Steerpike
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Post by Steerpike on Jun 18, 2018 11:11:24 GMT
6 bedroom house in Norfolk (4045698166) update 18-Jun-18
"The client, with the agreement of the receiver, is marketing the property as an option, in case the refinancing is not completed."
Perhaps unsurprisingly, the property is not visible on Rightmove.
Apparently, we had "evidence of refinancing" on 23-Sep-16 and within the context of FS loan updates "receiver" seems to mean someone we have a chat to now and again but doesn't actually do anything. Receiver is mentioned 12 times on this loan from 4-Mar-17 to 18-Jun-18.
I'm not sure why FS continue to post these updates.
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baldpate
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Post by baldpate on Jun 18, 2018 12:51:00 GMT
I would translate the noun "receiver" from FS-lingo into English as "the stick we keep waiving at the borrower to try to make lenders & borrower think we are serious about recovering this loan".
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mjc
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Post by mjc on Jun 18, 2018 22:11:14 GMT
I was also 'tricked' on several loans. When I first discovered FS I was happy to allocate some money into each loan as and when it became available, I think there was the auto-invest option or maybe I did it manually just assuming the platform had integrity. I wanted to diversify and I was nowhere near as careful as I should have been - the money I will lose is costly but it has taught me a lot. I look at my outstanding loans and I have several all with the exact same updates but when listed I assumed were different on face value, (different pictures used and not featuring on the main page of course) things like: 1 - Strand Road, Londonderry 2 - Ground Floor Retail, Londonderry 3 - Branch Road, Londonderry 4 - Waterloo Road, Refinancing Now Londonderry is not one street and I think it was reasonable for me to assume they were all different borrowers, I had not even considered they could be connected. Yes I was foolish and it is mainly my own fault for not reading more than the LTV and title of the loan - but I was investing low amounts into each loan they listed as I trusted the platform and didn't think for one second they would just rename loans, or break them down in order to 'trick' people like me into thinking they were diversifying risk, when the exact opposite is the case. As such I now realise I have far more than I am comfortable with in one loan. Happened to me with much larger amounts on other loans as well by the way - fortunately I spotted my error and stopped investing. Obviously I am assuming this was deliberate trickery as I was clearly tricked, I wanted diversification not extra risk. I have just seen today’s update for flats in Clithero and Lytham st Ann’s the first says 12 hours ago We were able to reach the borrower today. He is just checking the status of a completion and will be repaying the loan this week. 16/06/2018 We have been calling the borrower all week but have not been able to reach him. We will give it one more week before commencing default proceedings. 31/05/2018 We spoke with the borrower today. He expects to be in funds by Friday June 8 and has committed to repay the loan in full during the following week. 30/04/2018 We have been chasing the borrower to secure an update on this loan. As soon as we have some information, we will post an update. The other says 12 hours ago We were able to reach the borrower today. He is just checking the status of a completion and will be repaying the loan this week. 16/06/2018 We have been calling the borrower all week but have not been able to reach him. We will give it one more week before commencing default proceedings. 31/05/2018 We spoke with the borrower today. He expects to be in funds by Friday June 8 and has committed to repay the loan in full during the following week. 30/04/2018 We have been chasing the borrower to secure an update on this loan. As soon as we have some information, we will post an update. So I (we) try to get diversification and are mislead, if that is the case as it appears to be, by the platform knowing, but not saying they are linked, and such an appalling record by this ilusive borrower, broken promises by both parties etc. then I’m out!!! Perhaps Proplend or HNW are far safer?
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Steerpike
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Post by Steerpike on Jul 23, 2018 15:40:23 GMT
6 bedroom house in Norfolk (4045698166) update 23-Jul-18
"Reconfirmation received that refinancing is progressing. The borrower has several properties also being refinance which will ensure sufficient funds to fully repay this loan. The receiver remains in contact to ensure the necessary actions are proceeding."
Via chat this afternoon:
Q. The update issued today is almost exactly the same as that posted on 18-Sep-16. Please can you explain what real evidence you have to justify your continued belief that the borrower will refinance?
A. We are in regular communications with the borrower and we are confident that we are progressing with this loan through the refinance option. We are also working with the receivers in order to ensure progress is being made.
Q. Please can you provide a link to where the property is being marketed as stated on 18-Jun-18?
A. I am unfortunately unable to provide a link in order to maintain borrower confidentiality.
So no evidence for the continued belief and no evidence of the marketing.
Perhaps unsurprisingly, the property is not visible on Rightmove.
On this loan as with a number of others, it seems that FS can continue to profess "belief" for ever and there is nothing that investors can do about it.
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r00lish67
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Post by r00lish67 on Jul 23, 2018 16:09:09 GMT
6 bedroom house in Norfolk (4045698166) update 23-Jul-18 "Reconfirmation received that refinancing is progressing. The borrower has several properties also being refinance which will ensure sufficient funds to fully repay this loan. The receiver remains in contact to ensure the necessary actions are proceeding."Via chat this afternoon: Q. The update issued today is almost exactly the same as that posted on 18-Sep-16. Please can you explain what real evidence you have to justify your continued belief that the borrower will refinance? A. We are in regular communications with the borrower and we are confident that we are progressing with this loan through the refinance option. We are also working with the receivers in order to ensure progress is being made.Q. Please can you provide a link to where the property is being marketed as stated on 18-Jun-18? A. I am unfortunately unable to provide a link in order to maintain borrower confidentiality.
