registerme
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Post by registerme on Dec 23, 2015 11:13:58 GMT
My base state is currently pretty straightforward:- Zopa ~20% RateSetter ~20% Funding Circle ~20% Saving Stream ~20% ablrate - ~20% That having been said I'm beginning to see divergence as a result of differing returns. Provisos include:- Not all investments were made on the same date Occasionally I've put additional funds in and then drawn down to take advantage of various opportunities I expect my weightings to change as my appetite for the different platforms changes It will change over time, so this is very much a snapshot view. Interesting how much things can change in three months! My breakdown now looks like this:- Ratesetter 22.85% ablrate 22.68% Saving Stream 21.10% Zopa 13.69% Funding Circle 9.13% MoneyThing 8.94% Lending Crowd 1.62%
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Post by Financial Thing on Dec 23, 2015 12:51:49 GMT
Me currently: RS: 19% MT: 18% FC: 15.6% SS: 11% AC: 11% FS: 7.2% PM: 6.7% LB: 5.4% (+) LW: 3.2% (+) LC: 3% PP: 2.8% REBS: 2.2% (-) Mintos: 2%  How do you keep track and manage all of those? (I'm having enough trouble with just three -- SS, FS, & AC -- plus Z, which I'm ignoring as it runs itself down.) My thread on How to resist the p2p compulsion is applicable here. I threw money into some at an early stage finding out which platforms I liked / disliked, and ended with this thinking platform diversification is as important as loan diversification.
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jonno
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nil satis nisi optimum
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Post by jonno on Dec 23, 2015 13:44:21 GMT
O.k. here goes; Saving Stream 35.2% (+) Funding Secure 13.6% (+) Moneything 10.8% (+) Assetz Capital 10.7% not moved for 15 months Ablrate 5.8% (+) Funding Empire 4.9% (+) Unbolted 4.6% (+) Wellesley 3.5% One off not moving Ratesetter 3.4% Purely reinvestment Funding Circle 3.0% (-) Rebuilding Society 2.4% Only flipping and reinvesting Love Fruitful 1.0% (-) Lending Crowd 0.5% Toe Dip On reflection,maybe I've over-diversified?  |
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bigfoot12
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Post by bigfoot12 on Dec 23, 2015 13:49:19 GMT
How do you keep track and manage all of those? (I'm having enough trouble with just three -- SS, FS, & AC -- plus Z, which I'm ignoring as it runs itself down.) ... thinking platform diversification is as important as loan diversification. I agree that platform diversification is important, but at what point does adding a risky platform increase your risk more than the diversification reduces it? I guess that it is impossible to know, but RS and FC are well funded growing and easy to understand. Some of the other platforms are part of larger companies, or have little turnover or growth, or are struggling on a shoestring. Does adding some of these reduce your risk? Returning to the main thread. I am a double outlier. FC is my largest holding and likely to increase rather than reduce (as a proportion) over the next 3 months. I say as a proportion as I am reducing to P2P a little at the moment, something likely to continue. My second largest holding (and my second outlier) is in various Investment trusts (or similar). Mostly bought at a discount (thought the average is not quite as large as the current discount), I would buy more if the discount (to NAV) increases. SS is the only other platform whose share I currently plan to increase (from very low). If AC bring 3-4 loans per week then I might increase that share, but will still be down on the peak.
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Post by vithca on Dec 23, 2015 14:15:12 GMT
On reflection,maybe I've over-diversified? I don't believe it is possible to be over-diversified in any market with inherent risk.
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jonno
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nil satis nisi optimum
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Post by jonno on Dec 23, 2015 14:24:42 GMT
On reflection,maybe I've over-diversified? I don't believe it is possible to be over-diversified in any market with inherent risk. Thank you vithca. I suppose my only reservation is that if you constantly diversify, eventually you will land on a platform that goes t*ts up,  although hopefully with only a small amount riding on it 
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Post by Financial Thing on Dec 23, 2015 14:25:30 GMT
... thinking platform diversification is as important as loan diversification. I agree that platform diversification is important, but at what point does adding a risky platform increase your risk more than the diversification reduces it? I guess that it is impossible to know, but RS and FC are well funded growing and easy to understand. Some of the other platforms are part of larger companies, or have little turnover or growth, or are struggling on a shoestring. Does adding some of these reduce your risk? Returning to the main thread. I am a double outlier. FC is my largest holding and likely to increase rather than reduce (as a proportion) over the next 3 months. I say as a proportion as I am reducing to P2P a little at the moment, something likely to continue. My second largest holding (and my second outlier) is in various Investment trusts (or similar). Mostly bought at a discount (thought the average is not quite as large as the current discount), I would buy more if the discount (to NAV) increases. SS is the only other platform whose share I currently plan to increase (from very low). If AC bring 3-4 loans per week then I might increase that share, but will still be down on the peak. You make a very valid point but as you stated, it's impossible to know which platforms are truly less risky than others. Take FC for example, since their last interest rate policy change, SM has drastically changed, defaults are rising and if the economy falters, all those unsecured loans will be a problem. Yes it's less risky than say MT, but by how much, who knows. When I found out Santander Bank invested billions into Bernie Madoff's ponzi fund, I realized that even the bigger companies can make monumentally poor business decisions that can result in bankruptcy. Safety in reality is a fallacy.
