0risk
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Post by 0risk on Sept 25, 2016 15:04:09 GMT
(Please be gentle, I'm new to p2p and English isn't my "primary" language)
I often feel frustrated with the captcha and the FFF game. So here's a suggestion to implement bottom-up approach to SM too:
1. When a new offer is put to "available loans", it is held for a period of time (say 20 minutes).
2. During this time, investing offers are not completed, but just registered by the system.
3. At the end of the period, the loan is distributed fairly (bottom-up or randomly).
I see many advantages:
- eliminate the Captcha
- improve fairness
- increase diversification of loans (There is more chance of a loan be distributed to more than one person. Also, it becomes easier to acquire more loans.)
- avoid dodgy operations
Cons:
- changes; more rules
- you don't know immediately if your bid was successful
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spiral
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Post by spiral on Sept 25, 2016 15:23:08 GMT
Funnily enough I had a similar thought a couple of weeks back.
My thought was that basically 2 types of queue existed.
The first was a timed queue similar to yours although my thought was 60mins.
The second was a standard queue.
When someone places a loan on the market, if no loans of that type exist, a timed queue is started.
If a queue already exists, it joins that queue whether it be a standard queue or timed queue.
If it joins a timed queue, it joins it with the remaining time still running i.e. it doesn't reset it.
At the end of the timed period, a method of distribution is evaluated, your suggestion is bottom up although my thought was random allocation as most people have an amount they would like to receive in mind and if it is below that, they'd rather not have shrapnel.
If loan parts still remain after the timed out period, the queue becomes a standard queue which is available for any instant bid.
Like you, my thought was primarily to do away with FFF and the need for recapcha but it would also have the side effect of eliminating some shrapnel from the system.
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ben
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Post by ben on Sept 25, 2016 15:32:21 GMT
The secondary market currently works for SS, so why change it? it is probably the most liquid of all the sites and to change things around to make it better for some newer members might deter some of the longer bigger investors.
SS release loans quite regualrly and generally before them there is a fair amount of activity on the secondary market. So with a bit of patience you do not have to do the FFF.
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ablender
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Post by ablender on Sept 25, 2016 15:39:52 GMT
I see a problem with this suggestion. If I have £200 that I want to invest, and currently there are two or more loans that I would like to buy a part of; as things stand I can try one if it works good, if not I try another as quickly as I can. If I bid £200 on one and have to wait 20 minutes, I have no guarantee that I will be given £200 and in the meantime the others would have timed out too. I can try to place a bid of £100 each on two loans but then I am not sure if I will be short on one and over bid on the other.
As things stand, it might be frustrating but it get us as in-touch as we can get with the buying process.
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treeman
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Post by treeman on Sept 25, 2016 16:17:00 GMT
The secondary market currently works for SS, so why change it? it is probably the most liquid of all the sites and to change things around to make it better for some newer members might deter some of the longer bigger investors. SS release loans quite regualrly and generally before them there is a fair amount of activity on the secondary market. So with a bit of patience you do not have to do the FFF. SS have stated before that the SM is intended to be a route for investors to release funds, in a reasonable time-frame, if required - ie Sell Loan holdings. They do not see it as a primary route to making investments. So as far as SS are concerned, it works just great and does exactly what it is intended to do.
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spiral
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Post by spiral on Sept 25, 2016 17:00:06 GMT
SS have stated before that the SM is intended to be a route for investors to release funds, in a reasonable time-frame, if required - ie Sell Loan holdings. They do not see it as a primary route to making investments. So as far as SS are concerned, it works just great and does exactly what it is intended to do. Agree to a certain extent but if that was their only thought, why did they introduce capcha in the first place? I suspect that it was because they felt that some people had a distinct advantage when buying on the SM (bots) and for whatever reason, they wanted to even the playing field somewhat. Unfortunately they've still got a system that some can manage to play better than others. Getting back to the OP, the title is regarding improving the buying experience, I believe this would as you'd do away with capcha and FFF. I don't see that it would affect the sellers experience other than a slight delay in crediting of funds. ablender . I take your point re not knowing whether you were successful or not immediately but personally, I'd rather that than sit at the PC for an hour franticly bidding without any success. This way I could make several bids in one go, then come back an hour later to see where I was successful. Also it would be unlikely that all the timed queues you are interested in would finish simultaneously so there would be scope to come back after you knew the result of your first bid and then bid or not on subsequent loans. No system can ever be perfect but once you get capcha's on the current system, you might as well give up.
