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Post by yorkshireman on Jan 15, 2014 23:31:44 GMT
And I still say as I did on the old forum and elsewhere, Ratesetter is manipulated by City Boys for their own profits so count me out until RS rates give a decent return to small investors.
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Post by yorkshireman on Jan 16, 2014 0:56:14 GMT
And I still say as I did on the old forum and elsewhere, Ratesetter is manipulated by City Boys for their own profits so count me out until RS rates give a decent return to small investors. A postscript to my comment, I am not asking for preferential treatment.
I am accustomed to the cut and thrust of business both in the workplace and as an investor but I refuse to be shafted by City Boys on Ratesetter when I can earn better returns elsewhere.
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Post by westonkevRS on Jan 16, 2014 7:06:11 GMT
And I still say as I did on the old forum and elsewhere, Ratesetter is manipulated by City Boys for their own profits so count me out until RS rates give a decent return to small investors. Yorkshireman, I tend not to write on the other forums as I don't think it appropriate even when they mention RateSetter. However I do feel the need to defend our lenders good names... The money markets are "markets" in the city sense. However the average lender is an older , probably retired home counties individual looking for a safe income that beats the banks. We have some charities and other organizations as wel, and the monthly market is useful for small businesses with excess operating cash. Most our long term lenders reinvest for the long term. We don't really have "traders" coming in and out, it just doesn't make financial sense. There are better places for them to play this game. As for RateSetter staff, I admit I've bought the odd equity and even dabbled in spread betting. Rhydian was (sort of!) an Investment Banker. But there is a reason he founded RateSetter and one was to provide an honest transparent financial alternatives. We are genuinely excited by what we are trying to do that it almost verges on cultdoom. If you come to our annual drinks evening you would see a lack of manipulative city boys. If the rates are not sufficient for you and your level of risk then fair enough. That is your prerogative and choice. But please don't be disparaging about people we talk to every day. As for Yorshirman, I'm even having a few drinks Friday with some fellows from Skipton. You see, I have all types of friends of all types! Kevin.
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jhma
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Post by jhma on Jan 16, 2014 8:49:06 GMT
... I have just placed funds at 1.85% for three months and 1.9% 12 month fixed with a challenger bank. Both are £10,000 min investments though. Those sound very attractive. May I ask which bank? Cambridge & Counties Bank. I won't link directly to their website. FSCS cover to £85K. Deposit and term accounts available to businesses, clubs, charities etc. only, which is exactly what I need! For information ----- not a recommendation, although I am a depostitor.
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jhma
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Post by jhma on Jan 16, 2014 9:02:25 GMT
WestonKev
In one of your posts you say:
Within the lending page for 'monthly money' it says "Your money is lent for one month.....
This was my understanding too.
But in some of my recent loan confirmations the maturity date is shown as low as 15 days from the start date. So not a month; they will roll over in just a couple of weeks
Not a criticism - just a request for clarification/explanation!
Keep up the good work: even at 2% or just below the one-month option is potentially a useful short-term parking place for funds, as the RS website points out. It is particularly good for excess funds from small businesses where even these sub-inflation interest rates can't readily be had elsewhere any more on non-personal accounts
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Post by wibble on Jan 16, 2014 9:34:06 GMT
Thank you everyone for pointing out the benefits of RS for a business with a bit of excess cash. This didn't even occur to me. Setting up a new RS account today for that very reason :-) Better than the 0.1% it's currently getting...
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markr
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Post by markr on Jan 16, 2014 11:29:21 GMT
Within the lending page for 'monthly money' it says "Your money is lent for one month. At the end of the month, you can roll your contract over or you can withdraw your funds. Borrowers are re-matched in the market with new Lenders each month and enjoy a low-rate loan." I confess I had read that early on but forgotten it. I still don't really understand though. Are you saying certain borrowers get their loans funded entirely from monthly money and so get an amazing deal, or is the monthly money used to part-fund loans to lower the overall APR for all borrowers? Also, suppose there's a load of funds lent out at 1.8% maturing when the market rate is 3.0%. How are these borrowers matched to new money at the same APR? It seems to me that whenever the monthly market rate is rising, all lenders with funds lent out at lower rates must be locked in, because there's nowhere else for RS to get the funds from as cheaply to cover the loan without raising the borrower's APR retrospectively. I suspect I'm being a bit thick and missing something obvious??
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pikestaff
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Post by pikestaff on Jan 16, 2014 11:35:41 GMT
And I still say as I did on the old forum and elsewhere, Ratesetter is manipulated by City Boys for their own profits so count me out until RS rates give a decent return to small investors. Complete nonsense. RS rates are as good as they get for short term money on a completely clean basis. Those current accounts that pay more are loss leaders. They only pay more so that they can get you through the door and try to make money by cross-selling you other stuff. They also have restrictions of one kind or another.
