TheDriver
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Post by TheDriver on Apr 13, 2017 5:46:02 GMT
Despite the FAQ saying minimum investment is £1k, I have just discovered that it is actually £5k on the account-creation form. So (perhaps understandably) changes have been implemented before the 31 May date quoted. Might just be worth checking no other updates take place early !?!
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gnasher
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Post by gnasher on Apr 13, 2017 5:57:11 GMT
.... 4k added. Rate of deployment of capital is running at just over £2000 per month, not many slices of £80 (max at 2%) dealt out..... The rate of deployment is constrained by the volume of loans not the value. So regardless if you invest £5k,£50k or £500k you would be at a similar percentage deployment - e.g. half way though. Our fee is only charged on deployed capital, so if it's not deployed and earning you a return then there is no fee. Indeed that is what I expected when I joined up. However what changed my view is (as I said) that not many of my allocations were for the full £80 that I could have expected as 2% of 4000. So if an allocation was say £70 (many were) I assumed that I would still have got £70 regardless of how much money I had invested. If that is not the case I need to understand things better. So can we be clear on this one please stevefindlay , if I had 40k in my account instead of 4k, would a £70 allocation still be £70, or would it be £700, or something else? Your point that I would be "half way though" regardless indicates that it would indeed be £700. Is this true and how exactly is an individual loan allocation calculated?
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stub8535
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Post by stub8535 on Apr 13, 2017 6:25:08 GMT
Interesting point gnasher. I am in the process of moving from 2% fully invested to 1%. Whilst on 2% I had allocations in proportionate to my total invested and percentage chosen. Recently I have had several allocations that dont fit the pattern. I would be interested to see Steves response.
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Post by stevefindlay on Apr 13, 2017 6:31:01 GMT
gnasher stub8535 - your allocation size is a function of the total amount of money you have on the platform, and your investment setting: - if you have £1,000 and 1% then your loan sizes are £10 - if you have £10,000 and 1% then your loan sizes are £100 - if you have £100,000 and 2% then your loan size is £2,000 Etc We typically take loan positions of £75k-£100k. Which is why there is plenty of value available, but you would only get one position (at your loan size) in each loan.
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Post by stevefindlay on Apr 13, 2017 6:33:24 GMT
Despite the FAQ saying minimum investment is £1k, I have just discovered that it is actually £5k on the account-creation form. So (perhaps understandably) changes have been implemented before the 31 May date quoted. Might just be worth checking no other updates take place early !?! We are rolling out the changes to the copy on our website etc over the coming days. The increased minimum will impact new clients immediately. Existing clients have until 31 July regarding the minimums. As per the emails. The revised fee structure will kick in on 31 May. As per the notification email. There are no other changes.
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stub8535
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Post by stub8535 on Apr 13, 2017 6:50:01 GMT
gnasher stub8535 - your allocation size is a function of the total amount of money you have on the platform, and your investment setting: - if you have £1,000 and 1% then your loan sizes are £10 - if you have £10,000 and 1% then your loan sizes are £100 - if you have £100,000 and 2% then your loan size is £2,000 Etc We typically take loan positions of £75k-£100k. Which is why there is plenty of value available, but you would only get one position (at your loan size) in each loan. Thanks for the quick respone Steve. You did not explain the very small proportion loans that went through. Could you clarify what happened please?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2017 7:24:18 GMT
gnasher stub8535 - your allocation size is a function of the total amount of money you have on the platform, and your investment setting: - if you have £1,000 and 1% then your loan sizes are £10 - if you have £10,000 and 1% then your loan sizes are £100 - if you have £100,000 and 2% then your loan size is £2,000 Etc We typically take loan positions of £75k-£100k. Which is why there is plenty of value available, but you would only get one position (at your loan size) in each loan. Thanks for the quick respone Steve. You did not explain the very small proportion loans that went through. Could you clarify what happened please? Is the question being asked and re-asked here really why someone was issued with a £70 loan part as opposed to an £80 loan part?
I'm starting to see why stevefindlay feels the need to increase fees to continue full dialogue with all platform users ........
