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Post by yorkshireman on Mar 10, 2015 13:53:08 GMT
Why is loan 46 tradeable when a payment due 7 March is outstanding?
And
Why is loan 68 showing investments paused when £675.76 worth of units appear to have come on the market since last night? (I’ll stand corrected on this as I’ve no proof and I’m going entirely from memory)
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Post by chris on Mar 10, 2015 15:30:40 GMT
Why is loan 46 tradeable when a payment due 7 March is outstanding? And Why is loan 68 showing investments paused when £675.76 worth of units appear to have come on the market since last night? (I’ll stand corrected on this as I’ve no proof and I’m going entirely from memory) There's now a 3 day grace period before loans are frozen as per lender requests on this forum and my posting on the site updates thread.
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sl75
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Post by sl75 on Mar 10, 2015 17:15:58 GMT
There's now a 3 day grace period before loans are frozen as per lender requests on this forum and my posting on the site updates thread. It is my opinion that this facility will be abused. i.e. the more sophisticated lenders will "dump" their holdings during the 3 day "grace period" when they become aware that a payment seems to have been been missed. Perhaps there could be an option for whether ones own target should be active during such "grace periods"? Not everyone will want to participate in buying up loan units being sold after a payment is known to have been missed...
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Mar 10, 2015 17:46:28 GMT
Seconded. There needs to be (at least) 3 classes of loan - OK, tradeable, paused/RBR - not tradeable, and 'somewhat dented' - tradeable only between consenting adults, autobuy/etc not allowed. Exactly the same problem seen on FC (where they do at least halt trading as soon as it is late) where autobid/buy will hoover up dented parts if they become tradeable again. If this sort of facility is not available then everyone has to read every loan's comments / status every time and manually twiddle with their desired allocations, which is not very good use of time.
OK, payments due on a Sunday might be waved through if they show up on Monday, (likewise bank holidays), but generic '3 days grace' is too much sloppy, IMO.
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Mar 10, 2015 18:10:46 GMT
There's now a 3 day grace period before loans are frozen as per lender requests on this forum and my posting on the site updates thread. It is my opinion that this facility will be abused. i.e. the more sophisticated lenders will "dump" their holdings during the 3 day "grace period" when they become aware that a payment seems to have been been missed. Perhaps there could be an option for whether ones own target should be active during such "grace periods"? Not everyone will want to participate in buying up loan units being sold after a payment is known to have been missed... For example, Ive picked up a chunk of #46 today whereas previously Ive only gained sharpnel. Not particularly worried in this instance as hard LTV is good.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Mar 10, 2015 18:56:20 GMT
... generic '3 days grace' is too much sloppy, IMO. I have to agree. The issue was that a payment due at a weekend and not paid in advance meant trading was suspended. A blanket grace period is a crude remedy that solves that issue but causes others. A loan with a payment due on Monday that wasn't paid wouldn't have trading suspended until late in the week, and that will allow lenders to take advantage of other lenders. What's needed is a system that suspends trading when a payment is one working day late. chris: It that too difficult to arrange?
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Post by chris on Mar 10, 2015 19:01:29 GMT
... generic '3 days grace' is too much sloppy, IMO. I have to agree. The issue was that a payment due at a weekend and not paid in advance meant trading was suspended. A blanket grace period is a crude remedy that solves that issue but causes others. A loan with a payment due on Monday that wasn't paid wouldn't have trading suspended until late in the week, and that will allow lenders to take advantage of other lenders. What's needed is a system that suspends trading when a payment is one working day late. chris: It that too difficult to arrange? I'll put it to the business. I've just implemented what I was asked to. I personally preferred locking down the aftermarket around payment time but understand that we had a lot of complaints about this and the warnings it then produced on the site. I suspect that we'll tighten things right up once we've fully automated the bank feed. This is moving ahead now so should be sorted in the next few weeks.
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am
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Post by am on Mar 10, 2015 19:41:35 GMT
Exactly the same problem seen on FC (where they do at least halt trading as soon as it is late) where autobid/buy will hoover up dented parts if they become tradeable again. If this sort of facility is not available then everyone has to read every loan's comments / status every time and manually twiddle with their desired allocations, which is not very good use of time. That doesn't seem to be what FC do. I've got one loan that is downgraded - it was one day late, but an unspecified credit event occurred. I've got another loan that that autobid bought me (I'm not sure that it should have) at a nominal rate of over 27%. That loan has been persistently paying late for about 18 months, without being downgraded (from A+).
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Post by bracknellboy on Mar 10, 2015 20:14:38 GMT
Exactly the same problem seen on FC (where they do at least halt trading as soon as it is late) where autobid/buy will hoover up dented parts if they become tradeable again. If this sort of facility is not available then everyone has to read every loan's comments / status every time and manually twiddle with their desired allocations, which is not very good use of time. That doesn't seem to be what FC do. I've got one loan that is downgraded - it was one day late, but an unspecified credit event occurred. I've got another loan that that autobid bought me (I'm not sure that it should have) at a nominal rate of over 27%. That loan has been persistently paying late for about 18 months, without being downgraded (from A+). That wouldn't be Arthur Daley's Dodgy Motors by any chance ?