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pikestaff
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Post by pikestaff on Jan 16, 2014 11:40:56 GMT
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Post by yorkshireman on Jan 16, 2014 12:08:33 GMT
And I still say as I did on the old forum and elsewhere, Ratesetter is manipulated by City Boys for their own profits so count me out until RS rates give a decent return to small investors. Complete nonsense. RS rates are as good as they get for short term money on a completely clean basis. Those current accounts that pay more are loss leaders. They only pay more so that they can get you through the door and try to make money by cross-selling you other stuff. They also have restrictions of one kind or another. Yes, they get me through the door and I get far better rates for short term money than those that have been available on Ratesetter for some considerable time until the last day or two.
You’re quite right, they must be loss leaders to the banks as they don’t sell me anything else, as I’m smarter than the banks and their average customer.
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Post by wibble on Jan 16, 2014 12:11:31 GMT
Within the lending page for 'monthly money' it says "Your money is lent for one month. At the end of the month, you can roll your contract over or you can withdraw your funds. Borrowers are re-matched in the market with new Lenders each month and enjoy a low-rate loan." ... It seems to me that whenever the monthly market rate is rising, all lenders with funds lent out at lower rates must be locked in, because there's nowhere else for RS to get the funds from as cheaply to cover the loan without raising the borrower's APR retrospectively ... I suspect I'm being a bit thick and missing something obvious?? I'd also like some clarification on markr's point too please - being equally thick :-) Might need a picture lol
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Post by yorkshireman on Jan 16, 2014 12:32:54 GMT
And I still say as I did on the old forum and elsewhere, Ratesetter is manipulated by City Boys for their own profits so count me out until RS rates give a decent return to small investors. Yorkshireman, I tend not to write on the other forums as I don't think it appropriate even when they mention RateSetter. However I do feel the need to defend our lenders good names... The money markets are "markets" in the city sense. However the average lender is an older , probably retired home counties individual looking for a safe income that beats the banks. We have some charities and other organizations as wel, and the monthly market is useful for small businesses with excess operating cash. Most our long term lenders reinvest for the long term. We don't really have "traders" coming in and out, it just doesn't make financial sense. There are better places for them to play this game. As for RateSetter staff, I admit I've bought the odd equity and even dabbled in spread betting. Rhydian was (sort of!) an Investment Banker. But there is a reason he founded RateSetter and one was to provide an honest transparent financial alternatives. We are genuinely excited by what we are trying to do that it almost verges on cultdoom. If you come to our annual drinks evening you would see a lack of manipulative city boys. If the rates are not sufficient for you and your level of risk then fair enough. That is your prerogative and choice. But please don't be disparaging about people we talk to every day. As for Yorshirman, I'm even having a few drinks Friday with some fellows from Skipton. You see, I have all types of friends of all types! Kevin. Thanks for the explanation of your customer base, I can assure you that there was no intention of denigrating anyone.
Having said that, I still fail to understand what appears to be a monthly pattern whereby rates plummet to the 1.5% mark and even lower on occasions which is the reason for my comment about manipulation.
On a lighter note, you’re obviously a man who chooses his friends / associates carefully to be having drinks with Tykes!
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Post by westonkevRS on Jan 21, 2014 8:04:48 GMT
You might notice that we have got another spike.... at 2.8% this morning.
And to Yorkshireman, this isn't city boys manipulating the market. Just the regular cycles of lending, new money deposits and reinvestment money that can be out of sync. These appear to cause small cycles that are the most volatile in the monthly market, and I believe might continue until we have instant credited BACs payments. An innocent explanation rather than sneaky day traders.
.... and there is even one person with £42k sitting at 99.9%.... Which just ain't gonna happen remembering that customer's can cancel their loan within the first 2 weeks cooling off period. Agreed they might earn a day or twos interest that is due on cooling cancelled loans, but that is a lot of money sitting dead..
Kevin
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Jan 21, 2014 9:01:47 GMT
Over £300K suddenly appears!
edit: I wonder if the announcement here of these spikes galavanises sudden influxes of undercutting funds before anything is lent, ending up with no one getting the higher rates. It's 2.1% now.
Maybe Kev doesn't like seeing higher rates (too far ahead of Zopa).
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Post by planetx on Jan 21, 2014 11:38:12 GMT
And to Yorkshireman, this isn't city boys manipulating the market. Just the regular cycles of lending, new money deposits and reinvestment money that can be out of sync. These appear to cause small cycles that are the most volatile in the monthly market, and I believe might continue until we have instant credited BACs payments. An innocent explanation rather than sneaky day traders. Indeed, so the only way to take advantage of the upswings in the short term rate is to have your money sat there earning zero waiting for it to happen, which has an associated cost. You're better off putting your money in immediately for a month at 1.5% than waiting three weeks for it to go to 3%. I'd also be curious to know how exactly anyone could think that the rate is manipulated - what is the strategy and how does it work? The features that make it possible to manipulate (for example) Libor/Euribor just don't apply here, the rate is set only by supply and demand.
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