corto
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one-syllabistic
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Post by corto on Jul 18, 2022 13:13:26 GMT
You can only transfer fluid money and you may not be able to force them to do it.
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steveb
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Post by steveb on Jul 18, 2022 13:17:33 GMT
Considering the state of the loan book I don't really think there was any alternative.
Let's just hope the loans now get sorted out without too much of a loss.
Steve
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TitoPuente
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Post by TitoPuente on Jul 18, 2022 13:19:15 GMT
How would an ISA transfer work when all the investments are stuck? Only cash. Through a partial transfer.
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archie
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Post by archie on Jul 18, 2022 13:21:18 GMT
You can only transfer fluid money and you may not be able to force them to do it. Yes I know you can only transfer cash but it could take years to repay some of it. I was wondering if there was a way to initiate the transfer with returns transferred to the new ISA as available. I suspect not but worth a try.
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corto
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one-syllabistic
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Post by corto on Jul 18, 2022 13:27:55 GMT
You can only transfer fluid money and you may not be able to force them to do it. Yes I know you can only transfer cash but it could take years to repay some of it. I was wondering if there was a way to initiate the transfer with returns transferred to the new ISA as available. I suspect not but worth a try. Of course, stuff that is locked in now may need a long time to be dealt with; you may (and that is likely) have losses. I would also like to point out that ABL has significant transfer out fees. You would not want to do transfers for smallish amounts. For "smallish" cash amounts in ABL it would probably make sense to ditch the ISA status.
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optimist
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Post by optimist on Jul 18, 2022 17:00:53 GMT
Depends on timescales As interest rates rise it may be worth investing elsewhere but other than RBS there are few options at similar rates (please correct me if you know anything 10% +) Our cash (liquid) should be safe, so waiting to transfer out seems the best option to avoid fees. Cash will not disappear
Sad to see Abl go. A year ago this was my safe option for investment...
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starfished
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Post by starfished on Jul 18, 2022 18:19:27 GMT
Is someone willing to share their email here? I have not received an email on wind up yet...?
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Post by overthehill on Jul 18, 2022 18:25:00 GMT
Is someone willing to share their email here? I have not received an email on wind up yet...?
Probably in the junk email folder !
Orderly Wind Down of Ablrate Loan Book
8 years ago this month, on the 14th July 2014, was the official opening day of the Ablrate platform. Since that day we have done our best to provide good returns to investors and innovate in the P2P space.
So it is with regret that I am informing you of our decision to execute the orderly wind down of the Ablrate loan book and its P2P activities.
Firstly, let me say this; we are not going out of business, this has been a voluntary restriction we have placed upon ourselves and we will continue to work until the loan book is settled. We have a reasonable outlook financially as we continue to receive our commission element from loans that are paying or settling as well as recovering direct costs from others. So the business, barring any outside financial pressure, should be able to continue with loan recoveries until the book is settled or brought to a conclusion.
The decision is to put in place the voluntary restriction to not to take on new customers, amongst other commitments. The FCA have been notified of the commencement of the wind down, Ablrate remains a regulated firm and will do so until the process is complete.
The decision has not been taken lightly so I would like to explain why we are now on this path as it is a combination of the economic outlook, some of the challenges on our loan book, and regulatory trajectory.
It is a challenging environment for small businesses. Interest rates are likely to rise putting pressure on incomes and already retail sales are being hit putting pressure on the wider economic outlook. Strikes and resultant potential wage hikes may fuel inflation in the short term and add to the volatility of the economy adding additional risk to lenders and our business.
An element of the loan book, as you know, has seen some challenges and we are expended a huge amount of time on sorting out a few of the borrowers. Fortunately, we have stabilised some loans and we can see the light on the servicing and settlement of some of these loans.
There are also loans from a small number of borrowers we cannot recover from our own efforts, so collection has been passed to insolvency specialists, and inevitably there maybe others that enter that process as the collection procedure continues. When loans enter this process, our work does not stop and we feel our small team is better focused now on recovery of those loans than new business.
A consequence of the wind down is that the Loan Exchange will not reopen. There are some borrowers on the platform that are exploring other ways that your loans could be traded and we are assisting them with this. For clarity this does not involve low-ball bids for them, we will make it clear to borrowers that our wind down procedure increases our capacity to work on recovery, it does not diminish it.
