rs
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Post by rs on Jul 31, 2017 8:50:51 GMT
Sounds odd that the borrower could not tell FS the schedule & plan as contractor is appointed by borrower. But maybe FS don't believe the borrower anymore. Also, hopefully FS are checking about the court case which was to be settled soon.
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09dolphin
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Post by 09dolphin on Aug 1, 2017 10:51:54 GMT
I'm quite curious. With the latest photo showing the site still requires significantly more clearance work does anyone care to guess when work on the foundations will start - assuming that future progress will have a similar time frame to that already established. My guestimate that if progress continues at the same rate investors MAY see a return of their cash in about 15 - 30 years but there will be no interest.
Equally I'm curious as to how FS can state that the LTV of the site and materials does not exceed 70% of the total funds lent. It would be good to hear a rational explanation from someone involved in the loan or even from the building trade as I can't believe the site (as it is now) has an increased value that reflects only 70% of the total money lent.
It would be even better to hear from FS how they justify the total money lent and how this equates to no more than 70% of the LTV. FS seem curiously silent on the justification re the further money lent.
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Post by scrooge on Aug 1, 2017 11:34:17 GMT
Sounds odd that the borrower could not tell FS the schedule & plan as contractor is appointed by borrower. But maybe FS don't believe the borrower anymore. Also, hopefully FS are checking about the court case which was to be settled soon. I too am wondering what has happened about this court case? All has gone quiet all of a sudden. Do FS even have evidence there ever was a court case? Thank goodness I only have a pocket money amount invested.
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r1200gs
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Post by r1200gs on Aug 1, 2017 13:24:21 GMT
Sounds odd that the borrower could not tell FS the schedule & plan as contractor is appointed by borrower. But maybe FS don't believe the borrower anymore. Also, hopefully FS are checking about the court case which was to be settled soon. I too am wondering what has happened about this court case? All has gone quiet all of a sudden. Do FS even have evidence there ever was a court case? Thank goodness I only have a pocket money amount invested. The court case that I suspect we may have paid for you mean? Well, he was supposed to have won it and it was just a case of settling the amount and writing the cheque. Not that it's ever that simple, as many people who have won a judgment will tell you. Regardless, we lent money against this security, not the outcome of a court case. I just can't wait to see the next update. "Went to Whitehaven and borrower never showed, full team of contractors on site Monday?" Who knows, anything is possible with this one.
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Aug 1, 2017 13:30:24 GMT
I still want fundingsecure to give a true statement of what the real valuation is now, and what the real LTV is now, and if the LTV is or was ever above 70% what FS will do to recompense lenders for FS mismanagement of tranche distributions in the event of an ultimate default. However, I don't think FS wants to do this.
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rs
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Post by rs on Aug 1, 2017 14:31:27 GMT
I still want fundingsecure to give a true statement of what the real valuation is now, and what the real LTV is now, and if the LTV is or was ever above 70% what FS will do to recompense lenders for FS mismanagement of tranche distributions in the event of an ultimate default. However, I don't think FS wants to do this. looking forward to contractor meeting update tomorrow from FS. Hopefully contractor shows up. If he doesn't then pretty obvious he's not been paid either.
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sirius
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Post by sirius on Aug 1, 2017 16:19:04 GMT
Not in this loan but have been following it with interest.
It appears that the borrower may have used deception to obtain money for the court case, having stated that it was for the site...........deception, ergo fraud.
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Aug 1, 2017 16:51:35 GMT
Maybe the proceeds of the court case should be considered (locked in somehow) as part of the security, and should be paid over to FS if and when it appears. fundingsecure What was monetary result of the court settlement; you haven't informed us yet.
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r1200gs
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Post by r1200gs on Aug 2, 2017 8:39:20 GMT
Well, I think it's a fair bet that FS would not have been slow in coming forward if the latest meeting was all great news. I should say that I'm not a natural pessimist, just a realist. I'll be thrilled to bits to hear that it's all going great. Actually, forget that. I'll be thrilled when I SEE it's all going great.
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09dolphin
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Post by 09dolphin on Aug 2, 2017 10:54:57 GMT
Loan update an hour ago. Basically says contractor met with FS and said 1st activity is to render sides of adjoining properties. I expect the owners of these properties are threatening legal action if there is water ingress. The contractor expects to be up to roof height in 16 WEEKS. Then of course there will be the roof to put on, the interior walls etc will require finishing, interior fixtures and fittings. My guess is that this property may become available for sale in spring next year. Loans were made active as follows: 4th Tranche 5/7/16 1st tranche 26/9/16 2nd tranche 14/10/16 5th tranche 17/11/16 3rd tranche 23/11/16
FS really are up the proverbial creek without a paddle. FS can't bring in receivers as they are than exposed to accusations that the LTV exceeded 70% which would have consequences for FS. Some lenders are getting increasingly angry and considering starting the process until the Financial Ombudsman becomes involved. If the lender decides to walk away FS are left with a semi cleared site and some made to measure timber frames which come nowhere near 70% of the total lent.
