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Post by aloanatlast on May 2, 2014 22:43:40 GMT
FC, instead of taking the hint and killing the auction, have posted a justification. Well imagine my surprise.
But the more I read, the more I get that sinking feeling. Doubts have been expressed elsewhere as to whether our friend is really as successful and award-winning as he claims. One of the bloodhound's questions, now modded into oblivion, mentioned a possible investigative TV report in production. If that goes out, it's not hard to imagine the whole Ponzi unravelling.
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Post by davee39 on May 3, 2014 7:13:35 GMT
The two businesses look virtually identical, as do the pitches. Only the business name has been hidden to protect the g*****. The government is also putting 10% into this. Unfortunately there are lemming bidders out there who do not read the Q&A's.
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on May 3, 2014 8:27:43 GMT
Good job I've saved all the now deleted/moderated Q and A so I can see all the doubts which have been raised. Wouldn't want to slam a couple of grand in by mistake following a snooze.
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blender
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Post by blender on May 3, 2014 9:17:35 GMT
But the more I read, the more I get that sinking feeling. Doubts have been expressed elsewhere as to whether our friend is really as successful and award-winning as he claims. One of the bloodhound's questions, now modded into oblivion, mentioned a possible investigative TV report in production. If that goes out, it's not hard to imagine the whole Ponzi unravelling.
Ponzi is a bit harsh and specific, I think more of a possible bubble built by a person around his personality. But then you ask the questions, what if this person meets with challenging personal circumstances, and is unable to continue? What happens to the revenue streams? Is the value of the £2m intangible assets connected with his continued involvement? Is the balancing current debt of around £2m to the director/owner/star-performer/ideas-factory/ace-manager etc really that safe from repayments? Even assuming that everything is as good as is stated, the net effect of the two loans seems little different from granting the owner/director, etc a personal unsecured and uninsured loan of £300k. Now that it is fully funded I have bid £20, so that I can see how FC performs if anything goes wrong - which I hope will not happen.
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Post by aloanatlast on May 3, 2014 9:49:36 GMT
If that goes out, it's not hard to imagine the whole Ponzi unravelling. Ponzi is a bit harsh and specific Well I don't find it hard to imagine that money paid up front by punters has been spent, and the delivery of the services they've paid for now depends on the continued inflow of more money up front from more punters. But we know how that story ends.
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blender
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Post by blender on May 3, 2014 10:21:07 GMT
If that goes out, it's not hard to imagine the whole Ponzi unravelling. Ponzi is a bit harsh and specific Well I don't find it hard to imagine that money paid up front by punters has been spent, and the delivery of the services they've paid for now depends on the continued inflow of more money up front from more punters. But we know how that story ends. Well I agree with that possibility, but someone might say just feel the valuable assets that have been created (whoops sorry you cannot feel them). I associate the Ponzi scheme with taking money for investment and paying the promised returns not from any actual investment but from the growing deposits of later investors. This is fraudulent and am sure that you were not wishing that inference to be taken from the use of the name. This chap seems to be someone whose confidence that he can grow his business interests to £1bn might based on believing his own propaganda - which he asks us to also believe. We are pretty much in agreement, setting aside the semantics. We might agree on 'house of cards'.
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Post by aloanatlast on May 3, 2014 10:27:04 GMT
The two businesses look virtually identical The "parent" company (5030 borrower) also has the business that won most of the awards, an internet franchise. But the awards business is a bit of a racket itself. And where's the business? It's not new, but few towns have a site, even fewer have an actual franchisee, and some of those are shareholders (possibly victims given shares to keep quiet?). Most of the few sites that do exist are pretty minimal, nothing to attract footfall, and not a lot of advertisers. If the advertisers have paid any money, they've wasted it, but I suspect that many haven't. The advertisers are provided with unconvincing customer testimonials. Not only can I not see any real value being created - I can't even see much money being shifted from punters' pockets to our hero's.
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wysiati
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Post by wysiati on May 3, 2014 11:38:25 GMT
There is something else which is potentially concerning.
