p2pfan
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Post by p2pfan on Mar 20, 2024 12:48:41 GMT
You're very right rscal. No update on my case as well. It's obvious that Assetz Capital are throwing a spanner in the works to try to slow down the process for my and other cases. By buying time, they will be able to put themselves into administration at some point or other (just like Ablrate recently) and not have to repay anyone, even those were successful with their FOS claims. The scandal is that the FOS are in collusion with Assetz Capital on this. I chase the FOS up regularly, but, all these months later, am just fobbed off with excuses that the matter is being investigated by the Ombudsman etc.
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pikestaff
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Post by pikestaff on Apr 3, 2024 14:01:16 GMT
Update from my investigator today:
"As you are already aware, our service has received several complaints regarding Assetz in recent months, and we are diligently reviewing their actions.
We are currently in the process of reviewing Assetz’s response, and we aim to provide our findings in due course.
I’ll be in touch once I have an update. Thanks again for your patience."
Which I think is in line with updates some have already had.
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pikestaff
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Post by pikestaff on Apr 3, 2024 14:12:17 GMT
What's the latest on this? The FOS is a public sector body and therefore extraordinarily inefficient. AC have challenged the decision but not submitted the reasoning for their challenge. The deadline for AC to do so has long since passed. Therefore, my FOS investigator has said she is placing the complaint in a queue for the ombudsman's "final decision". That is not fair, because the decision was already found in my favour. I keep chasing her to finally resolve matters, but expect months more of waiting. Not so, I'm afraid. The case officer's findings are not in themselves a decision, unless the offending party accepts them. The FOS clearly does now have a detailed response (or responses) from Assetz, and my impression is that it will be considering it/them on a consolidated basis. How many rounds of correspondence this will involve is anyone's guess, but the FOS's final decision will happen only at the end of the process.
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duck
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Post by duck on Apr 13, 2024 3:55:25 GMT
I received findings yesterday. A very long statement that can be summed up in 3 sentences
"I’ve considered these arguments, and I’m not persuaded to depart from our finding that a Court would likely find the variation clause was unfair."
"Based on what I’ve seen, I’m satisfied Assetz carried out financial forecasting for the various options available - and considered the best outcome for investors - before they decided to wind down with a lender fee."
"Based on what I’ve seen, I don’t think Assetz SME Capital Limited needs to take any action."
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rscal
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Post by rscal on Apr 13, 2024 5:56:20 GMT
I really want to challenge but the grounds are narrow and I think comes down to: "the investigation has erred" in accepting a spreadsheet and last minute stuff like that which allowed them to conclude; "well, it could have been worse!"
SUNDAY 14th Edit: I am thinking of what's wrong or 'improper' in the conclusion I received. A lot is made of the correctness of the approach AC took that considered no-fee wind down one option - meaning they only resorted to a fee because their 'model' said so. But if redundancies were always a part of the splitting exercise for AC, were they not front loading costs? Is that not a self-fulfilling prophecy? Because the substitution of the fee was said to be required offset the likelihood of a 'operating deficit' arising but what's 'operational' about job cutting? I think I have my point of contention!]
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iRobot
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Post by iRobot on Apr 13, 2024 11:09:11 GMT
This line interested me:
Contrast this to the following from the Platform's own published wind-down arrangements: The following is just a string of thoughts, which could be laid out more coherently, but hopefully still gets the 'message' across...
# Which suggest their published wind-down model was no longer fit for purpose. # Which suggest something changed to alter the covering capability of the monitoring income # When was the forecast model - as referenced above - produced? # What is (are) the difference(s) between the above-referenced model and the one originally generated which satisfied both AC and the FCA that the original model - and the wind-down plan it supported - was fit for purpose? # What monitoring was in place to ensure the modelling as applied to that original wind-down plan still accurately reflected the current picture and its' effects on forecasts?
I appreciate risk modelling is as much art as science with plenty of presumptions and out-and-out assumptions being used, but the above smacks of amateur hour to me.
That may sound harsh, but AC's decision to wind down it's Retail element was a (presumably) well-considered, carefully thought through business decision. This wasn't a black-swan event that threw up a number of unforeseeable issues, forcing AC to activate it's wind-down plan.
Either there are factors at play that aren't being disclosed or the capabilities of AC's leadership team might be considered to be somewhat questionable, to say the least...
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Apr 13, 2024 12:51:09 GMT
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Post by crabbyoldgit on Apr 15, 2024 13:47:07 GMT
It would not surprise me if all the assets, building , furniture, IT, cups and saucers went to the institutional side and now are being rented back for use by the retail side. £5 for boiling kettle, £1 a week per cup , ect ect. Soon adds up, office space , toilet use fees, all sorts of opportunities.
