am
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Post by am on Sept 2, 2015 9:42:24 GMT
I wonder if 29% of (current) investors will now opt out (presumably they being the savvy ones). I've been effectively opted out of the SME market for 6 months, since they stopped giving us enough information to evaluate loans. FC has potentially lost several thousand pounds of investment from me because of that (depending on what view I ended up taking on platform diversification).
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Sept 2, 2015 9:47:27 GMT
Actually I think the exercise was completely pointless. Effectively they spoke to some of us and gave us a days advance notice a more general announcement that a fundamental change in the platform is going to occur. We have no way of influencing the changes which have been presented as a fait accompli. The one day advance notice to this type of event does not really help us individually. Perhaps it mean't us feel loved and they have actually called all members...... I agree that it was pointless, I also agree that it is unlikely to have any material effect on anybody. That having been said if something like this was done in the capital markets the regulators would be all over it like a rash. FC's naivety here surprises me, they could have simply avoided any issues by not talking to anybody up front. As soon as an institution treats one part of the market differently to another they open themselves to regulatory risk. I'm now reconsidering my thinking that it was "unlikely to have any material effect on anybody". If they were told the prospective rates too (or could accurately predict what they were likely to be), anybody who got advance notice of this could have benefited from expected moves in the SM, whether it's offloading stuff they don't want, or picking up things on the cheap that could be sold at a premium once the new regime was in place.
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Sept 2, 2015 9:59:06 GMT
Something else to consider, how is inventory that's aged between 12-24 months, and 36-48 months, going to be priced on the SM?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2015 10:08:42 GMT
Good luck trying to shift 12 month A+ loans at 6% (5% after fees).
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TitoPuente
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Post by TitoPuente on Sept 2, 2015 10:15:03 GMT
So now they have sent out emails to everyone, so we have certainty that the changes are officially going to happen.
At the same time we can see loan 15440, a 36-month A which would in the near future command a democratically fixed 9.2% for every soul, having bids at 8%!! Shouldn't be more ethical from Fricking Cowards to shut down autobodge until the transition is over? Would autobidder granny be happy with an 8% part in a new 9.2%-for-all paradigm?
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am
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Post by am on Sept 2, 2015 10:16:47 GMT
Something else to consider, how is inventory that's aged between 12-24 months, and 36-48 months, going to be priced on the SM? I presume that prices will continue to be set by the sellers. One possibly unintended consequence is that, even after the adjustment to the new regime has finished, the return (before bad debt) on older loans with less than 12 months left to run will be better than that on new loans. During the transition period it seems to me that it is likely that there will be lots of loans available on the secondary market at rates above the new fixed rates. It's as well (for FC) that autobid will not be buying loans at a premium, as otherwise funds for new loans on the primary market might dry up.
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Sept 2, 2015 10:19:28 GMT
Announcement now live on the website: link New fixed rates table: The resulting projected net returns make interesting (!?) reading: Where you find those projected net rate tables??
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Sept 2, 2015 10:21:22 GMT
I simply deducted FC's 1% fee and projected bad debts by risk band
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Post by mostlywrong on Sept 2, 2015 10:25:55 GMT
When FC introduced the MBR, a lot of players sold off their portfolios at noticeable discounts, IIRC.
Will that happen this time?
I wasn't going to increase my cash levels but...
MW
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pa
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Post by pa on Sept 2, 2015 10:29:38 GMT
Hello Forum, I think that FC have made the changes with regards to the innovative ISA options coming in. Realistically with more money hitting the market, rates will fall once this is introduced. I can understand why the changes have been made if they felt the flow of money would send levels towards the MBR. From my thinking the market has just been made efficient more quickly (at the cost of making it incredibly illiquid). A lot of us have profited from the market being inefficient on the SM. Unfortunately the good times don't last forever. FC have been quite fair with the 18.1% rate to let those holding E rated loans to get out of the market. I'm pulling all my loan parts on the SM, apart from property loans, and will hold for a few months to see if I can sell at a greater premium. My main concern, which will not affect me, is that the risk assumed will no longer be adequately priced. The money players in the auction process DO help to set benchmarks based on their perception of value. No liquidity (once the asset is held) and price controls never end well. In addition I'm worried about the extent that loans will become correlated. I'm not for one moment suggesting that the standards at FC are akin to the rating agencies valuing CDOs, but if Autobid blind money continues to fill up loans at mandated prices I think even someone like me that only likes to have 0.5% his account in any one company (after disposing of the excess on SM ) will be in for a shock during an economic downturn, even if he/she thinks his/her holdings are diversified. Anyway, I said that my concerns would not affect me. The rates offered, with the prospect of poor liquidity in the SM, aren't enough for me to assume the risk. I'm more than happy to keep my loan portfolio as it is and hold to term, reducing some of the oversized positions I still have on the SM in the coming months, but for me it will be a case of drawing down capital and interest once it is re-payed, rather than reinvesting. I'm not running away throwing a tantrum, I'm just saying I'm stepping to the sidelines to see what happens and if there are any angles once the new regime settles down. All good things come to an end and if someone who is used to getting 2% on their online saving thinks they have found Eldorado when the new ISAs come in then I'm happy for them. I just don't want to be around when the party ends.
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spyrogyra
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Post by spyrogyra on Sept 2, 2015 10:39:29 GMT
What about the SM? Would the same rules apply,will they keep the premium and discount options ? Has anyone seen any information concerning the secondary market?
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registerme
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Post by registerme on Sept 2, 2015 10:39:50 GMT
I'm not running away throwing a tantrum, I'm just saying I'm stepping to the sidelines to see what happens and if there are any angles once the new regime settles down. Yep, that's pretty much where I'm at.
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spyrogyra
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Post by spyrogyra on Sept 2, 2015 10:55:25 GMT
Funny things happening. I've just tried to put for sale a D part at 14% buyers rate. Buyers rates shows as NaN% !!!!!
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Post by easteregg on Sept 2, 2015 11:24:09 GMT
Plus the new rates are even below the current market average. Except for D loanes. I could not equate this with the statement that 71% will be better off...
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Post by ohlala on Sept 2, 2015 11:30:37 GMT
My initial reaction was OMG and I've just spent weeks re-programming my bid-bot to take account risk ratings, credit scores, asset-to-loan values, fixed rate and cashback options to decide which auctions to bid on and to then place last minute bids. This work was worth the extra returns I was achieving but now I may just stick to asset secured loans and/or move my money to Saving Stream, Rate Setters , Assetz & Wellesley.
This is similar to what Zopa did a couple of years ago when they stopped investors choosing what rates to lend at, but they also brought in the SafeGuard fund to compensate for reduced returns. If FC did this as well the I would probably continue lending through them.
Still, life would be very boring if nothing ever changed and I accept that for the majority of lender this will probably improve their returns.
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