Just look now at the aggregate rate for the 'Anonymous' Loan 6043 (£150k @ 9.9%) and compare to surrounding 'B' risk band loans (£50k @ 11.1%, £55k @11.3%, £20k @9.9%) or even 'A' risk band loans (£50k @ 9.5%, £35k @9.5%, £50k @ 9.7%, £70k @ 10.1%, £150k @ 12.7%) or even 'A+' risk band loans (£57.3k @ 9.5%, £100k @ 11.8%).
Could it be that 6043 has been given a considerable extra push from autobid, potentially at the expense of other loans? Is there any other explanation?
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Post by davee39 on May 3, 2014 12:33:08 GMT
Absolutely not. There is no way a respectable business, fully approved by FC, would bid on its own loan application to get the rate down.
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fasty
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Post by fasty on May 3, 2014 13:09:17 GMT
Perhaps blender's surreptitiously slipped a few grand into it...  |
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blender
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Post by blender on May 3, 2014 13:33:48 GMT
Perhaps blender's surreptitiously slipped a few grand into it... No, just £20 and that will soon be outbid. I agree that the MBR money at £47k is very high, with no large holdings in it. The £10k spikes at 9.3% and 9.8% also suggest autobid, with general settings of 9.5% and 10%. So I am with the theory that Autobid has been attracted by the messianic powers of the entrepreneur. I cannot explain the mechanism.
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merlin
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Post by merlin on May 3, 2014 14:24:12 GMT
I recall a previous loan request from this entrepreneur which had some fairly scathing Q & A's regarding previous ventures. Just google N**** B******* Scam and make your own mind up. Interestingly a You tube video praising this man by someone pretending to be an ordinary customer looks like it features an employee/partner. What a fantastic example of the work and depth of research FC carry out on Due Diligence to ensure we don't fall victim to scammers. This should be seen by the FCA to show them just how terribly keen FC are to look after their investors interests, not.
UPDATE 2.30pm Saturday. Given all the machinations that FC have gone through in moderating Q & A's/relisting etc. they must be painting themselves into an position where when this loan goes belly up they will have no choice but to refund all borrowers. It certainly makes me wonder if anyone at FC is supervising what is going on with this loan. If they chose just to ignore the situation and send it to FCR they leave themselves wide open to masses of complaints going to the Financial Ombudsman and possibly the involvement of the FCA. Persistence in ignoring negative information coming to light in Q & A's has to be seen as negligence on the part of FC and yet again could raise the Spector of "obtaining money by false pretences" under the Theft Act.
Further thoughts on this one. Given that this is a Bank Holiday weekend I doubt whether anyone is at "home" at FC until Tuesday and most of the comment on here and in the Q & A's has arisen in the last 24 hours. It is therefore just possible that we are rattling our sticks at an empty cage which is a bit pointless really. Could of course test this out by lobbing in a few more awkward Questions and seeing what happens!
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Post by aloanatlast on May 3, 2014 14:56:49 GMT
Autobid now likes to spread its money round the unfilled auctions in such a way as to try to equalise the %-full figures. So it favours any loan that's tending to lag behind, to help it catch up. I've said before that this makes it a tool for buying its users the stuff that manual bidders don't want. What I didn't latch onto is that buying a bigger share of the unpopular loans, combined with bidding at lower rates than manual bidders, will mean that it actually drags down the average rate on the unpopular loans. Oo-er.
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blender
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Post by blender on May 3, 2014 15:28:13 GMT
Autobid now likes to spread its money round the unfilled auctions in such a way as to try to equalise the %-full figures. So it favours any loan that's tending to lag behind, to help it catch up. I've said before that this makes it a tool for buying its users the stuff that manual bidders don't want. What I didn't latch onto is that buying a bigger share of the unpopular loans, combined with bidding at lower rates than manual bidders, will mean that it actually drags down the average rate on the unpopular loans. Oo-er. Thanks for that brilliant explanation. 'Let nothing that FC has deemed worthy go unfilled'. So the best way to get a low rate on a large loan is to alienate the manual bidders. Perhaps this borrower really is that clever.
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Post by aloanatlast on May 3, 2014 15:38:24 GMT
And having Googled our hero a few times, I'm now getting plagued by targeted Google ads for his dubious products.
Well I suppose it's better than incessant ads for stuff I might be tempted to go and buy.
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