09dolphin
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Post by 09dolphin on Dec 14, 2016 14:12:44 GMT
This relates to Liverpool and assisted living apartments. Reading the renewal information for loan 9682709212 I note that a loan of 245K at 70.2% LTV was funded last month. There is a 2nd loan for £113.6K at a LTV (including pervious loan) now 39.5% LTV. I have asked FS about the reason for the change in value of the property and I have been told that the reason is because assisted living apartments command a much higher rent. This information is included for the 1st loan at 70.2%
My understanding is that the increased rent for assisted living properties normally reflects the staffing costs associated with supporting disabled people rather than some inherent increase in value of the property. As someone who has previously invested in care homes, nursing homes and supported living accommodation in the past I cannot understand how the there can be such an uprate in the valuation of a property in 1 month.
I would appreciate anyone who has information posting responses on this thread.
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mikes1531
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Post by mikes1531 on Dec 14, 2016 18:17:49 GMT
Inasmuch as this loan isn't shown to be the first tranche of a larger development loan, ISTM that the borrower simply is raising more funds -- for no specified purpose -- based on the increased value of the land resulting from the PP approval. Perhaps they intend to use the funds to start on the development before they've arranged their development financing, but FS haven't suggested that's the case.
As for the new valuation... it's extremely sensitive to the capitalisation factor applied, and 5% strikes me as incredibly optimistic. Especially as it's applied to an annual income that hasn't been reduced at all by any expenses or voids.
Using a more conservative 7% capitalisation factor, but still applying it to the £150k gross income, results in a value of just £175k! (That's £150k/7%, less the £1,969k build costs.) That's not even as much as the existing £245k loan.
And wasn't it FS that used what they referred to as a conservative 10% capitalisation factor, rather than a more optimistic 7.5% factor, for another property valuation?
I can accept that a different capitalisation factor might be appropriate in this case because of the structure of the operating agreement, but ISTM that using 5% and applying it to a gross income amount seems unrealistically optimistic. However, I have no experience in this field, so I'd appreciate any input others might have.
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Post by red on Jul 28, 2018 8:29:11 GMT
A year of failed attempts to refinance this loan. Another case of FS closing their eyes and hoping for the best for a loan in trouble.
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james21
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Post by james21 on Jul 28, 2018 8:54:09 GMT
A year of failed attempts to refinance this loan. Another case of FS closing their eyes and hoping for the best for a loan in trouble. Agreed; loans on the plot have been running since May 2016 gradually increasing to pay the interest, and no work done to develop the site. The additional borrowing loan for £100k is subordinate effectively a second charge and been running for over a year. Cant refinance because cant raise enough money to pay off FS loans because the valuation is too high thats my guess. The comments from FS over the last year are comical. Now they say discussions with new lender for part repayment in exchange for a second charge, meaning some of the current FS first charge is returned to lenders and the balance becomes a second charge and the £100k additional borrowing becomes a 3rd charge. Even when that is put into place (if it happens) the whole thing will drag out for some time yet until the site is developed. If it is not developed the owner will not be able to keep up the interest payments with new lender and FS because they cant find ways of increasing the value of the site to raise new money. With no development finance loan will default then get sold on the cheap. FS lenders get a severe haircut. The new 3rd lenders lose the lot. Better hope it gets developed
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kielbasa
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Post by kielbasa on Jul 28, 2018 17:26:39 GMT
I wonder how many FS lenders on the first charge would be happy being shifted to a second charge. I wouldn't be.
Of course, we have no idea of the figures for this new possible first charge but I wonder if it would not be better for the current first charge lenders if the loan were defaulted now and the plot sold.
Whose interests are being served by this new proposal?
Maybe FS should put any proposal to a vote by the first charge lenders.
Would that happen? I doubt it.
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Post by red on Sept 8, 2018 14:32:15 GMT
Another promise of repayment in a few days. After the loan update mooting a partial repayment in exchange for a second charge FS haven't bothered to clarify whether the repayment they're expecting will be a full repayment, part repayment or part-exchange for some magic beans.
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on Sept 8, 2018 16:19:02 GMT
small delays it is over 8 months late !
for FS sleepers I have a nibble in this one so I hope the above is correct and more like the cinema and less like the powerboats...
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on Nov 2, 2018 14:02:45 GMT
well today viz nearly 2 months later we have had a partial payment i.e. per £25 investment I have had
Interest earned from loan 2355178947A 02/11/2018 13:02 £0.00 +£2.14
Capital Return from loan 2355178947A 02/11/2018 13:01 £0.00 +£11.57
Well why is this so confusing - I think this is £227 repaid out of £600K but there is still the 100K supplementary loan? Think we would not check it FS? Please tell me if I am wrong.
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Post by mrclondon on Nov 13, 2019 14:05:34 GMT
Loans defaulted on the website. (The other loans to this borrower were defauletd some weeks/months ago).
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on Mar 31, 2020 18:18:25 GMT
well that didn't take long did it!
So FS have lost the first charge and now are the second charge holder which basically means, as I see it, they are at the whim of the first charge holder. This one is part of the portfolio held by a character who clearly knows how to play the system and he is connected to a leading top class lawyer whom I suspect has completely outsmarted the FS legal team...
I am in this one and I am really worried by this move - I was hoping for 50% of my zombie loan book to be recovered and now I am down to 10%!
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on May 25, 2023 20:31:31 GMT
Here is what I wrote months ago
as this is the latest update which I think they now wish to delete - for gawds sake what are these idiots playing at!
3 points I bought this as a first charge as advertised on the site - it is still there and feel totally defrauded - have we any recourse?
we lent as a first charge at 32% LTV and it get sold for £250K so we get nothing - bloody fantastic...
I think this one is related to our friend with the London Loan etc I think this is bad news for him although I find the above update very confusing
I need a drink
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Post by martin44 on May 25, 2023 21:27:57 GMT
Here is what I wrote months ago as this is the latest update which I think they now wish to delete - for gawds sake what are these idiots playing at! 3 points I bought this as a first charge as advertised on the site - it is still there and feel totally defrauded - have we any recourse? we lent as a first charge at 32% LTV and it get sold for £250K so we get nothing - bloody fantastic... I think this one is related to our friend with the London Loan etc I think this is bad news for him although I find the above update very confusing I need a drink Unfortunately the administrators running this shambles simply do not give a s**t ... much the same as the admin thieves looking after lendy et al. They are gonna get there pound of flesh with no regards to investors whatsoever... basically they dont care.
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r1200gs
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Post by r1200gs on May 26, 2023 8:17:52 GMT
It's things like this that make me fear for my returns even when it is clearly stated that my tranche of the loan has first priority, you can't trust a damned word.
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adrian77
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Post by adrian77 on Aug 17, 2023 2:31:51 GMT
latest update from FS : A 6 month loan secured by a first legal charge against a freehold development site in Liverpool
well reading through the forum this seems yet another case of blatant fraud to me with OUR loan being converted to a second charge with the result we have all been stuffed
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