sl75
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Post by sl75 on Oct 30, 2019 10:26:19 GMT
Sure, but Lendy's legitimate cut of those fees must surely have been rather smaller than the missing £2M+? Define legitimate. DFL012 has "bonus interest" accrued.
... which clearly states "This is paid in preference to Lendy's share of margins and fees.".
Those were the terms [of the bonus accrual scheme] in force at the time the loans were purchased, and are still displayed today.
Until lenders receive payment of their outstanding bonus accrual Lendy's legitimate share of margins and fees is zero.
There may be other contradictory terms and conditions, but in the case of contradictory or ambiguous T&Cs my understanding is that they must be found in favour of the party who did NOT draft them.
Edit: given the circumstances of Lendy being in administration, a compromise may well be possible where a small deduction is made to cover the reasonable costs of administering this loan, but that would certainly be a lot less than £2M.
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bulletbill
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Post by bulletbill on Oct 30, 2019 10:31:31 GMT
Owners of the flats pull together to buy the tower...fair play to them. However! their “team leader” was non other than the Original owner of the Towers building firm. Hmmmmmm then a miraculous deal appears “overnight” to buy the tower from Lendy but a ridiculously Knocked down price. Bit of back scratching gone on at lenders expense it would appear. Harsh lesson learned ere. My thoughts go out to those in deeper than I. Embezzlement:- theft or misappropriation of funds placed in one's trust (or belonging to one's employer). Does anyone care about this type of crime? It doesn’t appear to be seen as a serious crime. People who were not a direct victim tend to look at it as “business”. It’s infinitely less cared about than someone snatching a purse in the street, but chances are the snatched purse didn’t contain 2 million quid. Will Administrators look for any criminal activities here?
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Post by rhea117 on Oct 30, 2019 10:37:05 GMT
Embezzlement:- theft or misappropriation of funds placed in one's trust (or belonging to one's employer). Does anyone care about this type of crime? It doesn’t appear to be seen as a serious crime. People who were not a direct victim tend to look at it as “business”. It’s infinitely less cared about than someone snatching a purse in the street, but chances are the snatched purse didn’t contain 2 million quid. Will Administrators look for any criminal activities here? Agreed! And I thought the max fee for RSM is around £1m across all loans! So something really smells! WHERE IS THE TRANSPARENCY AND TRUST?
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ilmoro
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'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Oct 30, 2019 10:55:36 GMT
DFL012 has "bonus interest" accrued.
... which clearly states "This is paid in preference to Lendy's share of margins and fees.".
Those were the terms [of the bonus accrual scheme] in force at the time the loans were purchased, and are still displayed today.
Until lenders receive payment of their outstanding bonus accrual Lendy's legitimate share of margins and fees is zero.
There may be other contradictory terms and conditions, but in the case of contradictory or ambiguous T&Cs my understanding is that they must be found in favour of the party who did NOT draft them.
Edit: given the circumstances of Lendy being in administration, a compromise may well be possible where a small deduction is made to cover the reasonable costs of administering this loan, but that would certainly be a lot less than £2M.
A perfectly legitimate argument. Unfortunately I suspect legally it wont be held to suspercede the full platform terms & conditions. Im sure Monetus will take note of your argument for any discussion with RSM on the matter. There was also the Collections & recoveries policy issued after the new t&cs which inverted the waterfall. All money for the lawyers.
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Post by brightspark on Oct 30, 2019 11:19:18 GMT
Investors need legal advice. Has anyone tried the no win no fee route?
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sl75
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Post by sl75 on Oct 30, 2019 12:57:12 GMT
Agreed! And I thought the max fee for RSM is around £1m across all loans! So something really smells! WHERE IS THE TRANSPARENCY AND TRUST? I think you're confusing two completely different types of fees.
Fees paid to Lendy (in administration) would go onto Lendy's balance sheet and form part of the overall balance to be distributed amongst all creditors.
Fees paid to RSM themselves are kept by them and taken off Lendy's balance sheet.
Repayments from borrowers (except for a handful of "old T&Cs" loans) won't directly touch Lendy's balance sheet - the transaction should be occurring between a borrower client account and lender client accounts. At that time any fees charged would need to be explicitly deducted and properly accounted for.
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sj
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Post by sj on Oct 30, 2019 15:18:21 GMT
Furthermore, why have other recently-repaid loans not had the same amount withheld? I'm not in the other relevant loans but 2 other loans have paid back c.98%, correct me if i'm wrong. For start the other repaid loans aren't 18m in arrears so havent racked a massive sum of ongoing management fees & default interest. Second, how do you know they haven't? We have a figure to work from for HQ as we know the sum recovered, for the others we dont as they arent in recovery. 2 million+ in "ongoing management fees & default interest"?! Pull the other one. We're being stitched up by some BS T&Cs, which need to be challenged. If other loans are paying back 98%+ then where is that similarly-proportioned deduction from those loans? You're not telling me that those loans magically recovered 140-odd% or whatever it works out at of their total loan value.