Lastly, the P2P industry was an excellent innovation, and something designed to allow lenders to have the opportunity to gain good returns by lending directly to small companies and consumers. Light touch regulation allowed the industry to grow but some failures in the P2P industry, and the wider alternative finance industry, prompted a review of the space and further regulations followed, with a complete ban on the mini bond market for example.
When planning for the future as a business we have to make assumptions on the trajectory of rules. Our opinion, having read the consultation documents, is that the trajectory of regulation is more restrictions, more complex platform reporting to prove those restrictions are working and, one would assume, if they are not working to the regulators' stated goals then further restrictions will apply. If the proposed ruling of banning incentives to invest comes to pass, our opinion is that it is likely that Instant Returns would be banned, of which borrowers have paid over £200,000 since it was implemented. Put all this together and, commercially, it is a difficult circle to square as it is uncertain where that trajectory ends. You can view the consultation here.
The FCA's job is to protect customers from what they see as potential harm so more restrictions and rules is always going to be a factor. We have not always agreed with the FCA on their interpretation of the rules nor their implementation of some of them. However, we have always had cordial relations with the regulator and respect the fact that they have a job to do.
It is the combination of the above factors, not any one individually, that has created an environment where it is the Director’s opinion that an orderly wind down of the company’s P2P activities is best for lenders and the best for our business.
Operational Arrangements
Changes to our Website
We will shortly be making the necessary changes to our website and landing pages, however, access to your account will be unaffected via the usual login button.
Access to your Ablrate Account
You will continue to be able to access your Ablrate account in the normal manner, as we will no longer be offering new loans, we would encourage you to withdraw any surplus cash balance on your account.
We have begun contacting a number of customers who have had funds on account for some time and we are encouraging them to return those funds to their accounts as there will be no new loans and the account is not interest bearing.
Payments to your Lender Account
Standard monthly interest, capital & interest, and settlement payments will continue to be credited to your account upon receipt from the Borrowers in the normal manner.
Monthly Payments / Deposits
If you currently deposit funds to your Ablrate account on a regular basis via standing order, we would ask you contact your bank to cancel the instruction.
Withdrawals from your Lender Account
Withdrawals will be processed twice weekly (currently proposed to be Tuesday & Friday) with effect from 1st August, until that date, withdrawals will continue to be processed daily. The request procedure remains the same.
Tax Statement
Your tax statement will continue to be generated annually.
Your IFISA
To withdraw any cash balance from your IFISA account to your designated bank account, you should follow the normal withdrawal process. You should however be aware that this type of withdrawal will result in the loss of the ISA (tax free) wrapper.
To maintain the ISA wrapper, funds (cash only) can be transferred out a new ISA provider. Please contact your new ISA provider to initiate their transfer in process.
Ablrate will waive our standard fee and cover the cost of the first transfer out from your IFISA account in each financial year, thereafter our usual charge will apply.
Your SIPP/ SASS
Any withdrawals will continue to be paid to your designated SIPP provider’s bank account via the normal process.
Adjustment in Service Levels
Going forward Ablrate will have a smaller team, and thus we will be operating with reduced staffing levels and replies may take a little longer.
Getting in contact with us
The most effective way to contact with us, will be as before, via email. All queries should be directed to the mailbox info@ablrate.com rather than any personal email accounts that maybe not or infrequently monitored.
Our contact telephone number remains +44 (0)1491 410400, if you do wish to contact us via telephone, however, the customer service line with only be available between 10am-12noon Monday to Friday.
Ablrate Communications
Lenders will continue to receive the standard system generated email notifications as well as ad hoc updates from the Ablrate team in the normal way as we have material news.
An update for each loan will be provided on a quarterly basis, or more frequently if there is a significant change in the loan or the borrower.
Wind Down Plan
Our wind down plan lays out certain actions that may happen in the event of a wind down. We are reviewing this plan with Thistle Compliance and aim to update lenders on the wind down plan when those have been formalised. It does not affect the way we are dealing with your loans and does not delay repayments or action taken against borrowers, it is an internally agreed procedure for moving forward.
Complaints
We are aware that lenders may have concerns and may also have complaints. Our Complaints policy can be viewed here and if you have a query please use the info@ablrate.com email as it feeds into a central ticketing system where the team can deal with your query.
I want to assure you that our number one priority is getting the book settled/serviced as quickly as possible. The alternative trading of loans is something we are willing to work with borrowers on and we are looking at the possibility of loans being sold to other lenders at par (but you will, of course, have the ultimate say on if you sell or not). We will update you as we unwind your positions and as any such offers come in.
