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Post by westonkevRS on Sept 11, 2015 19:20:36 GMT
- "Lend now" option - highest borrower offer, also shows amount of money available to lend at that rate. If there's no money on the market then it shouldn't imply that you can "lend now". Showing the lowest lender offer is fine (could even show 0.1% below that as the rate to be at the front of the queue, though obviously this would encourage undercutting) - "Market rate" option - today's market rate, could also show how far back in the queue you would be - "Your rate" option - set your own rate. Advise that this is for experts if you like, as now It's all about simplification and ease. And right now the jargon for " customer journey" type gurus is minimisation, i.e. ask as few questions as possible, as few options as possible, and minimise the funnel fall-out. So @nickthefool, my challenge. Can you think of one choice/button (i.e. not three buttons, that loses people in the journey) with a rate recommendation that will have near certainty of being lent (i.e. I don't want any complaints about wasted days with no interest being earned)....
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Post by bracknellboy on Sept 11, 2015 19:33:38 GMT
"Suckers Rate" ?
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Sept 11, 2015 19:53:38 GMT
- "Lend now" option - highest borrower offer, also shows amount of money available to lend at that rate. If there's no money on the market then it shouldn't imply that you can "lend now". Showing the lowest lender offer is fine (could even show 0.1% below that as the rate to be at the front of the queue, though obviously this would encourage undercutting) - "Market rate" option - today's market rate, could also show how far back in the queue you would be - "Your rate" option - set your own rate. Advise that this is for experts if you like, as now It's all about simplification and ease. And right now the jargon for " customer journey" type gurus is minimisation, i.e. ask as few questions as possible, as few options as possible, and minimise the funnel fall-out. So @nickthefool, my challenge. Can you think of one choice/button (i.e. not three buttons, that loses people in the journey) with a rate recommendation that will have near certainty of being lent (i.e. I don't want any complaints about wasted days with no interest being earned).... That may not be possible. I'm only a year "out of the game", but "user experience" was the term in my day, and was quite new even then. The questions remain, fundamentally, the same though. Who do RateSetter want their users / customers to be, and what do they want their experience / journey to be? RateSetter are entirely within their rights to say "as a business we believe our future is simplifying things such that we have broader market appeal and can scale to the volumes we think we're capable of attaining". Equally, they're perfectly within their rights to say (even if they are unlikely to ever come out and say it) "... if this means that we have to lose some more sophisticated lenders, and even if they were the people who originally helped us get off the ground, then so be it". Personally I don't think anybody should be overly dismissive of the intelligence / savvyness of the average punter. You're right to be concerned about complaints about wasted days with no interest being earned. However, if I was a lawyer I'd be sharpening my pencil because there is no difference between investing early at a slightly lower rate and investing later at a slightly higher rate. As soon as the customer is sent in a direction by the site the site is open to accusations of one kind or another. On this issue the most risk averse stance for RateSetter to take would be to ensure that all investors are thoughtful, knowledgeable and able to deal with complexity. Yes, it's a barrier to entry, and therefore growth, but it is not insurmountable (some time polishing your introduction materials and your Ts and Cs would go some way to mitigating the risk). It's also a much more conservative approach to growing a business. In an environment where interest in P2P is only going to increase (eg yield vs traditional savings accounts and the introduction of ISA money), combined with the current regulatory approach, which is only going to increase, if I were running such a business I would take the slow and steady approach knowing that an aggressive land grab is a) likely to run risks I'd be uncomfortable with and b) attract regulatory scrutiny that I may not be able to survive. The race isn't always to the swift.
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jlend
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Post by jlend on Sept 11, 2015 21:30:49 GMT
- "Lend now" option - highest borrower offer, also shows amount of money available to lend at that rate. If there's no money on the market then it shouldn't imply that you can "lend now". Showing the lowest lender offer is fine (could even show 0.1% below that as the rate to be at the front of the queue, though obviously this would encourage undercutting) - "Market rate" option - today's market rate, could also show how far back in the queue you would be - "Your rate" option - set your own rate. Advise that this is for experts if you like, as now It's all about simplification and ease. And right now the jargon for " customer journey" type gurus is minimisation, i.e. ask as few questions as possible, as few options as possible, and minimise the funnel fall-out. So @nickthefool, my challenge. Can you think of one choice/button (i.e. not three buttons, that loses people in the journey) with a rate recommendation that will have near certainty of being lent (i.e. I don't want any complaints about wasted days with no interest being earned).... It is not an un reasonable question but hard for us to answer as we dont have access to all the info that ratesetter has internally. How long did it take for money to be lent out for lenders who chose the MR on the 5 year market on tuesday for re investments for example? Do people who choose the MR have many wasted days typically ? A follow up thought for high street type lenders. Should you offer them a lend it now rate for their re investments to prevent the risk of complaints about missing out on interest. It would be consistent and easy for them to understand?