So no evidence for the continued belief and no evidence of the marketing. Perhaps unsurprisingly, the property is not visible on Rightmove. On this loan as with a number of others, it seems that FS can continue to profess "belief" for ever and there is nothing that investors can do about it. I can only assume it's the same FS person who updates the very similarly vintage Londonderry loans (e.g. 1018041290). Upon each and every update I am assured that progress has been made, mostly in a totally undefined manner. Just occasionally, we go for a left-field exciting venture, such as: "We have confirmation that planning approval has now, finally, been given. This will allow the borrower to draw down funds" - April 2017 Or: "We have received a copy of a formal commitment from *** to refinance part of the developments" August 2017 ..But we then, with no further exposition, return swiftly to the frankly overwhelming levels of progress made before we started. Regarding the confidentiality aspect, they seem to live in a parallel world here too. 90-95% of their borrowers are on Companies House, where you don't even need to register to access a list of FS charges. It's really not confidential. I haven't seen a property VR where it hasn't been possible to deduce the exact address, which again is of course easily located on RM/Zoopla/whatever. In short, the vast majority of borrowers surely realise that their "confidentiality" is a fig-leaf should they be lending as the director of a Limited Company. Which most are.
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Post by harryvederci on Jul 23, 2018 16:16:05 GMT
just being pedantic, but the property photo showing in the fs loan overview is No. 123, fs is the one to the left (chopped off).
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locutus
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Post by locutus on Jul 23, 2018 16:20:00 GMT
I just checked this loan and it has been ongoing for 858 days. That is really quite incredible. Even if the full capital and interest is returned, this still represents an effective loss for investors who expected to invest for 6 months and then reinvest their proceeds in other loans. i.e. they've lost out on nearly 2 years compounded interest. It really is time to bring this one to an end.
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Post by harryvederci on Jul 23, 2018 16:33:17 GMT
and just to be ultra pedantic, can fs explain how the property can possibly be on the market for sale without there being a corresponding epc on the national epc register, which is a statutory requirement
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on Jul 23, 2018 16:44:37 GMT
please don't forget the FS spin machine is designed to palm off lenders by treating them as complete idiots - this sort of intelligent, cogent and relevant question is really going to throw them...
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rs
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Post by rs on Jul 23, 2018 18:05:33 GMT
and just to be ultra pedantic, can fs explain how the property can possibly be on the market for sale without there being a corresponding epc on the national epc register, which is a statutory requirement FS can't comment due to confidentiality reasons!
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ashtondav
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Post by ashtondav on Jul 23, 2018 18:36:49 GMT
Ongoing....
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Steerpike
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Post by Steerpike on Jul 24, 2018 8:45:26 GMT
After further questions and probing a new update has been posted 24-Jul-18:
"To clarify - the borrower has agreed with the receiver to market and sell the property on a consensual sale. They have therefore paid the necessary fees and agents are ready with listing/photos etc to market and sell the property. However, the receiver has confirmed the details of the refinancing and has recommended waiting for the lender to complete their due diligence to confirm their offer, as this would be the preferred option.
If the refinancing fails then the property will be marketed."
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on Jul 24, 2018 11:16:34 GMT
if paid the fees then put the damn thing on the market - if nothing else it will encourage the present interested party! Give the interested party 1 month to exchange so that the estate agent can take offers and be ready should this buyer pull out....
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bugs4me
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Post by bugs4me on Jul 24, 2018 12:06:41 GMT
I just checked this loan and it has been ongoing for 858 days. That is really quite incredible. Even if the full capital and interest is returned, this still represents an effective loss for investors who expected to invest for 6 months and then reinvest their proceeds in other loans. i.e. they've lost out on nearly 2 years compounded interest. It really is time to bring this one to an end. It should be brought to a conclusion for better or unfortunately probably worse. FS are simply out of their depth with defaults - just look at the S***h W***s property loan - now at 1082 days. 1st tranche will be a haircut. Probably 2nd tranche a 100% loss. The updates are a repetitious 'sick' joke - like many other overdue loan updates.
They are good at churning out new loan 'opportunities' though. You could be forgiven for thinking that repayment to investors will be optional.
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Steerpike
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Post by Steerpike on Aug 10, 2018 11:03:11 GMT
I just checked this loan and it has been ongoing for 858 days. That is really quite incredible. Even if the full capital and interest is returned, this still represents an effective loss for investors who expected to invest for 6 months and then reinvest their proceeds in other loans. i.e. they've lost out on nearly 2 years compounded interest. It really is time to bring this one to an end. Now flagged as "Unredeemed" Talk about "his master's voice", perhaps locutus you would care to pass judgement on some of the other very old loans?
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