ben
Posts: 2,020 
Likes: 589
|
Post by ben on Apr 5, 2017 23:05:37 GMT
If they are not now willing to share that figure with us then I would like to know why. Well it's clear you are not going to know how much is in the fund and with that in mind you have to make a decision whether or not you wish to continue to invest. The provision fund is not mandatory and it didn't exist for the first couple of years and it's not really a massive issue I think given it could clearly never cover a mass of defaults all involving losses on the scale experienced with the garden centre. Therefore it is all a bit of a red herring and slightly irrelevant is it not. If investing here is on the basis there is a gold plated provision fund that will bail out people from losses then I think those people are mistaken. Persoanlly I have never invested because of the provision fund, the provision fund is funded by lenders to begin with so I would be curious as to what happens with it.
|
|
ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
Posts: 11,329
Likes: 11,549
|
Post by ilmoro on Apr 5, 2017 23:09:13 GMT
Well it's clear you are not going to know how much is in the fund and with that in mind you have to make a decision whether or not you wish to continue to invest. The provision fund is not mandatory and it didn't exist for the first couple of years and it's not really a massive issue I think given it could clearly never cover a mass of defaults all involving losses on the scale experienced with the garden centre. Therefore it is all a bit of a red herring and slightly irrelevant is it not. If investing here is on the basis there is a gold plated provision fund that will bail out people from losses then I think those people are mistaken. Persoanlly I have never invested because of the provision fund, the provision fund is funded by lenders to begin with so I would be curious as to what happens with it. No it isnt, its funded by borrowers from the fees they pay Lendy, unless you're implying we'd get better rates without it and Ive got a hat ornament that would bet against that 
|
|
ben
Posts: 2,020
Likes: 589
|
Post by ben on Apr 5, 2017 23:13:01 GMT
Every time Lendy decide to engage with us on the forum they are subject to a multi pronged attack from forum users which drive them away again. It was obvious from Paul's first reply that he did not want to give a direct answer to the question on the forum but you don't let it go and you keep on at him and now we won't see him again for a while. Next week people will be moaning because they don't come on the forum and reply to posts! Your first point is undoubtedly true. I have been guilty of 'LfSS bashing' but I now try to desist from simple negativity and attempt to make my criticism constructive. Where there are reasons to be concerned they should be raised - but in such a way that any criticism is balanced with a constructive alternative suggestion to make their operation more 'user friendly'.
In your second point (regarding questions about the value of the PF) you state 'he [Paul] did not want to give a direct answer to the question' and that is true and perfectly observed. However, you go on to say 'but you don't let it go and you keep on at him' and, while that is also true, I ask why should we not press for an answer on this point?
If (heaven forbid) I was interviewing a politician I would hound them until I was blue in the face, trying to get them to answer such a simple question, especially a question to which the answer had been previously available, and constantly updated on-line but which has subsequently disappeared from view.
My questions to you (not to LfSS) are: - Why shouldn't we have an answer to the PF question?
- Why do you defend LfSS for removing the information from public view and now keeping it a secret?
I agree with the majority of your defences of LfSS (and have posted thus); Many posts attacking LfSS are unfounded in my opinion. However, I believe there are good reasons to hound them on this point.
Your third point is simple speculation with reasoning which cannot be proven even if the prediction turns out to be correct: it will simply fall into the 'more moaning' category which, in your opinion, is full enough already.
P.S. Many people put a lot of store in the PF. However, I (and many others before me) have stated on several occasions that investment decisions should disregard the PF. It is a red-herring, an anomaly, it is a hook to entice investors but should not be relied upon to get you out of the pond if you've invested in carp (sentence ending deliberately obscure).
