beh
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Post by beh on Feb 14, 2017 10:44:43 GMT
Was thinking larger blocks of flats would have a lower void rate but at a glance it does seem to be a trend on some recent listings. Perhaps they realised they were being too conservative? Although the Harrogate one is 3.8% void and 0% growth assumed.
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Post by scepticalinvestor on Mar 10, 2017 10:54:56 GMT
I was pleasantly surprised (but sceptical) to see that PP were offering 3.56% yield on 2 townhouses in Mitcham (South London). It seemed too good to be true, and alas it was.
The offer is essentially two 4-bed townhouses (open plan kitchen/reception/dining area) with a floor area of around 1200 sqft (small/average for a 4 bed house). I looked at the financials and was startled by the assumptions included - a monthly rent of £2,650 per house.
I had a quick look at Zoopla for 4 bed houses in a quarter mile radius of the house -
- 10 houses available (2 houses already let) - average rent asked is £2250 - the asking rents ranged from £1995 to £2600 (the 2 houses already let were at £2,000) - almost all these houses were significantly bigger than PP's townhouses
To summarise, I'd be surprised if they got anything in excess of £2,300 (at most) for these houses. There is no dearth of houses available for rent in the area and practically speaking, 4 bed town houses (with their extremely small 4th bedroom in the loft area) are competing with 3 beds as well. As for the 1.9% void assumption (~5 days in a year), that will probably be blown out of the water just by the few weeks (at least) it'll take to market these properties and get tenants on board!
I wish PP actually spent time looking for better value properties rather than playing with figures to project a better yield. It'll only lead to investor disappointment later on.
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Post by sayyestocress on Mar 10, 2017 11:42:42 GMT
I wish PP actually spent time looking for better value properties rather than playing with figures to project a better yield. It'll only lead to investor disappointment later on.
In their defense they have met or exceeded their projected dividends for all their investment opportunities to date (see their open house data/blog), which is more than can be said of PM (I'm looking at you SPV47). I'm inclined to trust them based on that track record until the situation becomes otherwise. If they are taking a few more liberties with their sums then that should become apparent in time and will dent confidence in the platform.
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Post by scepticalinvestor on Mar 10, 2017 12:17:15 GMT
Let's hope so, most of my property investing has been through PP based in part on their conservative assumptions, past performance and refreshing transparency in general. While I definitely won't be investing in these houses in Mitcham based on their figures, I will be interested in seeing how close to the projected rent they end up at.
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beh
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Post by beh on Apr 12, 2017 21:51:14 GMT
Good review by Neil Neil_P2PBlog - p2pblog.co.uk/property-partner-review/ I'd be happy if they copied Betfair's interface. Although curious as to "I’m selling some out of Property Partner, the returns have been poor in comparison [to PM] and I’m worried that they are releasing new developments so quickly that there is no demand on the secondary market." (from p2pblog.co.uk/march-income-report/)Surely performance is a bit too early to call? Have you been particularly lucky on PM or unlucky on PP? Anecdotally it does feel like prices on the SM dip slightly in response to multiple new listings. They do need to attract more users to balance supply/demand although thinking more 3-4 years from now when existing properties are up for exit in addition to any new listings.
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Neil_P2PBlog
P2P Blogger
Use @p2pblog to tag me :-)
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Post by Neil_P2PBlog on Apr 12, 2017 23:07:58 GMT
Thanks for posting the review beh! I think I have been particularly lucky on PM (able to sell on SM at high premium) and perhaps unlucky on PP (joining just after brexit). One difference I came across when writing the review that I hadn't thought of before is the way that PP give all the initial transactional fees all up front & separate when you first purchase, whereas PM charge their initial buyer's fee within the SPV itself. So perhaps PM is better to buy and resell on SM, PP for buy and hold long term.
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Post by sayyestocress on Apr 13, 2017 8:04:32 GMT
I think I have been particularly lucky on PM (able to sell on SM at high premium) and perhaps unlucky on PP (joining just after brexit). Conversely anything I have tried to sell on the SM on PM have been glacial to non-existent with no premium and on PP I have had no trouble shifting the shares I overbought to counter potential scale back at a small premium. Though this may be because I've been trying to get rid of the less than stellar properties on PM. I did make a tidy profit selling off some of my SPV 56 though. Probably thanks to the way PM values the shares on that one.