If I promise to ask no questions and let you get on with things can I still pay 1% Steve ?? (I can see the irony that I've just asked him a question )
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gnasher
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Post by gnasher on Apr 13, 2017 7:29:19 GMT
gnasher stub8535 - your allocation size is a function of the total amount of money you have on the platform, and your investment setting: - if you have £1,000 and 1% then your loan sizes are £10 - if you have £10,000 and 1% then your loan sizes are £100 - if you have £100,000 and 2% then your loan size is £2,000 Etc We typically take loan positions of £75k-£100k. Which is why there is plenty of value available, but you would only get one position (at your loan size) in each loan. That does not match my experience at all. To repeat for the sake of clarity I have £4k on the platform and I have my investment setting at 2%. So if the above was true all my allocations would be £80. See the attached screenshot for the reality. i.e. only one allocation of £80 out of 14. So if there is indeed plenty available stevefindlay , why am I getting allocations as low as £20 when I should be getting £80? Sorry to bog you down with more questions but this seems to me to be fundamental to my satisfaction and further investment in this platform. Some time ago I had decided to add more funds in order to get higher allocations, but when I realised that such a high proportion of my allocations were less than the 2% I had asked for I did not add further funds as I assumed allocation was constrained high lender demand, as we see on many other platforms. If it is not then what is limiting it, why am I not getting £80 every time?
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stub8535
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Post by stub8535 on Apr 13, 2017 7:31:34 GMT
jester. No. My reasked question is why am I allocated less than £100 when my normal allocation is many multiples of that with no change in funds on account. I do agree with your overall message though.
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ben
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Post by ben on Apr 13, 2017 8:03:20 GMT
Steve, you have pretty much answered every other question on here but you have not really stated why you are not willing to keep old customers that have helped you grow. I understand you do not want new smaller customers and can accept that and can understand your reasoning behind this, however I do not see the reason why current investors can not stay if they wish? and also what is then to stop you in 6 months deciding you only want customers abover £10,000 etc.
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TheDriver
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Post by TheDriver on Apr 13, 2017 8:47:14 GMT
Despite the FAQ saying minimum investment is £1k, I have just discovered that it is actually £5k on the account-creation form. So (perhaps understandably) changes have been implemented before the 31 May date quoted. Might just be worth checking no other updates take place early !?! We are rolling out the changes to the copy on our website etc over the coming days.
But it appears to have put the cart before the horse!
My point was the email said the changes - specifically including the new minimums - were scheduled for introduction on 31 May, and up until 2 days ago your ads on here were saying £1k minimum investment. Therefore that email did not in fact provide transparency of advance warning for half of the changes noted, as claimed!
The revised fee structure will kick in on 31 May. As per the notification email. There are no other changes
Thanks for the reassurance
I fully comprehend the rationale for change, and of course given the appropriate notice it is perfectly reasonable for a business to do so. However, in this case there are several aspects which don't stack up:
1. The increase in minimum investment has been implemented in an apparently unplanned way eg. inappropriate ads, anomalous FAQ info and inaccurate guidance; 2. With a (relatively) new platform and little track record, many investors are likely to start small to assess performance - especially allied to the cash drag implications. 3. The decision to change the terms of EXISTING accounts so dramatically and quickly is unsettling - I can see little justification for not allowing a more phased approach.
Overall, the changes seems to be unnecessarily rushed and unappreciative of some pioneer investors. The suddenness of the transition itself gives rise to some potential unease . . . . .
Please note that I am not requesting or requiring any justification, just wanted to express my opinion !
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Post by stevefindlay on Apr 13, 2017 8:56:33 GMT
gnasher stub8535 - your allocation size is a function of the total amount of money you have on the platform, and your investment setting: - if you have £1,000 and 1% then your loan sizes are £10 - if you have £10,000 and 1% then your loan sizes are £100 - if you have £100,000 and 2% then your loan size is £2,000 Etc We typically take loan positions of £75k-£100k. Which is why there is plenty of value available, but you would only get one position (at your loan size) in each loan. That does not match my experience at all. To repeat for the sake of clarity I have £4k on the platform and I have my investment setting at 2%. So if the above was true all my allocations would be £80. See the attached screenshot for the reality. i.e. only one allocation of £80 out of 14. So if there is indeed plenty available stevefindlay , why am I getting allocations as low as £20 when I should be getting £80? View AttachmentSorry to bog you down with more questions but this seems to me to be fundamental to my satisfaction and further investment in this platform. Some time ago I had decided to add more funds in order to get higher allocations, but when I saw that such a high proportion of my allocation were less than the 2% I had asked for I did not add further funds as I assumed allocation was constrained by demand, as we see on many other platforms. If it is not then what is limiting it? Because we implemented a maximum of 0.5% for certain loans - Eg. Invoice discounting loans.
