sildenafil
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Post by sildenafil on Mar 21, 2016 21:31:31 GMT
I know that the SM has plenty currently available but there are still certain loans that are extremely hard to get hold of. I was wondering if SS could implement a way that investors could pledge a certain amount they want in a specific loan and they then get placed in a queue until someone places a loan part for sale.
Potentially the "amount available" could go into negative territory to indicate how much is in the queue to buy. Sellers would also know they will be able to sell their loan part(s) immediately if the amount available is negative.
It still seems with some loans that it is fastest finger first and having to sit around waiting to get lucky that the loan you want pops up at the right time.
Any views?
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Mar 21, 2016 21:39:26 GMT
It's been heavily debated on several previous threads. I, like many others IIRC, prefer that SS remain as simple as possible. The SM is there to provide the means to exit a loan, which it does very well. Pre-funding is there to provide the means to buy into new loans, which it does very well. If it ain't broke, no need to fix it.
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Mar 21, 2016 21:45:02 GMT
As SteveT says, there has been quite a lot of debate (see the 'prefunding for the SM' thread, if you can find it). Personally I'd like what you suggest too .. despite what SteveT says, 'buying into an old loan' is (IMO) broke, and could be fixed (as AC have, only better), but there is no sign SS are going to do so. You may just have to get better at FFF, or put up with just buying the new loans (or those with plenty around).
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ben
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Post by ben on Mar 21, 2016 21:51:09 GMT
The secondary market is designed for people to sell when they need too, at the moment with the exception of a few loans it sells on the secondary market within minutes, no other site comes close to this (MT is not bad but does not have the bulk being sold) why would SS want to change from a model that obviously works to one that may be better but might not be. Also with regards to the some of the more popular loans why would SS want to spend time/money on this when the loans are funded, they will get nothing out of something that will have a cost and it might not just be a simple as add a few lines of code.
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jonah
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Post by jonah on Mar 21, 2016 21:53:25 GMT
Personally I'm with the intergalactic spaceship on this one, but there are strong views on both sides and crucially SS have stated they like the status quo.
That said, to improve your odds, can I recommend the go live date and the day after a new loan is launched. That tends to have the most loan churn and rarer parts can be seen. I completed the only one missing in my set on Saturday just gone for example.
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sildenafil
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Post by sildenafil on Mar 21, 2016 21:58:05 GMT
It's been heavily debated on several previous threads. I, like many others IIRC, prefer that SS remain as simple as possible. The SM is there to provide the means to exit a loan, which it does very well. Pre-funding is there to provide the means to buy into new loans, which it does very well. If it ain't broke, no need to fix it. I did search but couldn't find anything specifically to the idea I have suggested. I'm sorry if it has been debated previously. I agree that the SM works very well at the moment but some loans that I want to diversify into seem to be out of reach. Even the newest loans that have recently gone live only come onto the SM for a few seconds and are gone. For example, for some people, the allocation for PBL86 was a lot lower than they would want. Once the loan goes live, pledging an amount they want will eventually get them to the level they want to invest. For people who want to increase their investment in SS they have to wait until payday to have the money to invest. If a loan they really like goes live before they have the required funds to pre-fund they would lose out until they can get lucky to invest in the SM. Just an alternative view to help buyers as well as sellers.
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sl75
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Post by sl75 on Mar 21, 2016 22:03:11 GMT
The trouble is that you've got (say) £4M of money that wants to be invested in a loan with only (say) £1M available...
So after the loan goes live, you'd either have pledges for several times the total amount that will ever be traded (meaning that if you don't get in the queue on the very first day, you might as well not bother), or you'd need some other prioritisation or a system to determine which of the money that investors would like to put in the loan is permitted to join your proposed pledge queue.
The current system (where you have to be online and ready to complete a captcha at a moment's notice to even be in the running) does at least have the advantage that you're only competing against similarly-motivated lenders rather than the entire population of lenders who've ever considered investing in the loan.
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ablender
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Post by ablender on Mar 22, 2016 6:35:50 GMT
I am totally against such proposal. If, let us say, I want £500 of loan 42 and this is not available on the market, and this is queued, I will need to have £500 waiting just in case loan 42 comes up for sale. Otherwise I will have no guarantee that I can pay for it when it comes along.
As things stand, If I see anything I want and I can pay for it I will buy it, otherwise I pass.
The system that is being proposed is similar to the one available on ABL and as soon as you make an bid, your money is deducted from your balance. Will this increase cash drag. I believe it does.
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sildenafil
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Post by sildenafil on Mar 22, 2016 7:09:04 GMT
I am totally against such proposal. If, let us say, I want £500 of loan 42 and this is not available on the market, and this is queued, I will need to have £500 waiting just in case loan 42 comes up for sale. Otherwise I will have no guarantee that I can pay for it when it comes along. As things stand, If I see anything I want and I can pay for it I will buy it, otherwise I pass. The system that is being proposed is similar to the one available on ABL and as soon as you make an bid, your money is deducted from your balance. Will this increase cash drag. I believe it does. The system of INPL would still be valid, giving you 48 hours to adjust any negative balance. So, in your example, you wouldn't need £500 available in your account to invest immediately.