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beh
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Post by beh on Apr 13, 2017 18:30:22 GMT
Aye, relatively content to hold, I hope that's the same for most people on PP. Doesn't make sense to sell before transaction fees have been covered, and then some.
Still a bit of a gulf between valuations and the lowest available share price but overall a ~4% premium across my properties for the latter. Older listings do appear to fare better.
Not on PM, impression I'd got skimming recent threads was similar to sytc's comments but good to hear that's not always the case.
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beh
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Post by beh on May 20, 2017 16:14:14 GMT
Doesn't look like the Frome one is going to be fully funded, been stuck at ~80% for a while and £100k in 4 days seems optimistic.
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hazellend
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Post by hazellend on May 21, 2017 8:45:54 GMT
Doesn't look like the Frome one is going to be fully funded, been stuck at ~80% for a while and £100k in 4 days seems optimistic. I'm guessing people saving their money for the other property coming on Wednesday which has a net yield of 4.99% and 16% BMV. Will probably be scaled back.
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Post by sayyestocress on May 24, 2017 10:26:35 GMT
I'm guessing people saving their money for the other property coming on Wednesday which has a net yield of 4.99% and 16% BMV. Will probably be scaled back. You weren't wrong; I got scaled back to less than a third of what I 'pre-ordered'. By far the biggest scale back I've seen.
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macq
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Post by macq on Aug 7, 2017 12:22:41 GMT
quick question for people using PP and the answer may be in their very good faq section but my eyes have just glazed over reading it all But was wondering what happens after 5 years if the property is sold to the people who are renting,can the property only be sold to landlords there by losing some buyers or do they have to move out?
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nrw
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Post by nrw on Aug 8, 2017 7:39:44 GMT
quick question for people using PP and the answer may be in their very good faq section but my eyes have just glazed over reading it all But was wondering what happens after 5 years if the property is sold to the people who are renting,can the property only be sold to landlords there by losing some buyers or do they have to move out? I believe that the aim is to find a sufficient number of buyers 'on platform' to match the number of sellers at the five year exit points - ergo, the properties would never leave the platform. This suits PP (maximising AUM), suits the sellers (as they have a buyer) and suits those investors who wish to 'stick'. In the event that there isn't sufficient liquidity then Property Partner is obliged to sell the property at the best price it can achieve in the open market. In this situation, the treatment of the tenant will be at the discretion of the new buyer - subject to any remaining tenancy agreement - as it is with the purchaser of any tenanted property. The majority of PP tenancies will doubtless be ASTs, which typically enable the landlord to serve two months' notice on the tenant - something I'm sure PP will be increasingly aware of as the 5 year exit point draws closer.
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bfish
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Post by bfish on Aug 8, 2017 7:59:45 GMT
I believe that the aim is to find a sufficient number of buyers 'on platform' to match the number of sellers at the five year exit points - ergo, the properties would never leave the platform. This suits PP (maximising AUM), suits the sellers (as they have a buyer) and suits those investors who wish to 'stick'. In the event that there isn't sufficient liquidity then Property Partner is obliged to sell the property at the best price it can achieve in the open market. In this situation, the treatment of the tenant will be at the discretion of the new buyer - subject to any remaining tenancy agreement - as it is with the purchaser of any tenanted property. The majority of PP tenancies will doubtless be ASTs, which typically enable the landlord to serve two months' notice on the tenant - something I'm sure PP will be increasingly aware of as the 5 year exit point draws closer. Sorry 'nrw', but what does AUM stand for, and what are ASTs ? Cheers 🤓
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Post by dan1 on Aug 8, 2017 8:17:44 GMT
I believe that the aim is to find a sufficient number of buyers 'on platform' to match the number of sellers at the five year exit points - ergo, the properties would never leave the platform. This suits PP (maximising AUM), suits the sellers (as they have a buyer) and suits those investors who wish to 'stick'. In the event that there isn't sufficient liquidity then Property Partner is obliged to sell the property at the best price it can achieve in the open market. In this situation, the treatment of the tenant will be at the discretion of the new buyer - subject to any remaining tenancy agreement - as it is with the purchaser of any tenanted property. The majority of PP tenancies will doubtless be ASTs, which typically enable the landlord to serve two months' notice on the tenant - something I'm sure PP will be increasingly aware of as the 5 year exit point draws closer. Sorry 'nrw', but what does AUM stand for, and what are ASTs ? Cheers 🤓 AUM - assets under management ASTs - assured shorthold tenancy
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