Other sites provision fund takes a cut of the repayments either each month or at the end, the provision fund here is different, it is funded at the begining of the loan ie by us so to me Lendy should have to be clear on what we are funding. Until the loan is repayed it is not really there money but they appear to be using it as it is.
|
|
ben
Posts: 2,020
Likes: 589
|
Post by ben on Apr 5, 2017 23:18:22 GMT
Persoanlly I have never invested because of the provision fund, the provision fund is funded by lenders to begin with so I would be curious as to what happens with it. No it isnt, its funded by borrowers from the fees they pay Lendy, unless you're implying we'd get better rates without it and Ive got a hat ornament that would bet against that Lendy have previously stated that 2% of the loan becomes the fee to them 2% of the loan goes into the provision fund ie when we raise money the borrower does not recieve every penny that is raised. Then when (if) the loan is repaid Lendy are able to take that 2% out if the provision fund is at 2% of the loan book (which is it not now). So without it we would not get better rates, Lendy would just get the extra 2% profit on day 1.
|
|
twoheads
Member of DD Central
Programming
Posts: 1,089
Likes: 1,192
|
Post by twoheads on Apr 5, 2017 23:18:57 GMT
Other sites provision fund takes a cut of the repayments either each month or at the end, the provision fund here is different, it is funded at the begining of the loan ie by us so to me Lendy should have to be clear on what we are funding. Until the loan is repayed it is not really there money but they appear to be using it as it is. I refer you to the post of ilmoro, a couple above.
|
|
ben
Posts: 2,020
Likes: 589
|
Post by ben on Apr 5, 2017 23:24:19 GMT
Other sites provision fund takes a cut of the repayments either each month or at the end, the provision fund here is different, it is funded at the begining of the loan ie by us so to me Lendy should have to be clear on what we are funding. Until the loan is repayed it is not really there money but they appear to be using it as it is. I refer you to the post of ilmoro , a couple above. Lendy have previously stated the money is withheld at the start of the loan like the interest is.
|
|
twoheads
Member of DD Central
Programming
Posts: 1,089
Likes: 1,192
|
Post by twoheads on Apr 5, 2017 23:33:26 GMT
Lendy have previously stated the money is withheld at the start of the loan like the interest is. Lendy publish the loan amount and the investors fund the loan amount.
Lendy charge a commission to the borrowers (unseen by the investors) for their services; this forms part of Lendy's profit.
Lendy optionally add a proportion of their commission to the PF.
Lendy optionally use the PF when loans go bad.
The money in the PF is not the investor's money by right, especially now that we are lending direct to borrowers rather than to SS, the middle man.
As I keep on repeating... forget the PF... it's a red herring... do not make investment decisions in which the letters 'PF' make an appearance: it will let you down eventually.
|
|
fasty
Member of DD Central
Posts: 1,038
Likes: 388
|
Post by fasty on Apr 5, 2017 23:39:18 GMT
"Do not despair!
For I have some small savings carefully harvested from my weekly allowance, set aside against my frail old age.
By lucky haps, it is just over a thousand, methinks, and for years has been hidden beyond the wit of any thief, in an old sock..."
|
|
ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
Posts: 11,329
Likes: 11,549
|
Post by ilmoro on Apr 5, 2017 23:45:19 GMT
No it isnt, its funded by borrowers from the fees they pay Lendy, unless you're implying we'd get better rates without it and Ive got a hat ornament that would bet against that Lendy have previously stated that 2% of the loan becomes the fee to them 2% of the loan goes into the provision fund ie when we raise money the borrower does not recieve every penny that is raised. Then when (if) the loan is repaid Lendy are able to take that 2% out if the provision fund is at 2% of the loan book (which is it not now). So without it we would not get better rates, Lendy would just get the extra 2% profit on day 1. Ok, I see your point. I slightly misinterpreted what you were saying. Apologies.
|
|
ilmoro
Member of DD Central
'Wondering which of the bu***rs to blame, and watching for pigs on the wing.' - Pink Floyd
Posts: 11,329
Likes: 11,549
|
Post by ilmoro on Apr 5, 2017 23:47:38 GMT
"Do not despair! For I have some small savings carefully harvested from my weekly allowance, set aside against my frail old age. By lucky haps, it is just over a thousand, methinks, and for years has been hidden beyond the wit of any thief, in an old sock..." Lets hope the next line but one is never cited.