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Post by stevefindlay on Apr 13, 2017 9:38:22 GMT
Steve, you have pretty much answered every other question on here but you have not really stated why you are not willing to keep old customers that have helped you grow. I understand you do not want new smaller customers and can accept that and can understand your reasoning behind this, however I do not see the reason why current investors can not stay if they wish? and also what is then to stop you in 6 months deciding you only want customers abover £10,000 etc. We have ~200-250 clients with £1,500 or less. We are grateful for every client that has chosen to place their hard earned funds with BondMason. In the interests of transparency: In: - Our fee each year is £15 for each client with £1,500 (or £22.50 in the new fee structure) Out: - On average, we communicate with each client 3-4 times a year. This is typically a couple of email exchanges and 1-2 calls of 30mins-1 hour each - It costs us £2.50 to conduct AML / KYC on each client - There is a cost associated with each deposit and withdrawal each client makes - [There is also a cost to acquire each client, but that is a sunk cost for existing clients so irrelevant here] So you can see that the cost of servicing clients below a certain level of capital deployed is simply uneconomic based on the actual level of client servicing that has been required (we lose money at the gross margin level as a business on all of these clients - regardless of whether they are existing or new). In the thread above we shared the options open to us to enable us to continue to service as many clients as possible, which culminated in the £5k min and fee change. Our revised fee structure should enable us to retain the £5k minimum forever after. I understand the frustration of existing clients, and if there was a way we could sensibly keep everyone, we would. I think they only way would be to offer an alternative product - a black box rather than a transparent box - which gives rise to the potential for fewer questions. But we aren't in a position to do this today.
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adrianc
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Post by adrianc on Apr 13, 2017 10:17:07 GMT
stevefindlay - can I ask roughly how many <£5k clients there are, and roughly what proportion of the total client base they represent?
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gnasher
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Post by gnasher on Apr 13, 2017 10:30:07 GMT
That does not match my experience at all. To repeat for the sake of clarity I have £4k on the platform and I have my investment setting at 2%. So if the above was true all my allocations would be £80. See the attached screenshot for the reality. i.e. only one allocation of £80 out of 14. So if there is indeed plenty available stevefindlay , why am I getting allocations as low as £20 when I should be getting £80? Sorry to bog you down with more questions but this seems to me to be fundamental to my satisfaction and further investment in this platform. Some time ago I had decided to add more funds in order to get higher allocations, but when I saw that such a high proportion of my allocation were less than the 2% I had asked for I did not add further funds as I assumed allocation was constrained by demand, as we see on many other platforms. If it is not then what is limiting it? Because we implemented a maximum of 0.5% for certain loans - Eg. Invoice discounting loans. Ah ha - thanks - now we have it! So all allocations are a % of your capital on the platform UP TO your limit of either 1% or 2%, and presumably everyone gets the same % up to their limit. The thing that has not been made clear is that a majority of the allocations are scaled back, especially for those on 2%. In my own case I have had 52 loan allocations and of these only 12 (23%) are for £80 (my 2% limit) - 20 at £70, 12 at £20 etc. I can now see how your assertion that I would be 50% deployed after a month, regardless of the amount that I had on the platform, is true. That is very helpful - thank you. I think this should be made much clearer to your members. I have seen several references to people waiting till they get near to 100% deployed before adding new money, however if you want to get a sizeable amount in BM it may be better to bite the bullet, add your target amount, and suffer the cash drag for a month or two. At least we can make our own decisions if we understand how it works. There is nothing about this in the FAQs - I suggest there should be.
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