cwah
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Post by cwah on Sept 14, 2020 22:24:19 GMT
Hello
With the recovery taking years and years. I have less and less hope to get any decent amount back. And after 4 years of wait from lendy,fundingsecure and moneything (have more hope on that one)... i think i have to come to realisation that the money may be lost forever.
Even if recovery comes to decent amount, the fees from all the parties involved after 5+ years will eat out any left over.
I don't think I'll ever earn enough in P2P interest to recover the capital loss.
I'll first recover some of the tax from interest payment during the previous years.
But it'll only be a tiny amount covered.
Is there anything else I can use to offset the loss?
Any offset against income tax, capital gain tax (from stock) or anything else?
Thanks
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cwah
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Post by cwah on Sept 15, 2020 22:12:10 GMT
That's not helping. it's like all these people talking about stock then say get advice from financial advisor...
Anyone in my situation? What do you do with large irrecoverable losses?
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Mike
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Post by Mike on Sept 15, 2020 22:29:59 GMT
I don't know if this is correct - I have never done it so neither have I properly researched - but if you sell your debt at a discount then would that generate a loss you could offset against capital gains? That is, if you could sell them at a fair price - I don't know if thats even an option now on those platforms.
It might depend on the way the loan parts were created or transferred to you in the first place?
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Post by Harland Kearney on Sept 15, 2020 23:08:33 GMT
The only obvious question is about taxation. You should seek a tax consultant about this, I think even those who might have a understanding here maybe unwilling or unable to provide you with "advice". I was told by my own accountant that losses on P2P loans can only be offset against future P2P income, however this was in 2018 and the rules may have very well changed.
Seek your own advice from a advisor, wouldn't put faith in posts on a board although I imagine your only posting to see what people think, nothing solid.
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Sept 16, 2020 8:00:08 GMT
Hello With the recovery taking years and years. I have less and less hope to get any decent amount back. And after 4 years of wait from lendy,fundingsecure and moneything (have more hope on that one)... i think i have to come to realisation that the money may be lost forever. Even if recovery comes to decent amount, the fees from all the parties involved after 5+ years will eat out any left over. I don't think I'll ever earn enough in P2P interest to recover the capital loss. I'll first recover some of the tax from interest payment during the previous years. But it'll only be a tiny amount covered. Is there anything else I can use to offset the loss? Any offset against income tax, capital gain tax (from stock) or anything else? Thanks I think you can carry forward bad debt (up to 4 years) to be offset against future P2P income, but not offset current bad debt against previous years income. You may be able to modify previous years self assessment if you have good reason. (Or was that statement in your post just a slip?) Read the HMRC documents on P2P income and bad debt carefully (then talk to a tax adviser ).
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daveb
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Post by daveb on Sept 16, 2020 20:23:51 GMT
It's pretty frustrating to have paid tax on the returns in the good days of P2P, then as the losses wipe out income, not to be able to change previous years tax returns. Most of us may never go back to P2P to the level that will allow any of the losses to be offset against anything. The only possible consolation is that some at least may have helped some actual small and medium companies. Best not to think about the money that's gone into the pockets of the crooks and con artists.
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Sept 16, 2020 20:52:05 GMT
It's pretty frustrating to have paid tax on the returns in the good days of P2P, then as the losses wipe out income, not to be able to change previous years tax returns. Most of us may never go back to P2P to the level that will allow any of the losses to be offset against anything. The only possible consolation is that some at least may have helped some actual small and medium companies. Best not to think about the money that's gone into the pockets of the crooks and con artists. Which days were those?
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daveb
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Post by daveb on Sept 16, 2020 20:53:36 GMT
It's pretty frustrating to have paid tax on the returns in the good days of P2P, then as the losses wipe out income, not to be able to change previous years tax returns. Most of us may never go back to P2P to the level that will allow any of the losses to be offset against anything. The only possible consolation is that some at least may have helped some actual small and medium companies. Best not to think about the money that's gone into the pockets of the crooks and con artists. Which days were those? You know, they paid 12% every month and you could sell their loans in 5 minutes when they had 30 days to go
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Sept 16, 2020 21:33:52 GMT
It's pretty frustrating to have paid tax on the returns in the good days of P2P, then as the losses wipe out income, not to be able to change previous years tax returns. Most of us may never go back to P2P to the level that will allow any of the losses to be offset against anything.The only possible consolation is that some at least may have helped some actual small and medium companies. Best not to think about the money that's gone into the pockets of the crooks and con artists. you could offset against any capital gains in excess of the allowance for a few years into the future.