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unmadem
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Post by unmadem on Mar 10, 2015 21:20:38 GMT
I have to agree. The issue was that a payment due at a weekend and not paid in advance meant trading was suspended. A blanket grace period is a crude remedy that solves that issue but causes others. A loan with a payment due on Monday that wasn't paid wouldn't have trading suspended until late in the week, and that will allow lenders to take advantage of other lenders. What's needed is a system that suspends trading when a payment is one working day late. chris: It that too difficult to arrange? I'll put it to the business. I've just implemented what I was asked to. I personally preferred locking down the aftermarket around payment time but understand that we had a lot of complaints about this and the warnings it then produced on the site. I suspect that we'll tighten things right up once we've fully automated the bank feed. This is moving ahead now so should be sorted in the next few weeks. My memory was that the issue raised was of those payments which fell due on a weekend and were automatically marked as suspended even although it was probably the banking system not allowing it to happen. A blanket 3 day extension does seem a crude solution to this issue rather than allowing any falling on sat or sunday till close of play Monday. I'll accept dealing with bank holidays are more of a challenge.
Good to hear progress on automatic bank feed. Good luck with that.
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Post by chris on Mar 10, 2015 21:24:34 GMT
I'll put it to the business. I've just implemented what I was asked to. I personally preferred locking down the aftermarket around payment time but understand that we had a lot of complaints about this and the warnings it then produced on the site. I suspect that we'll tighten things right up once we've fully automated the bank feed. This is moving ahead now so should be sorted in the next few weeks. My memory was that the issue raised was of those payments which fell due on a weekend and were automatically marked as suspended even although it was probably the banking system not allowing it to happen. A blanket 3 day extension does seem a crude solution to this issue rather than allowing any falling on sat or sunday till close of play Monday. I'll accept dealing with bank holidays are more of a challenge.
Good to hear progress on automatic bank feed. Good luck with that.
It was also with loans where there was an admin delay of a day or two, sometimes where the cash has been received but for some reason or another we've not been able to process the payment immediately.
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Mar 10, 2015 21:55:04 GMT
Exactly the same problem seen on FC (where they do at least halt trading as soon as it is late) where autobid/buy will hoover up dented parts if they become tradeable again. If this sort of facility is not available then everyone has to read every loan's comments / status every time and manually twiddle with their desired allocations, which is not very good use of time. That doesn't seem to be what FC do. I've got one loan that is downgraded - it was one day late, but an unspecified credit event occurred. I've got another loan that that autobid bought me (I'm not sure that it should have) at a nominal rate of over 27%. That loan has been persistently paying late for about 18 months, without being downgraded (from A+). When a loan is 'pending payment' (or even late) FC stop you selling it. As soon as it gets paid (assuming it does) you are free to sell unless/until it gets late again. 'Risk Band Removed' (RBR) is when FC determine it is in serious trouble, and you then can't sell it (at any price) until/unless the risk band is reinstated. There is no penalty for repeated lateness, and autobid/buy will buy parts which were late (even if they were late every month so far) as long as they are not late at the time .. I would prefer FC fixed it so you could either tell autobid not to buy secondary market parts, or at least not to buy 'dented' ones (which were 'once late' .. although the first payment often seemed to suffer from DD failures).
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sl75
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Post by sl75 on Mar 12, 2015 12:05:38 GMT
It was also with loans where there was an admin delay of a day or two, sometimes where the cash has been received but for some reason or another we've not been able to process the payment immediately. I'd tend to think the obvious solution to that problem would be for the admin to tell the system that the payment has been received. Then whenever a payment is DUE the trading can be suspended until an admin has marked the payment as RECEIVED (note, received does NOT imply processed, even though processed should imply received...!)
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Post by chris on Mar 12, 2015 12:18:42 GMT
It was also with loans where there was an admin delay of a day or two, sometimes where the cash has been received but for some reason or another we've not been able to process the payment immediately. I'd tend to think the obvious solution to that problem would be for the admin to tell the system that the payment has been received. Then whenever a payment is DUE the trading can be suspended until an admin has marked the payment as RECEIVED (note, received does NOT imply processed, even though processed should imply received...!) Yeah that's a potential solution. Adds another layer of complexity and potential confusion (roll on the questions as to where a lenders funds are, etc.). If the fully automated solution isn't going to happen soon then I'll look at doing it this way as an interim.
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sl75
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Post by sl75 on Mar 12, 2015 12:33:29 GMT
Yeah that's a potential solution. Adds another layer of complexity and potential confusion (roll on the questions as to where a lenders funds are, etc.)... I think those questions already get asked... The status of "payment has been received, but has not been processed" already exists in the real world. Allowing the system to acknowledge the existence of that status would seem to me to reduce rather than increasing confusion. Obviously it would still be necessary for admin to provide an appropriate explanation of WHY they are unable/unwilling to distribute a payment they've already received... and if they don't provide it up-front, lenders will start asking questions, but I think we already get that with the present system!
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