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gnasher
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Post by gnasher on Sept 12, 2015 4:13:57 GMT
It's all about simplification and ease. And right now the jargon for " customer journey" type gurus is minimisation, i.e. ask as few questions as possible, as few options as possible, and minimise the funnel fall-out. It seems me that if the "customer journey" minimalists gurus have their way then RS will end up like Wellesley, no visible market just a take it or leave it single rate, click and forget, mindless and ultra boring minimilastic "customer journey". While I am happy with boring, I find ultra boring just too .... yawn ..... zzzzzzzzzzz ....... It also seems that these "customer journey" gurus are questioning, even fighting against the very core of what has made RS successful, a visible and effective market; why would anyone do that? Looks like corporate suicide to me. Plus the minimalistic space they seem to want to get to is effectively occupied already, by Wellesley. Perhaps RS should follow AC's example, recognise that to be successful they must cater for different people with different needs with different offerings. So how about a clear and obvious fork in the "customer journey" road (which you would only need to choose once). Active market participants one way, single clickers another. Either that or let's go back to the basic time proven RS market, where just a little bit of effort is required by those who want to participate.
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Post by geoffrey on Sept 12, 2015 6:43:45 GMT
Lets have a visible and obvious fork in the "customer journey" road (which you would only need to choose once). Active market participants one way, single clickers another. That's precisely what the "Are you a RateSetter expert?" link is. The problem is it is MISLEADING to new investors, and arguably preys on their ingenuity in a vain attempt by RS to push down overall rates. It's not going to work because in the end the market relies on there being enough lenders wiling to put money in at the rates on offer. I abandoned ZP when they threw in the towel and started fixing the rate, and I'll do the same with RS if it makes any such attempt. Like it or not, there are P2Ps and P2Bs out there offering higher rates, with substantial protection, available right now. How many P2Ps have fallen by the wayside because they showed disdain for their lenders? I can name a few. Without lender capital, RS is nothing, purely and simply. It would not be at all confusing to have three buttons or links on the lending page. One would show the "Rate to lend right now", though really it should read "Rate to lend fast" because when there are no borrower requests the wording is misleading. Another would allow lenders to add their funds to the "variable Market Rate" which "usually" lends within 24 hours. It could show the current rate, but it should be made clear to lenders that the rate is variable. The third would be "Set your own rate". Such a screen would be a good compromise, and would maintain RS's reputation for fairness and transparency. The current option is dangerously misleading, like the train companies that tell their sales staff not to reveal the best rates to customers who walk up to the ticket office without having done their research. Here is a schematic (excuse the rough graphics) of how easy it could be to get this right, while preserving simplicity for the mass-market lender RS wants to attract: -------------- | LEND FAST | | 6.2% | --------------- ----------------------- | MARKET RATE* | | 6.4% (VARIABLE) | ----------------------- *Usually lends in 24-48 hours, rate may vary from that shown -------------------- | YOUR RATE | | (for experts) | -------------------- NB "Your Rate" here would have nothing to do with the old "Your Rate" function. It would literally mean, set your own rate and would take you to the "advanced" screen.