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Sept 17, 2020 7:41:07 GMT
It's pretty frustrating to have paid tax on the returns in the good days of P2P, then as the losses wipe out income, not to be able to change previous years tax returns. Most of us may never go back to P2P to the level that will allow any of the losses to be offset against anything.The only possible consolation is that some at least may have helped some actual small and medium companies. Best not to think about the money that's gone into the pockets of the crooks and con artists. you could offset against any capital gains in excess of the allowance for a few years into the future. Is that (still) allowed? And can you have a capital loss with no prospect of a capital gain? Real questions! I remember reading up on capital gains rules years ago, as to how they could apply to P2P, it seemed to me at the time that P2P losses weren't eligible, although I remember that there were secondary buy/sells on some platforms that were in some way eligible (buying/selling at a profit or loss?). But I had a feeling even that loophole changed when HMRC allowed offsetting of P2P losses against interest, or was it just that income tax relief was much more useful to most people?
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IFISAcava
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Post by IFISAcava on Sept 17, 2020 10:13:23 GMT
you could offset against any capital gains in excess of the allowance for a few years into the future. Is that (still) allowed? And can you have a capital loss with no prospect of a capital gain? Real questions! I remember reading up on capital gains rules years ago, as to how they could apply to P2P, it seemed to me at the time that P2P losses weren't eligible, although I remember that there were secondary buy/sells on some platforms that were in some way eligible (buying/selling at a profit or loss?). But I had a feeling even that loophole changed when HMRC allowed offsetting of P2P losses against interest, or was it just that income tax relief was much more useful to most people? obviously you need a capital gain in excess of annual exemption to offset a capital loss against, and it is time limited - four years? my understanding is that before you were allowed to offset (some) P2P capital losses against P2P interest, you could only do so against capital gains. I haven't done it, so I don't know what the advice would be regarding capital losses due to default v capital losses due to eg selling at a discount - would need proper advice if planning anything I think.
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bigfoot12
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Post by bigfoot12 on Sept 17, 2020 12:14:41 GMT
Is that (still) allowed? And can you have a capital loss with no prospect of a capital gain? You will have to read the HMRC Website yourself, or get an accountant (which outside London might not be as expensive as you think), but yes, from memory the loans have to be to businesses not individuals, but I might be out of date. If you are convinced some of the loans are worthless now (and you have gains to offset), you might be able to make a negligible value claim now (a letter attached to your tax form) to realise the loss now. If they later prove to be worth more than you claimed you would pay tax on the difference. You will need to keep good records if you do this.
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james100
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Post by james100 on Sept 17, 2020 12:30:53 GMT
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cwah
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Post by cwah on Sept 18, 2020 6:24:34 GMT
Thanks I'm trying to understand "Loans that become irrecoverable on or after 6 April 2016 An irrecoverable loan that would have been eligible for capital gains relief as a capital loss under TCGA 1992 will no longer be eligible for that relief. This is because Section 2(3) of TCGA 1992 specifically gives priority to income tax reliefs. However, in a situation where a loan does not meet the conditions for Income tax relief for irrecoverable peer to peer loans then the lender may still be eligible for capital loss relief on the loss that they incur, if the capital loss relief conditions are met. This could also apply if the amount of Income tax relief for irrecoverable peer to peer loans available is limited to less than the full amount lost by the lender. In that case it is also possible that the lender may be eligible for capital loss relief on the remainder of the loss that they incur, if the capital loss relief conditions are met." Does it mean under certain condition it can be offset against capital gain or income tax? And so which ones? Because all the examples they gave on the next page are to offset against future p2p earning... which I know will never be high enough to recover the losses. Note 1: And btw, the loss are under personal account. So I can't use business. Its way simpler as business as loss can be treated as what it is and offset against profit... Note 2: no its not possible to sell. I would have been happy to sell many of my loan with significant loss instead of having them locked down for years...
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james100
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Post by james100 on Sept 18, 2020 7:06:37 GMT
cwah If in doubt, take advice HMRC directly and/or an accountant that is familiar with P2P. I am neither. For info though, the last 2 small paras you quoted were not included in the original version of the document and the examples you mention on the "next page" AIUI were only based on the original document.
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