I know when I lent on the 1st tranche I knew my loan would be for 6 months at least but I never expected it to last well over 18+ months with FS almost pulling their forelock and saying to the borrower "please make some progress we can report. Be as optimistic as you like but give us some good news to report - PLEASE".
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r1200gs
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Post by r1200gs on Aug 2, 2017 11:02:11 GMT
Loan update an hour ago. Basically says contractor met with FS and said 1st activity is to render sides of adjoining properties. I expect the owners of these properties are threatening legal action if there is water ingress. The contractor expects to be up to roof height in 16 WEEKS. Then of course there will be the roof to put on, the interior walls etc will require finishing, interior fixtures and fittings. My guess is that this property may become available for sale in spring next year. Loans were made active as follows: 4th Tranche 5/7/16 1st tranche 26/9/16 2nd tranche 14/10/16 5th tranche 17/11/16 3rd tranche 23/11/16
FS really are up the proverbial creek without a paddle. FS can't bring in receivers as they are than exposed to accusations that the LTV exceeded 70% which would have consequences for FS. Some lenders are getting increasingly angry and considering starting the process until the Financial Ombudsman becomes involved. If the lender decides to walk away FS are left with a semi cleared site and some made to measure timber frames which come nowhere near 79% of the total lent.
I know when I lent on the 1st tranche I knew my loan would be for 6 months at least but I never expected it to last well over 18+ months with FS almost pulling their forelock and saying to the borrower "please make some progress we can report. Be as optimistic as you like but give us some good news to report - PLEASE". Until some work happens, I will dismiss this update as complete and utter rubbish just as the previous ones have been. If I'm wrong, great.
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Aug 2, 2017 11:08:01 GMT
Q to FS. Why do you not insist on the borrower paying interest now to renew the loan so that development can continue? Lenders deserve something! Probable answer. We can't do that because there is no way lenders would fund the renewal after the fiasco of us doling out tranches to the borrower without any work being done. Therefore this loan will continue as overdue until the building is completed and sold - or the borrower defaults. So, FS, how about advancing the current outstanding interest to lenders yourselves as a goodwill gesture? <wot d'yer mean, "bog off"?
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09dolphin
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Post by 09dolphin on Aug 2, 2017 11:20:30 GMT
Q to FS. Why do you not insist on the borrower paying interest now to renew the loan so that development can continue? Lenders deserve something! Probable answer. We can't do that because there is no way lenders would fund the renewal after the fiasco of us doling out tranches to the borrower without any work being done. Therefore this loan will continue as overdue until the building is completed and sold - or the borrower defaults. So, FS, how about advancing the current outstanding interest to lenders yourselves as a goodwill gesture? <wot d'yer mean, "bog off"? Many loans that are in difficulty make a partial repayment of interest as a gesture of good faith. I interpret this as the borrower trying their best but having problems and I always think how easy it is to overestimate progress. But give me one good reason why the borrower should pay a penny now.
In the case of Whitehaven. Why should the borrower pay anything as they have FS over a barrel. Lenders are stuck with this loan until the borrower decides to complete the project, FS discover that the borrower has made fraudulent claims to get money released and refers the matter to the police (in which case FS would also be liable for some of the losses) or the borrower walks away from the loan.
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oldgrumpy
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Post by oldgrumpy on Aug 2, 2017 11:30:34 GMT
Q to FS. Why do you not insist on the borrower paying interest now to renew the loan so that development can continue? Lenders deserve something! Probable answer. We can't do that because there is no way lenders would fund the renewal after the fiasco of us doling out tranches to the borrower without any work being done. Therefore this loan will continue as overdue until the building is completed and sold - or the borrower defaults. So, FS, how about advancing the current outstanding interest to lenders yourselves as a goodwill gesture? <wot d'yer mean, "bog off"? Many loans that are in difficulty make a partial repayment of interest as a gesture of good faith. I interpret this as the borrower trying their best but having problems and I always think how easy it is to overestimate progress. But give me one good reason why the borrower should pay a penny now.
In the case of Whitehaven. Why should the borrower pay anything as they have FS over a barrel. Lenders are stuck with this loan until the borrower decides to complete the project, FS discover that the borrower has made fraudulent claims to get money released and refers the matter to the police (in which case FS would also be liable for some of the losses) or the borrower walks away from the loan.
Exactly! All caused by FS not doing their job properly.
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rs
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Post by rs on Aug 2, 2017 14:42:59 GMT
Still not heard on court case but no doubt FS will soon give us a meaningful update on this soon! As for this loan, I expect capital & full interest to be paid as otherwise FS have some serious issues to deal with.
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