puddleduck
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Post by puddleduck on Jun 16, 2020 15:48:28 GMT
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Post by bikeman on Jun 17, 2020 12:47:26 GMT
Explains why they gave up on P2P investors so readily. One has to wonder if their inflexible terms were drafted with this in mind.
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withnell
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Post by withnell on Jun 17, 2020 13:49:15 GMT
Also gives them a 0% line of funding with no defined end date - they have no incentive to pay anything back to investors, quite the opposite given they bank the interest income and fees from the borrowers. Yet another triumph on regulation from the FCA allowing terms to pay no interest to investors!
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withnell
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Post by withnell on Jun 17, 2020 14:13:23 GMT
Also gives them a 0% line of funding with no defined end date - they have no incentive to pay anything back to investors, quite the opposite given they bank the interest income and fees from the borrowers. Yet another triumph on regulation from the FCA allowing terms to pay no interest to investors! Quoting myself (not sure if it's the done thing but nevermind!) I can't find any reference in the T&C to not paying interest during a resolution event on investor funds - have rung Growth Street to enquire and have been promised a call back, will update on here when I know
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Post by garreh on Jun 17, 2020 17:11:33 GMT
Also gives them a 0% line of funding with no defined end date - they have no incentive to pay anything back to investors, quite the opposite given they bank the interest income and fees from the borrowers. Yet another triumph on regulation from the FCA allowing terms to pay no interest to investors! Quoting myself (not sure if it's the done thing but nevermind!) I can't find any reference in the T&C to not paying interest during a resolution event on investor funds - have rung Growth Street to enquire and have been promised a call back, will update on here when I know It will be interesting to see what they say. Originally I thought this clause meant they could stop paying interest: 6.3. If and when you have received payment from GSP for all outstanding amounts due under a Loan Contract, any right you had against the borrower in respect of that loan will be transferred to GSP, which may then seek to recover the payment from the borrower for its own account. You will have no further rights in respect of that Loan Contract and GSP will be entitled to benefit from all rights, future interest payments, title and security relating to that Loan Contract. However this is particulary confusing - the bits in bold the most important points; it states when you have *received payment* for *all* outstanding amounts due under *a* Loan Contract (singular) - this implies this clause is only applicable once that particular loan has fully closed, in which case THEN you are no longer entitled to benefit from interest etc. This seems in direct contraction to the next point which surrenders rights of the loan to GSP which means we have no rights whatsoever to that money, including future interest. That seems particulary unfair and is essentially saying goodbye to 100% of your money and GSP can do whatever it likes with it - it now owns the loan. Would be great to have a legal perspective on this. equity care to chime in? Do share whatever information you get from GS. I too have an open complaint with GS in regards to timing of the Resolution Event and matching money during the "notification period" - not heard squiddly dit so far.
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Post by Ace on Jun 17, 2020 17:19:25 GMT
Quoting myself (not sure if it's the done thing but nevermind!) I can't find any reference in the T&C to not paying interest during a resolution event on investor funds - have rung Growth Street to enquire and have been promised a call back, will update on here when I know It will be interesting to see what they say. Originally I thought this clause meant they could stop paying interest: 6.3. If and when you have received payment from GSP for all outstanding amounts due under a Loan Contract, any right you had against the borrower in respect of that loan will be transferred to GSP, which may then seek to recover the payment from the borrower for its own account. You will have no further rights in respect of that Loan Contract and GSP will be entitled to benefit from all rights, future interest payments, title and security relating to that Loan Contract. However after reading it for the second time I'm not so sure it does allow them to specifically cease interest payments. I've highlighted in bold the most important points; it states when you have *received payment* for *all* outstanding amounts due under *a* Loan Contract (singular) - this implies that particular loan has fully closed, in which case you are no longer entitled to benefit from interest etc. My intrepetation of this clause is that it only applies once that specific's payment's have been fully received. This would make sense because I believe technically we still own the underlying loans and are entitled to that money - however GSP is the "protector" of that money, if you like, up until the point where that loan's contractual arrangements have completed. Would be great to have a legal perspective on this. equity care to chime in? Do share whatever information you get from GS. I too have an open complaint with GS in regards to timing of the Resolution Event and matching money during the "notification period" - not heard squiddly dit so far. Is this not a rather moot point? I would have thought it was unlikely that we will get all our capital and interest to date back. So the likelyhood of actually receiving any further accrued interest would seem very low. I do take the point though.