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jlend
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Post by jlend on Sept 12, 2015 7:20:09 GMT
Lets have a visible and obvious fork in the "customer journey" road (which you would only need to choose once). Active market participants one way, single clickers another. That's precisely what the "Are you a RateSetter expert?" link is. The problem is it is MISLEADING to new investors, and arguably preys on their ingenuity in a vain attempt by RS to push down overall rates. It's not going to work because in the end the market relies on there being enough lenders wiling to put money in at the rates on offer. I abandoned ZP when they threw in the towel and started fixing the rate, and I'll do the same with RS if it makes any such attempt. Like it or not, there are P2Ps and P2Bs out there offering higher rates, with substantial protection, available right now. How many P2Ps have fallen by the wayside because they showed disdain for their lenders? I can name a few. Without lender capital, RS is nothing, purely and simply. It would not be at all confusing to have three buttons or links on the lending page. One would show the "Rate to lend right now", though really it should read "Rate to lend fast" because when there are no borrower requests the wording is misleading. Another would allow lenders to add their funds to the "variable Market Rate" which "usually" lends within 24 hours. It could show the current rate, but it should be made clear to lenders that the rate is variable. The third would be "Set your own rate". Such a screen would be a good compromise, and would maintain RS's reputation for fairness and transparency. The current option is dangerously misleading, like the train companies that tell their sales staff not to reveal the best rates to customers who walk up to the ticket office without having done their research. Here is a schematic (excuse the rough graphics) of how easy it could be to get this right, while preserving simplicity for the mass-market lender RS wants to attract: -------------- | LEND FAST | | 6.2% | --------------- ----------------------- | MARKET RATE* | | 6.4% (VARIABLE) | ----------------------- *Usually lends in 24-48 hours, rate may vary from that shown -------------------- | YOUR RATE | | (for experts) | -------------------- NB "Your Rate" here would have nothing to do with the old "Your Rate" function. It would literally mean, set your own rate and would take you to the "advanced" screen. I do wonder if ratesetter are really struggling with how to get the next big jump in lenders. There are about 25k lenders now. It has gone up since the advertising on the radio etc but not by as much as i expected. I am not sure P2p it quite a mass market high street product yet. My mum and brothers would not do it. Ratesetter has the word invest on the home page, so that is them out. I would put them in a high street group. Hargreaves lansdowne has for example 727k clients, perhaps they are a more realistic segment. Perhaps they are the high street group ratesetter are after at the moment. Anyway i am sure there are more experienced people than me working with westonkev at ratesetter on this. It cant be easy...
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pikestaff
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Post by pikestaff on Sept 13, 2015 7:12:13 GMT
I do wonder if ratesetter are really struggling with how to get the next big jump in lenders. There are about 25k lenders now. It has gone up since the advertising on the radio etc but not by as much as i expected. I am not sure P2p it quite a mass market high street product yet. My mum and brothers would not do it... My mum is in, on my advice, but I am managing the account for her. I'm very glad that I am, because she's the type of person who would be suckered by the "lend it now" option - and would be very upset if she found out that she'd been had. geoffrey's schematic looks like a good starting point to me.
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jlend
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Post by jlend on Sept 13, 2015 8:35:39 GMT
Westonkev do you know if ratesetter are planning a blog item on their website to explain the rationale etc for the new display. There was a blog entry on the change to the provision that you posted to update everyone.
It might be worth ratesetter providing some info and rationale to all lenders on the new display and why it has been done.
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jlend
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Post by jlend on Sept 13, 2015 8:37:24 GMT
I do wonder if ratesetter are really struggling with how to get the next big jump in lenders. There are about 25k lenders now. It has gone up since the advertising on the radio etc but not by as much as i expected. I am not sure P2p it quite a mass market high street product yet. My mum and brothers would not do it... My mum is in, on my advice, but I am managing the account for her. I'm very glad that I am, because she's the type of person who would be suckered by the "lend it now" option - and would be very upset if she found out that she'd been had. geoffrey's schematic looks like a good starting point to me. I am doing something similar providing help to my partner for the same reason following the change.
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star dust
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Post by star dust on Sept 13, 2015 8:51:59 GMT
geoffrey's schematic looks like a good starting point to me. To me Geoffrey's schematic looks horribly like Zopa's lending 'traffic lights', if anyone remembers those - start of a slippery slope.
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Post by rarrar on Sept 14, 2015 7:56:31 GMT
Lend Now Rate
And again, receive an email saying my account is now funded so go to Lend onthe 3 year market Lend Now 3yr market= 4.1% But <£10k cumulative at 5.5%
But I suppose with Zopa offering 4% for 3 years, and probably a long wait for funds to match, RS offering doesnt look bad !
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Sept 14, 2015 8:50:20 GMT
Does anybody else appreciate the irony implicit in the "lend now rate"? In that if you go down that route you are not setting a rate , you are taking one ? Maybe they should re-brand themselves RateTaker .
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Post by beegee on Sept 14, 2015 9:46:22 GMT
Even following RS logic the 'lend it now' should be the lowest lender offer, not the highest borrower offer. As there would be no current lenders at the highest borrower bid then you would join a queue at that rate, whereas the lowest lender offer actually has money to lend.
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Post by closetotheedge on Sept 14, 2015 14:49:28 GMT
I am sure I have missed the point but what if at the moment the prospective lender is choosing to lend there are no prospective borrowers. In that case does the lend now option just not appear?
I had to look to find this whole screen myself as I have always accessed the lending screen by pressing the rate box at the bottom left of the screen so was unaware of this until this discussion alerted me to it. Perhaps RS need to look at closing this 'backdoor' to the lending screen as well.
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