily rate, so invest it all over a 60-90 day window into a set number of instruments. You need cash for this.
100% is completely possible with selecting specfic stocks, with very good timing. I only used the crash to buy into Fundsmith and some Japan.
Cash is hella expensive to hold now days, I dont' blame anybody for using the AC products to try and mitigrate the cash drag honestly. I did and it was a good strat for about 4 years running. I use HL Active savings or any other NS&I to park cash right now to try and claw back a bit of inflation.
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Post by davee39 on Jun 4, 2020 13:26:53 GMT
He's down 25% but if you'd bought at the 50% down price, you would be 50% up, which is the point he appears to.be making. Plenty of stocks have made major gains over the period so extremely feasible to be 50% up without a time machine. I seem to have sown some confusion. ilmoro has it correct. A stock falls 50%. If it then rises by 50% it is still only at 75% of the original price. If it rises by 100% it has reached the original price and buyers have doubled their money if they bought in at the low. It is interesting that if the market falls by 10% on day 1, but rises 10% on day 2, the closing value on day 2 will be lower than the value at the start of day 1.
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tarq
Member of DD Central
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Post by tarq on Jun 5, 2020 12:54:59 GMT
I must be dim but I can't find any reference to fees deducted.
Is there a monthly invoice or similar somewhere.
All I can see is loads of small amounts deducted from my equally small interest payments!
Surely we're not expected to add all these up?
Also can these fees be deducted from the interest to lower tax liability?
Cheers.
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dave4
Member of DD Central
Cynical is a hobby not a lifestyle
Posts: 1,056
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Post by dave4 on Jun 5, 2020 13:05:16 GMT
I must be dim but I can't find any reference to fees deducted.
Is there a monthly invoice or similar somewhere.
All I can see is loads of small amounts deducted from my equally small interest payments!
Surely we're not expected to add all these up?
Also can these fees be deducted from the interest to lower tax liability?
Cheers.
This i believe has been covered earlier, very possibly earlier on in this thread, i believe i read its taken so isn't taxable. where its shown ?? no idea.
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
Posts: 11,329
Likes: 11,549
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Post by ilmoro on Jun 5, 2020 13:10:29 GMT
I must be dim but I can't find any reference to fees deducted.
Is there a monthly invoice or similar somewhere.
All I can see is loads of small amounts deducted from my equally small interest payments!
Surely we're not expected to add all these up?
Also can these fees be deducted from the interest to lower tax liability?
Cheers.
There isn't one Im aware of, so yes you would have to add them up. Tax statement deducts fees from interest declared so appears AC does consider that they lower the liability.
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dave2
Member of DD Central
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Post by dave2 on Jun 5, 2020 14:51:50 GMT
I must be dim but I can't find any reference to fees deducted.
Is there a monthly invoice or similar somewhere.
All I can see is loads of small amounts deducted from my equally small interest payments!
Surely we're not expected to add all these up?
Also can these fees be deducted from the interest to lower tax liability?
Cheers.
When a fee is deducted from an interest payment, the interest posting on the account statement is replaced by a claimed lender fee narrative. "Interest payment for loan AsdKjhg (123)"
"99.394739797979..."
Has been replaced by "Claimed Lender Fee of £99.394739797979... from Interest payment of £99.394739797979... for loan AsdKjhg (123)"In case there is any residual interest remaining after deduction of the fee it is posted as (e.g). "Claimed Lender Fee of £88.394739797979... from Interest payment of £99.394739797979... for loan AsdKjhg (123)"
"11.00"
The interest amount needs to be extracted from the narrative and considered for reconciliation purposes. On my list of things to do, once the new site has settled down... 
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Post by arallu on Jun 5, 2020 16:06:10 GMT
He's down 25% but if you'd bought at the 50% down price, you would be 50% up, which is the point he appears to.be making. Plenty of stocks have made major gains over the period so extremely feasible to be 50% up without a time machine. I seem to have sown some confusion. ilmoro has it correct. A stock falls 50%. If it then rises by 50% it is still only at 75% of the original price. If it rises by 100% it has reached the original price and buyers have doubled their money if they bought in at the low. It is interesting that if the market falls by 10% on day 1, but rises 10% on day 2, the closing value on day 2 will be lower than the value at the start of day 1. Just wanted to add my own personal experience on this subject. I started buying into the stock market on 15th May (so long after it bottomed out in March). I mainly purchased shares in leisure and travel companies, and a company called Hyve who operate trade conferences. Since then, my return is +49.73% If you look at some of these shares (cruise lines in particular), you could have easily doubled your money (or more) without necessarily buying in at the absolute low.
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jlend
Member of DD Central
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Post by jlend on Jun 9, 2020 6:29:18 GMT
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alender
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Post by alender on Jun 9, 2020 7:24:36 GMT
Maybe this fee has been added to cover AC costs of getting CBILS up and running.
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
Posts: 11,329
Likes: 11,549
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Post by ilmoro on Jun 9, 2020 9:51:15 GMT
stuartassetzcapital would have been nice if youd told your customers about the extension before the press, or did I not get an email, after all we are paying the fee! Perhaps rebates should be issued for each time AC don't do something we are paying for? You currently owe us for failing to pay retained interest for at least a week on a number of loans. 7 days at 3% please 
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