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withnell
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Post by withnell on Jun 18, 2020 7:29:12 GMT
It will be interesting to see what they say. Originally I thought this clause meant they could stop paying interest: However after reading it for the second time I'm not so sure it does allow them to specifically cease interest payments. I've highlighted in bold the most important points; it states when you have *received payment* for *all* outstanding amounts due under *a* Loan Contract (singular) - this implies that particular loan has fully closed, in which case you are no longer entitled to benefit from interest etc. My intrepetation of this clause is that it only applies once that specific's payment's have been fully received. This would make sense because I believe technically we still own the underlying loans and are entitled to that money - however GSP is the "protector" of that money, if you like, up until the point where that loan's contractual arrangements have completed. Would be great to have a legal perspective on this. equity care to chime in? Do share whatever information you get from GS. I too have an open complaint with GS in regards to timing of the Resolution Event and matching money during the "notification period" - not heard squiddly dit so far. Is this not a rather moot point? I would have thought it was unlikely that we will get all our capital and interest to date back. So the likelyhood of actually receiving any further accrued interest would seem very low. I do take the point though. Not moot in the case that say 90% of the portfolio pay back in full, and 10% don't, steadily over a year's time - without interest you get 90% of your "stake", with interest you'd get 92.4% back due to the 5.3% on the performing loan parts
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Post by Ace on Jun 18, 2020 8:05:56 GMT
Is this not a rather moot point? I would have thought it was unlikely that we will get all our capital and interest to date back. So the likelyhood of actually receiving any further accrued interest would seem very low. I do take the point though. Not moot in the case that say 90% of the portfolio pay back in full, and 10% don't, steadily over a year's time - without interest you get 90% of your "stake", with interest you'd get 92.4% back due to the 5.3% on the performing loan parts Ah, I had assumed that if 92.4% was available to distribute, including interest, it would be used to pay 92.4% of our capital. I.e. the extra interest would effectively go to the PF to increase our returned capital.
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Post by nesako on Jun 18, 2020 8:11:17 GMT
Not moot in the case that say 90% of the portfolio pay back in full, and 10% don't, steadily over a year's time - without interest you get 90% of your "stake", with interest you'd get 92.4% back due to the 5.3% on the performing loan parts Ah, I had assumed that if 92.4% was available to distribute, including interest, it would be used to pay 92.6% of our capital. I.e. the extra interest would effectively go to the PF to increase our returned capital. I share same assumption - PF shoud distribute extra (cover more of the loss) if there is accumulated interest, so there should be no difference on the final outcome.
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Jun 18, 2020 8:14:11 GMT
Quoting myself (not sure if it's the done thing but nevermind!) I can't find any reference in the T&C to not paying interest during a resolution event on investor funds - have rung Growth Street to enquire and have been promised a call back, will update on here when I know It will be interesting to see what they say. Originally I thought this clause meant they could stop paying interest: 6.3. If and when you have received payment from GSP for all outstanding amounts due under a Loan Contract, any right you had against the borrower in respect of that loan will be transferred to GSP, which may then seek to recover the payment from the borrower for its own account. You will have no further rights in respect of that Loan Contract and GSP will be entitled to benefit from all rights, future interest payments, title and security relating to that Loan Contract. However this is particulary confusing - the bits in bold the most important points; it states when you have *received payment* for *all* outstanding amounts due under *a* Loan Contract (singular) - this implies this clause is only applicable once that particular loan has fully closed, in which case THEN you are no longer entitled to benefit from interest etc. This seems in direct contraction to the next point which surrenders rights of the loan to GSP which means we have no rights whatsoever to that money, including future interest. That seems particulary unfair and is essentially saying goodbye to 100% of your money and GSP can do whatever it likes with it - it now owns the loan. Would be great to have a legal perspective on this. equity care to chime in? Do share whatever information you get from GS. I too have an open complaint with GS in regards to timing of the Resolution Event and matching money during the "notification period" - not heard squiddly dit so far. Once the RE happened all loans were pooled, lenders no longer have individual loan contracts with borrowers.