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SteveT
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Post by SteveT on Sept 25, 2016 17:09:43 GMT
They introduced Captcha after everyone started screaming at them that the bots were cleaning up and putting everyone else at a huge disadvantage. Adding Captcha was the simplest way to stuff the bots and stop the complaints.
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cooling_dude
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Post by cooling_dude on Sept 25, 2016 17:44:15 GMT
The primary purpose of the SM is to be able to sell your loans fast (when the SM is liquid) and it does a good job at that. Your suggestions would result in allocations amounting to 10s of pounds (i.e. not worth it), and would (only slightly, I admit) restrict the quick sale of loans. Don't be in such a rush to invest your pot! Bide your time with the pre-funding and if nothing is available, diversify with other platforms  |
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0risk
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Post by 0risk on Sept 25, 2016 18:16:16 GMT
Thanks Dude and all.
I agree that this would result in smaller loan pieces. Personally, I like the idea of having many small loans.
And I see many people buying small bits here.
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spiral
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Post by spiral on Sept 25, 2016 18:44:00 GMT
They introduced Captcha after everyone started screaming at them that the bots were cleaning up and putting everyone else at a huge disadvantage. Adding Captcha was the simplest way to stuff the bots and stop the complaints. That was my point. If SS were only interested in making the SM a route out for people, why introduce a method to stop one person hoovering up everything!
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Post by martin44 on Sept 25, 2016 18:45:03 GMT
Thanks Dude and all. I agree that this would result in smaller loan pieces. Personally, I like the idea of having many small loans. And I see many people buying small bits here. not all of us are looking for small pieces, i am not a BH by any means, but SS should not be re-structured to suit a certain maj/minority investors.
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Sept 25, 2016 18:48:29 GMT
They introduced Captcha after everyone started screaming at them that the bots were cleaning up and putting everyone else at a huge disadvantage. Adding Captcha was the simplest way to stuff the bots and stop the complaints. That was my point. If SS were only interested in making the SM a route out for people, why introduce a method to stop one person hoovering up everything! A quiet life! In SS opinion it is for selling, the multitude's that it is for buying & diversification, anti hoover device stops the deafing tumult from those whose opinion is at variance to reality
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Sept 25, 2016 19:30:12 GMT
Getting back to the OP, the title is regarding improving the buying experience, I believe this would as you'd do away with capcha and FFF. You'd certainly get rid of FFF, but you might want to retain Captcha to keep the bots at bay. (IMHO, Captcha is a problem only in an environment where speed is important/critical.) I'd like to increase and diversify my SS portfolio via the SM, but I don't like needing to be at my PC 24/7 ready for FFF, so I see potential benefit from the OP. I do see some pitfalls, though, such as the creation of more shrapnel. Perhaps the solution for that would be to set a minimum allocation level. If there isn't enough offered that the allocation would exceed the minimum, then randomly distribute minimum-sized parts among those trying to buy.
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Post by GSV3MIaC on Sept 25, 2016 21:13:22 GMT
There are several posts, if not whole threads, about this (under the heading 'Prefunding for the SM' or similar?) .. the goal being to 'fair share' the (popular) SM parts without favouring people with more time, faster internet connections, or better bots. Yes, for selling the SM works quite well on any basis (even bots), but then so would the primary auction market.
Some of us can't see why, given that we (apparently) need some 'fair shares' mechanism for the initial auction, we should not have something similar when £10k of a popular loan gets put on the SM.
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warn
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Post by warn on Sept 26, 2016 6:42:48 GMT
Cons: - changes; more rules That's quite enough to turn me off the idea.
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