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Post by solicitorious on Dec 23, 2015 14:50:11 GMT
I don't believe it is possible to be over-diversified in any market with inherent risk. Thank you vithca . I suppose my only reservation is that if you constantly diversify, eventually you will land on a platform that goes t*ts up, although hopefully with only a small amount riding on it And at what point does your management overhead of multiple platforms become uneconomic in relation to the value of your time versus possible losses? The other issue is over-diversification may cause you to fail to spot something which causes a loss, which would have been spotted and avoided otherwise, e.g. by exiting a loan promptly.
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jonno
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Post by jonno on Dec 23, 2015 15:03:35 GMT
Thank you vithca . I suppose my only reservation is that if you constantly diversify, eventually you will land on a platform that goes t*ts up, although hopefully with only a small amount riding on it And at what point does your management overhead of multiple platforms become uneconomic in relation to the value of your time versus possible losses? The other issue is over-diversification may cause you to fail to spot something which causes a loss, which would have been spotted and avoided otherwise, e.g. by exiting a loan promptly. Two very valid points. Point 1; luckily I come cheap  But you're right it does take up a lot of time and effort; Point 2;clearly a risk, but they don't all require full on active management. Flabby Corpuscles have been my biggest challenge,though improving; along with some early impulsive/impatient investments with AC, when ironically my diversification was low.
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Steerpike
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Post by Steerpike on Dec 23, 2015 15:19:52 GMT
I am invested in 20 platforms and most of them require very little time, some almost none at all, e.g. Wellesley, ABG, and Zopa.
For me, the ones that consume time are FC and REBS and most of that time is spent ducking and weaving to minimise the failures.
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stevio
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Post by stevio on Dec 23, 2015 15:24:56 GMT
The amount of time platforms take depends a bit on the churning due to number of new loans and the secondary market
I do find it taking up more and more time - if this time could be spent better elsewhere? who knows
I think a there is a natural limit to how many platforms you can realistically keep oversight over, but also a limit to how many you truly need oversight over
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ben
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Post by ben on Dec 23, 2015 15:28:23 GMT
I am invested in 20 platforms and most of them require very little time, some almost none at all, e.g. Wellesley, ABG, and Zopa. For me, the ones that consume time are FC and REBS and most of that time is spent ducking and weaving to minimise the failures. I am in a few and spend far more time on here then I actually do managing the accounts, plus half the time I am doing that as well anyway so no real cost in time
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littleoldlady
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Running down all platforms due to age
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Post by littleoldlady on Dec 23, 2015 16:12:32 GMT
Savings Stream 34.99%
stable
MoneyThing 21.13%
increasing
Wellesley 12.74%
running down since rate reductions
Funding Secure 9.24%
increasing
Ratesetter 7.93%
running down
Property Moose 6.27%
increasing
Zopa 4.06%
running down
Ablrate 2.31%
ditto
Archover 1.32%
ditto
I have also tried some other platforms but never invested or cashed out. IMO 3 or 4 platforms is the most you can give proper attention to
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ben
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Post by ben on Dec 23, 2015 16:43:38 GMT
Savings Stream 34.99% stable MoneyThing 21.13% increasing Wellesley 12.74% running down since rate reductions Funding Secure 9.24% increasing Ratesetter 7.93% running down Property Moose 6.27% increasing Zopa 4.06% running down Ablrate 2.31% ditto Archover 1.32% ditto I have also tried some other platforms but never invested or cashed out. IMO 3 or 4 platforms is the most you can give proper attention to I see that you are increasing PM have you tried property partner?
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Steerpike
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Post by Steerpike on Dec 23, 2015 20:21:12 GMT
Movement in the last 2 months.
16% > 15% Ratesetter
14% > 11% Wellesley
10% > 10% Savingstream
9% > 9% LendInvest
8% > 9% Assetz Capital
8% > 8% Abundance Generation
8% > 7% ThinCats
8% > 7% Zopa
7% > 7% Funding Circle
3% > 4% Moneything
4% > 4% Archover
0% > 4% FundingSecure
2% > 2% Funding Knight
1% > 1% ABLrate
2% > 2% Landbay + 6 others
Overall P2P investment up 7%.
Increased FS, MT, LI, AC, AR.
Reduced Wellesley and Zopa.
Likely to maintain overall investment in P2P, but reducing RS (overweight), and FC (fewer opportunities) over the next few months.
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although hopefully with only a small amount riding on it 
But you're right it does take up a lot of time and effort;