|
|
mikes1531
Member of DD Central
Posts: 6,453
Likes: 2,320
|
Post by mikes1531 on Apr 6, 2017 4:13:07 GMT
If they are not now willing to share that figure with us then I would like to know why. Therefore it is all a bit of a red herring and slightly irrelevant is it not. As long as Lendy continue to describe the PF in the way that they do on the website, its contents are not the least bit irrelevant. They have stated that their goal is to have the PF contain 2% of the loan book value, and they explain how it might be used to mitigate some portion of losses incurred. They are using it as a reason why people should want to invest with Lendy. If it turned out that the cupboard actually was bare, then they would have engaged in a rather misleading promotion. ISTM that regulators generally would not condone such a practice and could come down hard on the platform for it if it were to occur. To the extent that criticism and/or fines from the regulator could threaten the viability of the platform -- and that would affect all investors, whether or not they put much reliance on the PF -- it's essential for the platform to be more transparent in order to avoid such a possibility. Lendy saying that they have a PF but refusing to disclose its contents is not being transparent at all and will, I suspect, end up being a negative for the platform. For their sake -- and mine -- I wish they'd abandon that position. If the glass is half full at the moment, just say so, indicate what they're doing to refill it, and move on.
|
|
r1200gs
Member of DD Central
Posts: 1,336
Likes: 1,883
|
Post by r1200gs on Apr 6, 2017 5:38:00 GMT
It's no wonder LfSS don't want to participate in the boards when the answers the only answers they choose to give damage investor confidence in the platform. For those who re saying we should be nice to them so they come here more, I suggest they do get real. We have to be nice and not ask difficult questions?
Even if you have wisely taken the PF out of your own decision to invest on the basis it can't be relied on to bail you out, it's still a factor that effects the viability of the platform and all investors for good reasons already gone through on the thread.
The bottom line is a platform with hundreds of thousands of my money is effectively saying "trust me" while at the same time is not being honest with me and I don't know how deep that dishonesty runs. We already know that important and pertinent information is being withheld from investors being told to do their own due diligence, the amount in the PF just being one of them.
We don't need the reports that LfSS have because they know what they are doing, while lending to borrowers with criminal records and life long histories of scamming and pulling the wool over the eyes of much bigger boys than LfSS, but it's all good because we have a provision fund that is a big selling point for SS, but it may well be empty? They are not telling us if it is or not.
There will be a bit more on the SM this morning.
|
|
|
|
Post by meledor on Apr 6, 2017 7:10:11 GMT
I am completely happy not knowing the amount in the provision fund.
The fund is discretionary and should not be a factor in lending decisions. Lendy has 2% of the loan book in the provision fund but after a payout the timing of any topping up of the fund back to 2% is also discretionary. This has always been the case.
Lendy explain this on the website and so are being transparent.
I have never been a fan of provision funds. Lendy's is small but judging by the confusion and seeming reliance on it I think it is more trouble than it is worth.
|
|
bababill
Member of DD Central
Posts: 529
Likes: 245
|
Post by bababill on Apr 6, 2017 7:29:54 GMT
Lendy has 2% of the loan book in the provision fund but after a payout the timing of any topping up of the fund back to 2% is also discretionary. This has always been the case.
Actually this has not always been the case. "The Provision Fund will be maintained with ‘ at least’ 2% of the running loan book at any time in a separate bank account from Lendy Ltd’s operational account." See lendy.co.uk/documents/newstructure.pdf
|
|
r1200gs
Member of DD Central
Posts: 1,336
Likes: 1,883
|
Post by r1200gs on Apr 6, 2017 7:46:32 GMT
I am completely happy not knowing the amount in the provision fund.
The fund is discretionary and should not be a factor in lending decisions. Lendy has 2% of the loan book in the provision fund but after a payout the timing of any topping up of the fund back to 2% is also discretionary. This has always been the case.
Lendy explain this on the website and so are being transparent.
I have never been a fan of provision funds. Lendy's is small but judging by the confusion and seeming reliance on it I think it is more trouble than it is worth. The PF (and lack of information about it) absolutely SHOULD be a factor in any lenders decision to invest on this platform, if you think it will cover your loans or not. Lendy are NOT being transparent when they stop us seeing how much that fund is worth and won't tell us what it's worth, and yet still use it as a marketing tool. If you think that the only reason people are complaining about not being able to know how much is in it because they are the ones relying on it covering their asps in the case of default, think again. The lack of transparency from this platform is worrying in itself, but what do you think happens to the platform when there is another substantial shortfall to lenders that the PF can't cover? If you think that won't effect you because you were not relying on the PF personally, best think again.
|
|
