mikeb
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Post by mikeb on Jan 15, 2014 19:01:08 GMT
I missed the chocolate tea pots loan. Damn. Hoping for a piece of that. Yum yum. I was too dazzled by the company "looking to save people fuel costs by sticking magnets on things" FC loan. I think similar technology may have been tested, to the limit of sanity, by Mythbusters. You can probably guess the result.
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Jan 16, 2014 18:44:36 GMT
FC: about 50 loans last week valued at about £3m Any of the FC ones have any security worth mentioning? Asset security isn't everything. There are currently asset secured loan parts from an A risk band company on sale for 10.5%. Only problem is they appear to have missed as many payments as they have made. Not for me.
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spyrogyra
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Post by spyrogyra on Jan 17, 2014 22:32:51 GMT
Back to TC. I was investing quite regularly until I tried to sell one of the loans through the SM. I put a 2000 slice for sale and only 1000 got sold. I was charged 25. I would have been charged the same amount if I sold the 2000 altogether. Now if I wish to sell the remaining 1000, I have to cough another 25. I know what TC would answer - please monitor your SM auctions.Be glued to the screen is not a very helpful advice, I had enough of this with FC. As interest rates are expected to rise (hopefully!!!) and having in mind most loans will run 3-5 years, I find myself cornered.
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pikestaff
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Post by pikestaff on Jan 18, 2014 0:06:09 GMT
It is poor, not helped by the hard-to-find documentation. However, for future reference, there is a way to deal with this. You need to send an email to resale@thincats.com, before the first auction ends, to say that you will not accept the result unless the whole loan part is sold. Then, if the auction ends in a partial "sale", the "buyer" gets his money back, you are not charged a fee, and you can try again.
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Jan 18, 2014 10:24:39 GMT
Back to TC. I was investing quite regularly until I tried to sell one of the loans through the SM. I put a 2000 slice for sale and only 1000 got sold. I was charged 25. I would have been charged the same amount if I sold the 2000 altogether. Now if I wish to sell the remaining 1000, I have to cough another 25. I know what TC would answer - please monitor your SM auctions.Be glued to the screen is not a very helpful advice, I had enough of this with FC. As interest rates are expected to rise (hopefully!!!) and having in mind most loans will run 3-5 years, I find myself cornered. When I first started investing with TC I looked at the procedures for selling loan parts. It does seem a bit of a Heath Robinson system. Bottom line is that if you are only putting in 1 - 2K at a time, selling is always going to be expensive.
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spyrogyra
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Post by spyrogyra on Jan 19, 2014 10:18:08 GMT
The bottom line is TC took on a big business with a very poor website. And anyway, 1% fee is quite a lot. Especially if a lender decides to sell a slice after a few repayments. The interest rate for the buyer drops significantly if the seller sets up a premium to cover the platform's fee.
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Post by mrclondon on Jan 19, 2014 11:53:20 GMT
Bottom line is that if you are only putting in 1 - 2K at a time, selling is always going to be expensive. And anyway, 1% fee is quite a lot. Especially if a lender decides to sell a slice after a few repayments. The interest rate for the buyer drops significantly if the seller sets up a premium to cover the platform's fee. These points on cost when taken together with the almost useless user interface of the secondary market which must deter potential buyers from bothering to take a look means that for small lenders it is best to assume that you are locked into to the TC loans for the duration. I believe from a post I read on one of the TC forum that most of the recent batch of secondary market offers closed with zero bids.
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spyrogyra
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Post by spyrogyra on Jan 19, 2014 12:03:42 GMT
OK. Do you think it's reasonable to pay 30 pounds for a 3000 sale ? It's 1% of the sum. It works slightly more expensive with 2k and prohibitive for 1k. If I want to invest 25k, and have good diversification ( or reinvest proceeds plus small top up, I have to stick to just 8 loans to optimize the platform's 1%fee. Does 8 loans for 25k of investments sound a reasonably good diversification? AnD was that taken in mind when TC created the SM ?
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pikestaff
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Post by pikestaff on Jan 19, 2014 12:03:57 GMT
To be precise the fee is 1% subject to a minimum of £25 and a maximum of £75, so it favours big lenders and is very expensive for the rest of us. Also sellers are not paid for accrued interest, which could be anything up to another 1%, depending on timing (although in theory buyers may up their price to pay for this).
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pikestaff
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Post by pikestaff on Jan 19, 2014 12:22:05 GMT
These points on cost when taken together with the almost useless user interface of the secondary market which must deter potential buyers from bothering to take a look means that for small lenders it is best to assume that you are locked into to the TC loans for the duration. I believe from a post I read on one of the TC forum that most of the recent batch of secondary market offers closed with zero bids. TBH I don't think the interface is that bad once you get used to it. The offers that closed with no bids were asking for unrealistically high prices / low rates, and some of the current offers will probably suffer the same fate. Timing is important. Second-hand loan parts were fetching high prices in Oct/Nov when there was a glut of new money on the platform, but at the moment it is more of a buyer's market. This is likely to persist until they sort out their platform issues.
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Jan 19, 2014 14:26:28 GMT
The bottom line is TC took on a big business with a very poor website. And anyway, 1% fee is quite a lot. Especially if a lender decides to sell a slice after a few repayments. The interest rate for the buyer drops significantly if the seller sets up a premium to cover the platform's fee. The point I was making is that the procedure is transparent, although not particularly user friendly. For me £25 fee to sell a £1000 loan part is a bit hard to swallow.
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spiral
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Post by spiral on Jan 20, 2014 10:48:55 GMT
For me £25 fee to sell a £1000 loan part is a bit hard to swallow. I think the fundamentals here lie in whether TC see their way forward as attracting 1000 new £1000 lenders or 1 £1M lender. I get the feeling that it is the latter and to that end, the SM suits them just fine.
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pikestaff
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Post by pikestaff on Jan 20, 2014 14:02:31 GMT
TC seem to envisage that smaller lenders would lend primarily through packaged products (at present, their TLC loan series) rather than direct investment. Unfortunately there are a number of issues surrounding TLCs and the secondary market, which make them unattractive in my view.
TC have said they plan to replace TLCs with something more liquid that lenders could always get in and out of at par. If and when this happens, I rather expect that lenders will be given the opportunity to roll their TLC holdings, and possibly their direct investments as well, into one of the new vehicles. At the moment, however, I think everything is on hold while they try to fix the platform.
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gnasher
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Post by gnasher on Jan 20, 2014 16:55:12 GMT
The problem is that Mr Megabrain's thought processes are years ahead of the ability of a certain software shop to deliver the goods. Plus they appear to gloss over the need to get a few basics right first. So "don't hold your breath" would appear to be pertinent advice.
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agent69
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Post by agent69 on Jan 20, 2014 18:06:06 GMT
Unfortunately there are a number of issues surrounding TLCs and the secondary market, which make them unattractive in my view. One of the TLC loans was on offer in the secondary market a couple of weeks ago. Think it was the one that rolls up interest into one payment on completion of the loan period. It was a £1000 part being offered at par. I thought it must be good value as there would be profit due to the accrued interest. Trouble is if it was 18 months in and offered at a significant premium how would you ever work out what it was worth?
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