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Post by moonraker on Oct 5, 2020 17:00:01 GMT
A friend of mine is having trouble finding a house to rent - most properties on the market are snapped up very quickly - and through no fault of hers she has a poor credit rating, so doesn't get very far when she does try to negotiate a deal.
I've offered to be her guarantor and seem to tick most of the boxes - but it appears that I might be asked for proof of annual income. Only I can't find any. I file my returns online and all I can locate in my records are statements of tax due and paid. Any clues are obfuscated by my minimising my 40% tax through VCTs and Gift Aid donations. I'm retired, so have no employer to vouch for my salary. No doubt an accountant or solicitor could look at my investment paperwork and be assured that I could meet any obligation, but that seems a bit of a faff.
This is just one of those whimsical observations, and - PLEASE - no comments on the wisdom of becoming a guarantor. I'm just noting the oddity that I seem to have no easy way of reminding myself of my more-or-less exact income, not to mention proving it.
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easynow
Member of DD Central
Popcorn anyone?
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Post by easynow on Oct 5, 2020 17:57:43 GMT
"I'm just noting the oddity that I seem to have no easy way of reminding myself of my more-or-less exact income, not to mention proving it."
By looking at your earnings declared on your tax return prior to deductions etc?
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Oct 5, 2020 19:21:06 GMT
A friend of mine is having trouble finding a house to rent - most properties on the market are snapped up very quickly - and through no fault of hers she has a poor credit rating, so doesn't get very far when she does try to negotiate a deal.
I've offered to be her guarantor and seem to tick most of the boxes - but it appears that I might be asked for proof of annual income. Only I can't find any. I file my returns online and all I can locate in my records are statements of tax due and paid. Any clues are obfuscated by my minimising my 40% tax through VCTs and Gift Aid donations. I'm retired, so have no employer to vouch for my salary. No doubt an accountant or solicitor could look at my investment paperwork and be assured that I could meet any obligation, but that seems a bit of a faff.
This is just one of those whimsical observations, and - PLEASE - no comments on the wisdom of becoming a guarantor. I'm just noting the oddity that I seem to have no easy way of reminding myself of my more-or-less exact income, not to mention proving it.
I would have thought that you would have to declare all your income on your online tax return (I have to), although I guess that's not proof, but if you pay tax on it..... Or have you not done one recently? You can view your tax returns online and print etc as proof of income or is it declared net of tax deductions? Might be in the workings even then. I believe you should keep 7 years (something like anyway) of records for HMRC in case of query, which should show everything.
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dead-money
Rocket to the Moon
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Post by dead-money on Oct 5, 2020 19:59:05 GMT
A friend of mine is having trouble finding a house to rent - most properties on the market are snapped up very quickly - and through no fault of hers she has a poor credit rating, so doesn't get very far when she does try to negotiate a deal.
I've offered to be her guarantor and seem to tick most of the boxes - but it appears that I might be asked for proof of annual income. Only I can't find any. I file my returns online and all I can locate in my records are statements of tax due and paid. Any clues are obfuscated by my minimising my 40% tax through VCTs and Gift Aid donations. I'm retired, so have no employer to vouch for my salary. No doubt an accountant or solicitor could look at my investment paperwork and be assured that I could meet any obligation, but that seems a bit of a faff.
This is just one of those whimsical observations, and - PLEASE - no comments on the wisdom of becoming a guarantor. I'm just noting the oddity that I seem to have no easy way of reminding myself of my more-or-less exact income, not to mention proving it.
I would have thought that you would have to declare all your income on your online tax return (I have to), although I guess that's not proof, but if you pay tax on it..... Or have you not done one recently? You can view your tax returns online and print etc as proof of income or is it declared net of tax deductions? Might be in the workings even then. I believe you should keep 7 years (something like anyway) of records for HMRC in case of query, which should show everything. Agree, just go to your HMRC tax account online and print out your SA302 calculations for the last few years, that is 'proof of income', acceptable to UK banks, brokers and other similar institutions.
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Post by moonraker on Oct 5, 2020 20:08:58 GMT
I'm still working on my 2019-20 return, so my last one is for 2018-19 which might be too dated, especially with many people's personal finances having been affected by Covid. Looking at the 2018-19 return, it doesn't give a grand total, though someone could readily add up the individual amounts of tax paid on different forms of investments.
I imagine that an unscrupulous person could quite easily complete a 2019-20 form now with inflated figures, get it acknowledged by HMRC, submit it to a landlord or his representative, then change the figures back to the real ones. I would think that a solicitor or professional landlord (as opposed to someone renting out their personal house) would be wise to this and require more substantial proof.
I would not dare do this myself. I aim for 100% accuracy and honesty, with the dread that HMRC might query something or select my return for a random inspection.and then want to look at previous years' returns. I do retain paperwork for seven years, but each year's bundle consists of 40-50 sheets of papers, and that's excluding Hargreaves Lansdown's consolidated tax certificate.