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duck
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Post by duck on Apr 15, 2024 16:10:10 GMT
It would not surprise me if all the assets, building , furniture, IT, cups and saucers went to the institutional side and now are being rented back for use by the retail side. £5 for boiling kettle, £1 a week per cup , ect ect. Soon adds up, office space , toilet use fees, all sorts of opportunities. I have asked questions of the FOS.
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rscal
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Post by rscal on Apr 15, 2024 16:50:31 GMT
“Consequently, and as also required by Regulations, we have devised a “Standby Plan” which is intended to ensure that even if we decide – or are obliged – to stop operating our peer-to-peer lending platform at any point in the future, the investments which have been made through it are not impacted.”
and...
"If there is insufficient funding available to pay for the costs of collecting the loan repayments over the life of the loans, that activity may cease leaving no means to return lenders investments to them – in our estimation, the [Borrower Fee] income Assetz Capital is entitled to under the loan agreements is more than sufficient to cover the expected costs of winding down the loan book"
but alas there was no scope for funding redundancies in the original plan I assume? 'Different horses for different courses'?. The first statement becomes a model in vacuity - saying nothing in practice - whereas the second is more substantive amounting to a "we did a spreadsheet" and ticked some boxes. But in law where is the disclaimer that you many not rely on estimations once the ink dries?
(..and where does that leave us saying the Investigator erred?)
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duck
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Post by duck on Apr 19, 2024 5:59:20 GMT
Slightly off topic but obviously connected.
I submitted a FOI to the FCA about the AC wind down. They sidestepped so I went to 'review' where the FCA again sidestepped. (FWIW I found it very ironic that the FCA quoted the Andrew Bailey / Lord Myners correspondence since I and one of the 'lings' wrote the questions that Lord Myners asked) This correspondence dates back to April 2023
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rscal
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Post by rscal on Apr 19, 2024 7:29:40 GMT
"This is because.." is actually a diversion since (it's stating the bleedin obvious, and...) The 'because' is actually because the Fees are front loaded to pay for additional things like redundancies - how they try to pass that off as "redundancies and one off costs naturally reduce over time as the number of loans reduces" is amazing.
"but equally.."? How about the existing monitoring income? Again with the selectivity. AC really is being too modest in not flaunting how effectively Monitoring Fees continue to hum on in the background, extracting additional value from dead loans via its priority over lender interest-to-capital-haircut-pipeline. In fact they should patent the process! " PLEASE, Ducky! Not in front of the children. "
" .. but don't embarrass us by asking the 'what' of it because that would need a bigger postage stamp. "
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rscal
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Post by rscal on Apr 19, 2024 10:22:01 GMT
ALERT...
19/4: I've just 11.10am sent my 'additional information' letter through the Investigator (hitting the '1 week mark') so at least an Ombudsman will have to MENTION some of my disagreement - otherwise asking for a 'review/final decision' is a formality and I won't let it go at that - might as well just sat on my hands.
You now have seven more days to at least contest this outcome - or to do so and ask for 'more time' to get your letter in.
26/4: SECOND letter 11.55am just ahead of the standard 14 day deadline with additional information. I think I'll stop there...
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Post by giammy on Apr 22, 2024 7:42:48 GMT
I'm watching this space to confirm how to respond to the Investigator.
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rscal
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Post by rscal on Apr 22, 2024 11:11:27 GMT
Claims of not being profitable were 'cited' by the FOS ("Assetz honestly believed.... FOS cannot substitute our judgement (etc)...") in support of its view that AC demonstrated a need to Fee Meanwhile AC did a little capital raise just four months before they pulled the shutters - in which they only said good things about themselves What does this 'prove'? By itself not very much. But the alleged rapid change of fortune of its (group) financial position ought to be sufficient to raise questions whether AC has provided that 'compelling' case that (sometime) after 2022 started they were in sufficient trouble they had to
i) close the retail and run it off and ii) could only justify the costs of that with the buffer of fee income (over and above the Monitoring Fees)
BTW Monitoring Fees just run on and on once recoveries start - and AC's 'work' with recoveries isn't even a part of the Fee-supported runoff loanbook* - except, when a loan goes into recovery the MF is automatically paid ahead of capital recovery I believe (but I could be wrong on the detail) so they are covered. Now if AC can claim to 'do recoveries' with just one set of fees why did they need two (MF plus Lender Fee) for the loans that actually perform and (hopefully) payback? ...disingenious to the end if not 'profit margins' then what is the effect .. it's to lift the group if not into profit then possibly into "EBITDA, minus exceptional funding costs, positive" ?
*oh, I forgot. If they don't get a full recovery we are in a Lender capital-loss-but-MF-backpaid scenario whereas if (it evers happens) they recovered all the capital with enough to pay them and our normal interest too, then they will claim (from the same interest only the following months, the Lender Fee worked out on the basis the loan performed 'in the end') Complicated aren't they?
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