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sl75
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Post by sl75 on Mar 22, 2016 8:16:00 GMT
The system of INPL would still be valid, giving you 48 hours to adjust any negative balance. So, in your example, you wouldn't need £500 available in your account to invest immediately. INPL only pushes it one stage back though - you'd still need £500 available to transfer in at a moment's notice, and multiply this up for every loan you've targetted. So maybe a few large loans draw down causing a flurry of trading activity, and you're suddenly finding that your £500 pledges that you made months ago got to the front of 6 different queues, and SS are suddenly demanding a payment of £3000 within 24 hours... I expect SS find that people who are actively choosing to buy loans there and then are a little more likely to actually honour them than the ones who set up a "pre-fund" weeks or even months ago, and have no desire to actively monitor what's happening going forwards more than absolutely necessary.
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ben
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Post by ben on Mar 22, 2016 8:25:51 GMT
I am totally against such proposal. If, let us say, I want £500 of loan 42 and this is not available on the market, and this is queued, I will need to have £500 waiting just in case loan 42 comes up for sale. Otherwise I will have no guarantee that I can pay for it when it comes along. As things stand, If I see anything I want and I can pay for it I will buy it, otherwise I pass. The system that is being proposed is similar to the one available on ABL and as soon as you make an bid, your money is deducted from your balance. Will this increase cash drag. I believe it does. The system of INPL would still be valid, giving you 48 hours to adjust any negative balance. So, in your example, you wouldn't need £500 available in your account to invest immediately. But where is the gain for SS they would potentially have to fund the £500 if you do not pay in the 48 hours and then resell it, creating them work for something they do not profit over
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sam i am
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Post by sam i am on Mar 22, 2016 14:28:58 GMT
As SteveT says, there has been quite a lot of debate (see the 'prefunding for the SM' thread, if you can find it). Personally I'd like what you suggest too .. despite what SteveT says, 'buying into an old loan' is (IMO) broke, and could be fixed (as AC have, only better), but there is no sign SS are going to do so. You may just have to get better at FFF, or put up with just buying the new loans (or those with plenty around). I'm just thinking this through and wondering what I would do if we had a queue system for the SM. There are a number of smaller loans where it is pretty obvious that most investors will get less than they want in these loans. So my plan is to sit at the keyboard waiting for the small loan to go live and then quickly enter a big number into my SM request to try to get to the head of the queue and grab as much as I can. All that has happened here is that FFF at point of the part being put onto the SM has been replaced with FFF at point of loan launch. So this will actually make the situation worse because multiple FFF events will have been replaced by a single one. The situation here will be little different from the one we had before pre-funding except that the action will have moved from the PM to the SM. So the solution has to be more complex. Restricting the maximum purchase on the SM will help avoid BHs requesting huge amounts but not stop FFF. Splitting a SM sale between all interested buyers may end up with tiny allocations. Aggregating all SM sales in (say) a week would allow for larger allocations but sellers will want their money quicker. Allowing sellers to charge a premium will bring supply and demand into balance but will encourage flipping (and from what I have read on this forum I think there is little appetite for this feature) Is there another platform with as much demand for loans as there is for some of the smaller loans on SS? How do they solve the issue? Personally I would prefer things to stay as they are. It's not perfect but I suspect that any change will just shift the problem elsewhere. Ultimately the problem with some small loans is that there is more demand than supply.
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ablender
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Post by ablender on Mar 22, 2016 16:19:28 GMT
I am totally against such proposal. If, let us say, I want £500 of loan 42 and this is not available on the market, and this is queued, I will need to have £500 waiting just in case loan 42 comes up for sale. Otherwise I will have no guarantee that I can pay for it when it comes along. As things stand, If I see anything I want and I can pay for it I will buy it, otherwise I pass. The system that is being proposed is similar to the one available on ABL and as soon as you make an bid, your money is deducted from your balance. Will this increase cash drag. I believe it does. The system of INPL would still be valid, giving you 48 hours to adjust any negative balance. So, in your example, you wouldn't need £500 available in your account to invest immediately. Not in my account, but I still need to keep in mind that £500 that I queued and I need to get it from somewhere so I need to keep it available somehow. Thus . . . cash drag.
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Investboy
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Post by Investboy on Mar 22, 2016 17:32:45 GMT
Why do people are so keen to invest in all the loans on the platform? And if this is not possible they complain or suggest "improvements"? It would be better if one just acknowledged that one will never posses certain loans that are "precious" (small with low LTV). Just invest in the current and new loans and be happy. Disclaimer: I'm not in all the loans, maybe half of them, and overweight with the recent ones. But that is life. I have time do spread it more evenly in time. If savingstream have resources to do some development can they just fix the 'input' field for the amounts to buy. It drives me crazy when my cursor moves to random positions and just tries to guess the number I want to enter.
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ablender
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Post by ablender on Mar 22, 2016 18:14:45 GMT
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