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rogedavi
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Post by rogedavi on Jun 18, 2020 15:56:25 GMT
The key thing I would like to understand is does anyone else have a claim on the PF monies that are recovered.
For example can GS use money to pay salaries etc.
If it is simply a pooled pot, wholly owned by us the investors and treated as client money, then im pretty much fine with it.
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Jun 18, 2020 19:31:30 GMT
The key thing I would like to understand is does anyone else have a claim on the PF monies that are recovered. For example can GS use money to pay salaries etc. If it is simply a pooled pot, wholly owned by us the investors and treated as client money, then im pretty much fine with it. I think not, but if the rules are followed it should be used for the benefit of lenders. 6.6. In order to spread the risk of borrower default equally between all investors, if a Resolution Event is declared, the benefit of all loans outstanding will be immediately assigned to GSP to be held for the benefit of the investors as a whole. All payments received from borrowers will continue to be collected by GSP and held on trust for investors as a whole. 6.7. GSP is free to use funds held in the LLP and/or funds collected from borrowers during a Resolution Event to fund expenses or other payments which it reasonably believes will maximise the probability of borrower repayment, whilst also ensuring borrowers continue to be treated fairly during the collect out process. For example, funds held are likely to be used to fund recovery action against defaulted borrowers and may also be used to fund new drawdown requests if it is determined that a failure to fund the request will materially impact the borrower’s ability to (1) continue trading, (2) repay their facility, or (3) re-finance. 6.8. Distributions of available funds will be made to investors on a quarterly basis in proportion to their outstanding investments.
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zlb
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Post by zlb on Jun 24, 2020 11:18:10 GMT
When was the email for this sent out? Thanks, All I can see is lots of waffle about flattening the curve, and lots of emails headed 'important information'. [Found it now, June 15th]
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zlb
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Post by zlb on Jun 24, 2020 11:40:04 GMT
They refer to those who had reinvesting turned off - this setting seems to have disappeared, and in fact, was 'reinvesting' an option. I thought it was a number of days' notice. Is this what they are referring to when they talk about reinvesting? The 30 days notice, and those who had notice to withdraw get priority?
So they have a borrower action group setting up against them now - can they do that given that they signed terms - or does GS announcing abnormal market conditions make any previous agreement void?
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Post by nesako on Jun 24, 2020 14:45:10 GMT
They refer to those who had reinvesting turned off - this setting seems to have disappeared, and in fact, was 'reinvesting' an option. I thought it was a number of days' notice. Is this what they are referring to when they talk about reinvesting? The 30 days notice, and those who had notice to withdraw get priority? So they have a borrower action group setting up against them now - can they do that given that they signed terms - or does GS announcing abnormal market conditions make any previous agreement void? Reinvesting options was a "thing" which allowed you to no longer invest after your loans (all of which were 30days long) have matured. No, people who had that switched off, will not get any priority (I had mine off with less than a week to go and now I am "stuck" for good). Priority was given to ISA holders - they all have been able to withdraw in-full. Borrower action group is to help borrowers find alternative funding sources. GS terms for RE allow for borrowers to extend their notice if that would help them to repay in the longer term (and prevent default), hence new agreements can be arranged on a case-by-case basis.
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