(I suppose that a print-out of my bank statement might satisfy some people ...)
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dead-money
Rocket to the Moon
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Post by dead-money on Oct 5, 2020 23:36:54 GMT
I'm still working on my 2019-20 return, so my last one is for 2018-19 which might be too dated, especially with many people's personal finances having been affected by Covid. Looking at the 2018-19 return, it doesn't give a grand total, though someone could readily add up the individual amounts of tax paid on different forms of investments.
I imagine that an unscrupulous person could quite easily complete a 2019-20 form now with inflated figures, get it acknowledged by HMRC, submit it to a landlord or his representative, then change the figures back to the real ones. I would think that a solicitor or professional landlord (as opposed to someone renting out their personal house) would be wise to this and require more substantial proof.
I would not dare do this myself. I aim for 100% accuracy and honesty, with the dread that HMRC might query something or select my return for a random inspection.and then want to look at previous years' returns. I do retain paperwork for seven years, but each year's bundle consists of 40-50 sheets of papers, and that's excluding Hargreaves Lansdown's consolidated tax certificate.
(I suppose that a print-out of my bank statement might satisfy some people ...)
No the SA302 is the calculation done after you've submitted the return. The calculation clearly shows your total taxable income from all sources.
Once your returns submitted and the calculations done, you can't easily go back and amend the return, that's a sure fire way to trigger an audit!
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starfished
Member of DD Central
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Post by starfished on Oct 6, 2020 13:14:29 GMT
Your latest submitted tax return will be fine. Where relying on tax returns rather than employer payslips they normally ask for three years...
Where people minimise their income legitimately, a recognised consequence is that they may be approved for a lower mortgage, benefits, etc. So it makes sense it impacts how much you can be a guarantor for as well (that is repeated regularly when salary sacrificing for pensions etc).
Very kind of you to be the guarantor.
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Post by moonraker on Oct 6, 2020 15:40:32 GMT
Thanks for your comments. The friend visited me today in between a flurry of viewing houses and there seemed to be a tacit understanding that I wouldn't act as guarantor (though my offer remains). Instead I'll loan her six months' rent for her to pay up front. (My eyes are fully open!) She saw a property this morning that she likes, the owners seemed happy with rent in advance and not bothered about her credit rating, but texted through mid-pm requesting a copy of her passport. (Which I would imagine any would-be tenant is required to provide as proof of ID. She has a British one, but it's apparent from her accent that she has overseas origins.) She tells old-fashioned me that no landlord asks for references nowadays, but a deposit is obviously mandatory.
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starfished
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Post by starfished on Oct 6, 2020 16:09:00 GMT
Asking for a passport is common. Both for ID reasons but also to confirm that the person has a legal right to live in the UK. The fine is hefty for Landlords who do rent to the wrong person.
Which is why I am surprised at the comment about no referencing. A reference that says much that is useful is unlikely (like job references these days, they have become increasingly benign almost to the point of fraudulent) but still usually asked for unless the person has not rented previously or are international. In which case yes, they ask for 6 to 12 months rent up front.
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Greenwood2
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Post by Greenwood2 on Oct 6, 2020 19:14:41 GMT
Thanks for your comments. The friend visited me today in between a flurry of viewing houses and there seemed to be a tacit understanding that I wouldn't act as guarantor (though my offer remains). Instead I'll loan her six months' rent for her to pay up front. (My eyes are fully open!) She saw a property this morning that she likes, the owners seemed happy with rent in advance and not bothered about her credit rating, but texted through mid-pm requesting a copy of her passport. (Which I would imagine any would-be tenant is required to provide as proof of ID. She has a British one, but it's apparent from her accent that she has overseas origins.) She tells old-fashioned me that no landlord asks for references nowadays, but a deposit is obviously mandatory.
I really hope you are right that she is a good person, but there are so many out there who are OK and then are not.
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james100
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Post by james100 on Oct 6, 2020 19:20:56 GMT
You might be interested in a third option, by paying for something like this for her (basically an insurance policy landlords can accept in lieu of guarantor or up front rent payment www.housinghand.co.uk |
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Post by moonraker on Oct 7, 2020 11:59:39 GMT
I really hope you are right that she is a good person, but there are so many out there who are OK and then are not. I have a philosophical attitude about offering her help. I did get badly burnt last year with a comparable gesture when another beneficiary ran into all sorts of problems, but I was treating that as a high-risk loan. (The sum involved was .0083% of my portfolio, I've just calculated!)
At present I'm even more philosophical because there's hardly any form of attractive investment for my money and there's increasing talk of a wealth tax and of increases in inheritance tax, so she might as well benefit.
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