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Post by mrclondon on Oct 30, 2019 15:35:08 GMT
For start the other repaid loans aren't 18m in arrears so havent racked a massive sum of ongoing management fees & default interest. Second, how do you know they haven't? We have a figure to work from for HQ as we know the sum recovered, for the others we dont as they arent in recovery. 2 million+ in "ongoing management fees & default interest"?! Pull the other one. We're being stitched up by some BS T&Cs, which need to be challenged. If other loans are paying back 98%+ then where is that similarly-proportioned deduction from those loans? You're not telling me that those loans magically recovered 140-odd% or whatever it works out at of their total loan value. The issue here is the level of accrued default interest / penalty fees due to Lendy under the T&Cs ... of the loans that have had repayments this week, only this loan was in default for long. And the important point is it has been in default for a very long time ... and has as a consequence accrued massive fees due to Lendy under the T&C's
The fact that is immoral / exploitative / unfair etc is another matter.
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ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
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Post by ilmoro on Oct 30, 2019 15:37:21 GMT
For start the other repaid loans aren't 18m in arrears so havent racked a massive sum of ongoing management fees & default interest. Second, how do you know they haven't? We have a figure to work from for HQ as we know the sum recovered, for the others we dont as they arent in recovery. 2 million+ in "ongoing management fees & default interest"?! Pull the other one. We're being stitched up by some BS T&Cs, which need to be challenged. If other loans are paying back 98%+ then where is that similarly-proportioned deduction from those loans? You're not telling me that those loans magically recovered 140-odd% or whatever it works out at of their total loan value. DFL012 £10m, management fees (ie Lendy interest margin) 550days @ 6% = c£900,000, default interest, think of a number*, lets say 6% again, so theres £1.8m
DFL034 £1.6m 130days@6% +96k, default interest, same again so refinance for at least £1.8m (on asset worth 2.7m so under 70%) (I know another 96k due to lenders but thats not relevant here)
DFL037/34 no fees/interest due as in term.
* probably an underestimate on evidence elsewhere.
And yes needs challenging.
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Post by bracknellboy on Oct 30, 2019 15:53:37 GMT
2 million+ in "ongoing management fees & default interest"?! Pull the other one. We're being stitched up by some BS T&Cs, which need to be challenged. If other loans are paying back 98%+ then where is that similarly-proportioned deduction from those loans? You're not telling me that those loans magically recovered 140-odd% or whatever it works out at of their total loan value. The issue here is the level of accrued default interest / penalty fees due to Lendy under the T&Cs ... of the loans that have had repayments this week, only this loan was in default for long. And the important point is it has been in default for a very long time ... and has as a consequence accrued massive fees due to Lendy under the T&C's
The fact that is immoral / exploitative / unfair etc is another matter.
typical that my biggest exposure on the platform has to be one that is a disaster from the recovery to lenders perspective.
I guess my next biggest, some factory where the sun doesn't shine, is going to be subject to similar pillaging of fees to go into a general creditors pot. Between the two of them, they make up about 75% of my outstanding exposure, and that is after this payment on the Quay.
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quidco
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Post by quidco on Oct 30, 2019 16:12:05 GMT
Given all these historical T&Cs are still in place Lendy (or its administrators) are presumably required to maintain the Provision Fund at 2% of the loan book and compensate lenders for any shortfalls they may experience in loan repayments...
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Post by investorni on Oct 30, 2019 17:15:22 GMT
Someone please tell me that out of any recovery made by the administrator none of that will go to LB? Considering he has not lost a penny but made millions already, there is something that makes my insides turn at the thought he will continue to profit
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sl75
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Post by sl75 on Oct 30, 2019 17:52:33 GMT
Someone please tell me that out of any recovery made by the administrator none of that will go to LB? Considering he has not lost a penny but made millions already, there is something that makes my insides turn at the thought he will continue to profit The "Joint Administrators' Proposals" published on July 15 include "Lendy Group Limited" (which is somehow not in administration) as claiming to be owed £800,000.00.
Presumably the members of the creditors committee have a bit more visibility of exactly why, and whether there is any legal requirement to and/or intention of honouring that debt.
Conversely, the administrators may have reason to make claims against LB, and indeed for all I know such claims may even be underway. It's not known, for example, who is expecting to receive the proceeds of the sale of Lendy's registered office / LB's home.
Anyone who knows actual details about what's going on is presumably either LB / RSM or under an NDA.
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Monetus
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Post by Monetus on Oct 30, 2019 17:57:24 GMT
Furthermore, why have other recently-repaid loans not had the same amount withheld? I'm not in the other relevant loans but 2 other loans have paid back c.98%, correct me if i'm wrong. They either weren’t in default or refinanced for the full amount owed and repaid in full meaning accrued/penalty interest weren’t applicable or due to Lendy Ltd. This situation would mostly affect loans in default for a considerable period of time as serious (alleged) fees would have racked up.
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Monetus
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Post by Monetus on Oct 30, 2019 18:01:18 GMT
Someone please tell me that out of any recovery made by the administrator none of that will go to LB? Considering he has not lost a penny but made millions already, there is something that makes my insides turn at the thought he will continue to profit The "Joint Administrators' Proposals" published on July 15 include "Lendy Group Limited" (which is somehow not in administration) as claiming to be owed £800,000.00.
Presumably the members of the creditors committee have a bit more visibility of exactly why, and whether there is any legal requirement to and/or intention of honouring that debt.
Conversely, the administrators may have reason to make claims against LB, and indeed for all I know such claims may even be underway. It's not known, for example, who is expecting to receive the proceeds of the sale of Lendy's registered office / LB's home.
Anyone who knows actual details about what's going on is presumably either LB / RSM or under an NDA. You are correct.
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