Finally, 8 years ago we started receiving feedback, good and bad, from lenders, it has never stopped since and for this I would like to thank you. In the good times you always kept us in check, when things didn't go to plan and dealing with things was incredibly stressful, there was always an email from a random customer with words of encouragement.
This is just one of the reasons that it is important to us to continue the work on the book for our lenders to get the best result possible. We cannot promise full recovery but by the time the book is closed we aim to have wrung everything out of it for lenders.
Kind Regards,
David Bradley-Ward
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p2pfan
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Post by p2pfan on Jul 18, 2022 18:30:13 GMT
Next judgment is on the way that the remaining staff handle the orderly wind down of the loan book. I wish them well. It is no easy task & that there are other opportunities that they may wish to pursue could be a distraction. As I see it, there is now no reason to go easy on lenders to sustain the attractiveness of the platform to future borrowers. That could lead to Ablrate using some stronger options to get paid more quickly. I think Ablrate is is a good position to deliver a successful orderly wind down. I sincerely hope that is the case. We've all got a lot of money depending on it. However, my real fear is that the staff - a dwindling number of staff as the email states - will not have the motivation to (a) remain at Ablrate and (b) aggressively pursue the outstanding very stubborn debtors. What is the incentive for them to put every ounce of energy they have into pursuing the debtors? Why would they not be spending their time on Indeed.com looking for other jobs? Or, in the case of DBW, prioritising pursuing initiatives in the crypto-exchange realm, which has been his overriding passion for many a moon? Ablrate has been truly dismal in being able to get payments from lenders when they were "in business", so why would they be any better when they are in "wind down"? As they have rinsed excuses for non-payments such as "Brexit" and "Covid" for everything they can over the last few years, in today's email they are already pipelining an avalanche of new excuses they will be going to town with over the coming years: strikes, rising interest rates, inflation, wage increases etc.
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starfished
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Post by starfished on Jul 18, 2022 18:41:08 GMT
Is someone willing to share their email here? I have not received an email on wind up yet...?
Probably in the junk email folder !
[snip]
Thanks! Nothing in Junk folder. All I have had from them today was an email on repayment on the LAR stock loan. Odd. I'll follow up if it doesn't show up by tomorrow.
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investibod
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Post by investibod on Jul 18, 2022 18:48:02 GMT
Let us hope that the orderly run down works better than it did for MoneyThing.
We have seen that once the business goes to minimum cash flow in a run down phase, it takes very little to push it into administration. I really hope that history does not repeat itself with the same thing happening to Ablrate.
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ilmoro
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Post by ilmoro on Jul 18, 2022 18:53:38 GMT
One question that hasnt been answered ... which will be relevant to ISA transfers ... is whether you will be able to replace funds withdrawn from the ISA under flexibility? If you can then the logical thing to do is withdraw funds as they become available and then replace them when there is sufficient to make the one free transfer. Obviously question is where you put them in the meantime. I doubt anyone has funded an ISA with Abl this year but if so remember that current year funds withdrawn from a flexible ISA can be deposited into a current year ISA of a different type without requiring a transfer to be done www.gov.uk/guidance/manage-isa-subscriptions-for-your-investors#f-isa
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starfished
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Post by starfished on Jul 18, 2022 19:39:51 GMT
Let us hope that the orderly run down works better than it did for MoneyThing.
We have seen that once the business goes to minimum cash flow in a run down phase, it takes very little to push it into administration. I really hope that history does not repeat itself with the same thing happening to Ablrate.
In Moneything's case you had a vocal minority calling for administration as well. In their position I would have probably caved in sooner. I hope everyone has now learnt enough about administration to understand that is never the better option.
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Post by Ace on Jul 18, 2022 20:38:31 GMT
Have any ABLrate shareholders been informed of the wind-down? I'm a shareholder and haven't been notified. No updates on crowdcube for a very long time, despite questions being asked.
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Post by df on Jul 18, 2022 20:58:23 GMT
Let us hope that the orderly run down works better than it did for MoneyThing.
We have seen that once the business goes to minimum cash flow in a run down phase, it takes very little to push it into administration. I really hope that history does not repeat itself with the same thing happening to Ablrate.
That was my first thought when I read this e-mail I guess the only thing we can do now is trying to stay hopeful.
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